.35 Remington(short) or .460 s&w?

[Lon371]

  Our firearms deer season is over. And Christmas is coming. Indiana is going to let us use brass length of 1.80".  I can not afford to buy a bolt action then rebarrel. All said and done that would run around $1000 with accessories. So I have narrowed it down to .35 Rem(trimmed brass) and .460 s&w. Both of these will be a challenge since I can not run down to the gun dealer and pick them up. But I can get the barrels .35 and .45(rechamber). It looks like the .460 has 2-300 more fps velocity.
 
 Question is which will shoot to 150 yards accurately? So I guess does anyone have actual experiance with the Handis and these calibers? And final question, why are H&R .35 rem's not on Indiana shelfs? Its the only one not readily avalable.
 
Thanks for your help.
 
Lonny

[woodchukhntr]

Please explain the brass length limitations.  Is this the maximum or minimum length of the brass?  Why would you have to rebarrel a bolt action?

[Lon371]

 Indiana reg is .357 bullet and bigger, cartrigde maxmum length is changing to max length of 1.80". Can be bottle neck or straight.
 
 I mentioned rebarreling, because that is where all the wildcat rounds for Indiana are going. Example is the .358wssm. The folks puting out the barrels are saying only for Bolt guns and Encore.I assume chamber pressure issues .         
 
Lonny

[keith44]

Indiana changes their regulations faster than I change barrels, this seasons regs were for pistol calibers of .357" and over.  If they have not dropped the pistol caliber language I would suggest either the .500 S&W, the .460 S&W, the .357 maxi (magnum re-chambered), or a plain ole .44 mag, just have to back off to 125 yards instead of your 150 yard distance for the .44 and maybe the .500.

[Spanky]

I'm pretty sure a deer shot at 150yds with a 44 or 500 is a dead deer.
 
 
 
Spanky

[wganz]

My initial gut reaction is to look at the .357 Herrett. It is .357" bore and an OAL of 1.75".  Look at having a .357 Magnum barrel rechambered for it. Not sure if the twist rate would be optimum but would be a lot cheaper than rebarreling a bolt gun.


ETA: Midway has brass listed:
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/970636/quality-cartridge-reloading-brass-357-herrett-box-of-20

[quickdtoo]

35 Remington Short!! 

Tim

[manatee1947]

In case you havent looked yet, there is a 500 on the classified page right now. If you cant find a 35 Rem, I would go with a 500.

[Default_Required]

Lon couple weekends ago Checking in with a local pawn shop to me they had two new Handis with the real nice new camo patern on that matte black in 35 rem and 44 mag..

[tobster]

What's wrong with a Marlin lever in .35 Remington ?  I have never tried to cycle the .35"short" but you could always load them individually. In Indiana rifle calibers like 30-30,.35 Remington, 45-70 and a bunch of others are legal in handguns only. Handgun calibers with restrictions on bore and brass length are legal in rifles. Next year the new regs will allow a handgun cartridge with a maximum length of 1.80 , an increase from this years 1.65.  Go figure.......

[ratdog]

move to another state that ones messed up.

[keith44]

IMO there are several states with well intentioned, but bad laws on the books.  Better to fix what you can where you live.

[Lon371]

What's wrong with a Marlin lever in .35 Remington ?  I have never tried to cycle the .35"short" but you could always load them individually. In Indiana rifle calibers like 30-30,.35 Remington, 45-70 and a bunch of others are legal in handguns only. Handgun calibers with restrictions on bore and brass length are legal in rifles. Next year the new regs will allow a handgun cartridge with a maximum length of 1.80 , an increase from this years 1.65.  Go figure.......

 Just for the record, I keep seeing referrences to pistol bullet rifles, and handgun cartidge rifles, and pistol caliber rifles. Those words are no longer used in the regulation. It was dropped last year.
 
 Thanks for the replys. I am going to try finding a .357 barrel for a rechamber. And keep an eye out for a .35 rem.
 
Thanks
Lonny

[srussell]

you could also cut a 45-70 brass down to legal 1.80 seat the bullet out  longer. and have a very capable 150 yard gun. im not sure what the short Hornady brass is

[blind ear]

In Mississippi the main push for centerfire rifles was from tree farmers to keep the total deer pipulation down to cut the loss of little pine tree. ear

[tobster]

What's wrong with a Marlin lever in .35 Remington ?  I have never tried to cycle the .35"short" but you could always load them individually. In Indiana rifle calibers like 30-30,.35 Remington, 45-70 and a bunch of others are legal in handguns only. Handgun calibers with restrictions on bore and brass length are legal in rifles. Next year the new regs will allow a handgun cartridge with a maximum length of 1.80 , an increase from this years 1.65.  Go figure.......

" Just for the record, I keep seeing referrences to pistol bullet rifles, and handgun cartidge rifles, and pistol caliber rifles. Those words are no longer used in the regulation. It was dropped last year. "
 
 Thanks for the replys. I am going to try finding a .357 barrel for a rechamber. And keep an eye out for a .35 rem.
 
Thanks
Lonny
"

        "  Allows a rifle cartridge to have a maximum case length of 1.8 inches instead of 1.625 inches   "- No matter what you want to call it, wouldn't it be easier to trim a case than ream a chamber?

[Default_Required]

Lon if you like I can call up to the shop I mentioned tomorrow and see if they still have that 35 Rem. handi rifle available, think they were asking $300 for it , and after shipping and FFL BS it might be cost prohibitive to go that route... Let me know brother .
 
 
   DR

[Lon371]

Lon if you like I can call up to the shop I mentioned tomorrow and see if they still have that 35 Rem. handi rifle available, think they were asking $300 for it , and after shipping and FFL BS it might be cost prohibitive to go that route... Let me know brother .

Thank you sir. I would love to have it, but I am only in the hoping stages. Actually waiting till Christmas is over. Then see what kind of toy moneys I have.
 
 I really appreciate the offer though.
 
Lonny

[Dinny]

Lonny,
  Although it's not one you mentioned, I believe it would fit your requirements (especially since you also have a 44 Mag Handi ). The .445 SM is just a 44 Mag chamber lengthened like the 357 Mag to Max. Factory ammo is not available but some custom loaders do sell it. It's performance to 200 yds is more than adequate for deer. 44 Mag ammo can still be shot in the 445 chamber and with proper throating, it might even shoot better (again, just like the Mag to Max). The only drawbacks I see are recoil and availability of brass. Recoil would be nothing compared to the .460 S&W.   There's quite a few guys here that have them, Pete and Tim come to mind first.


Here's a good article on the Supermags. Keep in mind that the velocities mentioned are most likely from a 6" barrel revolver or something similar.


http://www.sixguns.com/range/supermags.htm


http://castboolits.gunloads.com/archive/index.php/t-9670.html


That's my 2 cents worth.




Thanks, Dinny

[STUMPJMPR]

I would probably go with 500 SW, but they kick like a mule.

[quickdtoo]

Super 35 Rem Short can be an honest 250-300yd deer round. 

Tim

Trajectory for Hornady .358 dia. 180 gr. SS/PB at 2450 Feet per Second
At an Elevation Angle of: 0 degrees
Ballistic Coefficients of: 0.248   0.248   0.248   0.248   0.248
Velocity Boundaries (Feet per Second) of: 1440   1440   1440   1440
Wind Direction is: 0.0 o'clock and a Wind Velocity of: 0.0 Miles per hour
Wind Components are (Miles per Hour): DownRange: 0.0   Cross Range: 0.0   Vertical: 0.0
Altitude: 0 Feet with a Standard Atmospheric Model.
Temperature: 59 F
Data Printed in English Units
Range   Velocity   Energy   Momentum   Drop   Bullet Path   Wind Drift   Time of Flight
(Yards)   (Ft/Sec)   (Ft/Lbs)   (Lb-Sec)   (inches)   (inches)   (inches)   (Seconds)
0   2450.0   2398.7   1.96   0.0   -1.5   0.0   0.000000000
25   2364.3   2233.7   1.89   -0.19   0.28   0.0   0.031162559
50   2280.3   2077.9   1.82   -0.76   1.67   0.0   0.063463963
75   2197.9   1930.5   1.76   -1.75   2.64   0.0   0.096965349
100   2117.2   1791.3   1.69   -3.19   3.16   0.0   0.131732811
125   2038.3   1660.2   1.63   -5.12   3.2   0.0   0.167836433
150   1961.1   1536.8   1.57   -7.57   2.71   0.0   0.205350136
175   1885.7   1421.0   1.51   -10.58   1.66   0.0   0.244352090
200   1812.2   1312.4   1.45   -14.21   0.0   0.0   0.284924471
225   1740.8   1211.0   1.39   -18.5   -2.32   0.0   0.327152290
250   1671.5   1116.5   1.34   -23.5   -5.36   0.0   0.371122101
275   1604.6   1028.9   1.28   -29.28   -9.18   0.0   0.416920820
300   1540.1   947.8   1.23   -35.91   -13.85   0.0   0.464635073

[Fred McIntire]

I'd HIGHLY recommend you go with the .357 Maximum.  Its a deer hammer ! 

The time it takes to ream out the chamber is approximately 5 minutes, or less !

Fred

[JMcDonald]

Indeed, I would go with the relatively simple .45-cal pistol cartridges or a .357Max. Though, even a basic .44mag will do what you want just fine.