BROWNING ACTION

[BUSTER51]

Would a Browning A bolt action be a good platform to build a custom rifle on ? If not why ? FN(who ownes Browning)won't use this action on thier percision tactical rifles and I wonder why .2 well respected gunsmith/custom builders have told me that they are not stiff enough and said there are  many much better actions avalible and not to build on an a bolt action . Am I missing something here ?

[pastorp]

Buster51. if 2 well respected gun builders told you they are not a good action to use and you ask am I missing something here.

My question to you would be what part of there answer don't you understand. Seams pretty clear to me. You just want to build a rifle on and Abolt action. Then go ahead I'm sure you can find someone to build it for you.

Regards, Byron 

[PaulS]

The A-bolt is weaker at the barrel / bolt lock-up and the action area because of the magazine well.
The breech of the barrel is cut in front of the lugs for the integral extractor.
The magazine well is wider to accept the double stacked design.
There is less rigidity in this rifle action than in several other actions in the same length and capacity.The Remington and Weatherby actions are just two. The Mauser is still a favorite in spite of its age. There are many actions that are better for a custom rifle.
Most custom riflesmiths take a great deal of pride in being able to make a gun that is more accurate as well as more beautiful than a factory offering. They reasonably would rather start with an action that has the potential for great accuracy.
When the manufacturer and two respected rifle smiths tell you that an action is not a good choice what they are saying is they don't want to put their name on a gun that is based on that action.
Talk to your smith about the action(s) that he recommends and then go from there.

[BUSTER51]

Thanks ,Paul S that's what I wanted to know.It is not that I did not belive the custom gun builders i spoke to but they never went into detail and took the time to explain WHY the action was not the best choice . If I can scrape up the cash I want to build on a Dakota action ,any comments on it ?

[roper]

Would a Browning A bolt action be a good platform to build a custom rifle on ? If not why ? FN(who ownes Browning)won't use this action on thier percision tactical rifles and I wonder why .2 well respected gunsmith/custom builders have told me that they are not stiff enough and said there are  many much better actions avalible and not to build on an a bolt action . Am I missing something here ?

The reason Browning doesn't make a tactical rifle is FN makes them on their line of tactical rifles and shotguns if you pull up www. GunsAmerica.com you can see just about their whole line of FN tactical rifles/shotguns.
As to the double stacking mentioned.  I own a A-Bolt 300RUM and Rem 700 300RUM and I measure the height of both magazines and was no difference but since the A-bolt has a removabe magazine it's wider due to how it is made so the magazine cut out is alittle larger than a Rem 700 action.
My A-Bolt gives me appr 3/4" 3 shot groups at 100yds only thing done to that rifle has a Rick Bin paint job and trigger lighten.  I used it on a late cow hunt last year was around 18 below got my elk never had a problem with the rifle.
I talked to the gunsmith I use last year maybe about rebarreling the A-Bolt and he said McMillian is making stocks and he would rebarrel the rifle.  Well known gunsmith Mike Bryant won't work on Ruger rifles you can pull up his web page.  How the A-Bolt is faced off at the chamber is different but I've had BR rifles with different shapes at the chamber.    Alot of problems happen with the SS A-Bolt taking the barrel off they used a metric threads and some of those got damaged and the walls are thin on the action so you couldn't rethread or sleeve.  I know the A-Bolt isn't the perfect action but that wouldn't stop me from using that action.  Well good luck

[PaulS]

Roper,
I am glad that you are happy with your A-bolt. As you like it so much, would you attempt to build a rifle that is capable of groups a third the size of your present 3/4 inch groups? Would you want to guarantee that accuracy on thay action?
Those are the choices that custom riflesmiths make. Any smith would probably agree to rebarrel any action so long as the chambering was safe in that action - there are a few that would even rebarrel and rechamber in a chambering that was not safe. Be that as it may how many would build a custom on the A-bolt action.

[roper]

Roper,
I am glad that you are happy with your A-bolt. As you like it so much, would you attempt to build a rifle that is capable of groups a third the size of your present 3/4 inch groups? Would you want to guarantee that accuracy on thay action?
Those are the choices that custom riflesmiths make. Any smith would probably agree to rebarrel any action so long as the chambering was safe in that action - there are a few that would even rebarrel and rechamber in a chambering that was not safe. Be that as it may how many would build a custom on the A-bolt action.

Well Paul,   I'm not a gunsmith so I really cann't answer as to what I'd guarantee but I do have alittle knowledge in have things build and what to expect in groups.  If I was to build a new 300RUM same caliber as the A-Bolt using the A-Bolt action I would get a McMillian stock choice of barrel be a Broughton 5c 1/11 twist or a Lilja 1/11 twist 26" long 4# contour.  With a standard chamber I'd expect groups around 1/2" maybe alittle less for 3 shots.
As to who would guarantee in writng .250 groups with a 300RUM cal mag hunting rifle with a standard chamber, can happen I guess sure like to know that gunsmiths name.   I've had rifle build by Speedy,
Hammond,K&P,Kelby,Chanlyn,Dowling,Bryant,Hart and Lee Six plus others and and they have always said
subject to the action checking out and the actions I've use Browning,Sako,Ruger77,Ruger#1,Win
Rem700,Rem40x,Hall,Panda,Kodiak,Mark X,Rem X-P and I've never had one rejected but some have
taken alittle work.
One thing I've learned is I don't comment on things I don't own or shoot so when I build something it's off a rifle that I've already shot.  Had I not owned the A-Bolt I would go out and buy an A-Bolt just to build a rifle nor would I got out and buy a rem 700 just to build a rifle. 
As to what a gunsmith will and won't work on thats his business.  Since Buster51 didn't say what caliber etc kind of second guessing maybe he wanted a cal that would work.  Guys got to have alittle common sense like with the A-Bolt I've got or any action.  I'd build another 300RUM or 7RUM but would go to another action if I wanted a 30-378wby..   Your limited to certain calibers using the A-Bolt since it is a magazine fed rifle and working on them can get costly.  I sure don't want to get into a contest with you over this A-Bolt.

[PaulS]

Roper,
Didn't mean to ruffle feathers - I was just pointing out why an action might be rejected by a custom rifle builder. The rifle smith that has done work for me, including building my 358 Winchester hunting rifle builds 600 meter target rifles and when he has the time he builds custom guns. I know a few others in my area and have been turned down on projects by all of them. Sometimes I get a little crazy with an idea and just want to do it to say I've done it.
I found that the custom builders that I have talked with work with things they are comfortable with and they work on actions that will give them the results that they expect. When you conpare the strength and rigidity of actions you find a few that really stand out. If you want something really special you get a custom action made from billet. I don't have that need (spelled D E S I R E). The only professionaly built custom that I own is the one that Dan built for me and the rifle shoots better than I do. I can make .33 in diameter groups until I get tired and then they open up. Thirty years ago I might have been able to make this gun shoot the 1/4" groups I believe it is capable of shooting. (at 100 yds) It sports all of the mechanical features of a great hunting rifle and has been fine tuned for accurate shooting. He was allowed to put in all the components that he thought it needed to fill my "needs" and it works well. On my other custom guns I have done most or all the work myself and they were projects that I did to see if I could do it. They work as projected but they are not as accurate as Dan's work is but then I am a home hobbyist. I have a couple of pistols in the planning stage right now - they will be single shot "dueling" pistols with the appearance of early 1800's styling. I am going to try to make them very accurate and pretty. I plan on taking my time on them and make the details all count. I am even going to make a wood presentation case for them with velvet lining and a tray for tools. It is going to be my first attempt at making something look as good as it shoots. twin .45 Colt "dueling" pistols that I can actually shoot without hurting them or their value. This has to take a back seat to my being a minister and my teaching.

[roper]

PaulS, you didn't ruffle my feathers had you of I'd said something.  Many many years ago I read an article about Fred Huntington's new 1000yd elk rifle he developed  in a 30-338Mag wanting one I stopped at our local gunsmith and I sure got an ear full of what type action need because of strength and rigidity and he got to pricing the action and stock needed was almost like buying a house so didn't have the rifle build.  Back then I was still pretty new to having something build so I believe him  shortly after Rem came out with a 40x in 30-338 Mag.
I've had Br rifles build on custom actions only because they offer more options like left bolt right port and you can have a Rem action rework that would give the same groups as a custom action.   
I had  a Forbes ULA 338-06AI model 24 with a Douglas barrel gave just under 1/2" for 3 shots and that rifle with scope weighted 6 1/2 lbs you take stock,rings and scope off that a barreled action alittle over 4 lbs also look at Banser light weight rifles were is the rigidity and strength.  I know the Forbes rifle does increase with weight as you go up in calibers but that is mainly due to the lenght of the case and he has been building those type rifle for over 20yrs.  My Forbes rifle is now a 280AI with a Kreiger barrel have to do a special contour to match the barrel channel just got the barrel broke in and look like might be around .3's with afew match bullets was less.
Myself I'm more concerned with a good chamber job than anything.  Let see I've got afew tight neck  6ppc rifles build on a Hall,Rem 700,Rem40x,Sako,Sleeved X-P,Mini Mauser and Ruger #1 actions be surprised at the groups with those rifles.  Good thing we can agree to disagree and be civil.