Amazed at a 7mm WSM's results

[SuperstitionCoues]

In November of 2004 I received a Win Model 70 Featherweight 7mm WSM as a graduation gift from my wife.  She topped it with a Leupold VXII 3X9 scope w/ Leupold rings.

I had to wait forever to test or develop any loads, due to health issues, two surgeries and healing up enough to be able to get out and do this. Not feeling "right" about shooting the rifle until I had received my diploma, I went ahead and had it fitted with a Limbsaver recoil pad (I hated to cut that beautiful, tiger-striped stock!) and a muzzlebrake from Williams gunsmithing services - I didn't want to end up back in the hospital from shooting it.  I was finally able to graduate with my Masters of Science in Environmental Resources this May I started on my Ph.D. (a nutritional and metabolic study of a local deer herd) last January, and after a long vacation, I'm going back to the lab on Thursday, but I digress...), so this month, it was time to take the gun out and see what it could do.  

With a Winchester LRM primer and 62.7 grains of IMR 4350 under a 140 gr. Sierra Boattail, the rifle delivered a 0.54 inch, 3-shot group.  

Using a the same WLRM primer, 61 grains of H4350 EXT and a 160 grain Sierra Hollow-Point Boattail, the rifle again delivered...
a 0.48 inch, 4-shot group.[]  This on a cement-block shooting bench that wobbled back and forth from the recoil every time I pulled the trigger (yikes! - told the range master about that one!)

Thanks for letting me ramble a bit.  Guess I feel like I really have accomplished something today, and this semester.  The recoil pad and muzzlebrake work very well, but by the end of the day I still felt "thumped" pretty well inside my chest where the work was done.  I would recommend either the Limbsaver or Williams Guide Series muzzlebrake to anyone who has issues with recoil.

I think I have a really good mule deer or elk rifle here.  So, I'm wondering... are these results really typical of a 7 WSM?

[Zachary]

Coues,

First off, congratulation on your educational achievements.  I myself have 4 advanced degrees, so I know all of the hard work that goes into it.

Now let's talk about your load.  I sure hope that you do not intend on using that bullet for hunting.  Those hollow-point bullets are very accurate, and yes, some people do use them for hunting big game, but I do not advocate it.  Those bullets are generally prone to fall apart upon any impact greater than a lung shot.

Have you tried any other bullets?

Zachary

[SuperstitionCoues]

Zachary,

No, I have not tried any others yet.  These are the first loads that I worked up and first results that I have for the rifle.  I had heard rumers about Sierras having that reputation, but I didn't know that it extended to the hollow-points.  I do try for lung-shots, but hey, yardage is yardage and as I am sure you know, a bench rest is no substitute for the field.  "Field" can be a simile for an increase in error factors.

I have been thinking about developing loads for Hornady's 139 gr. Interlock and Interbond, as I can save $ in load development by using the Interlock, and then substitute the Interbond with minor tweaking (this has worked for my .25-06 and .30-06).  What would you suggest?  I am open to ideas.

And, thank you for the congratulations!

[nomosendero]

Congrats are in order for getting you degree, but even more important is that your Health is improving & you have a good Woman with good taste!!

Concerning the 7WSM, I have heard many good reports. I am considering
a 7WSM Coyote, I don't need it, but it is appealing. The 7 came out in the shadow of the 270WSM & even though it offers great bullets, it may not survive, while no doubt the 300 & 270WSM will. But, for the reloader that is not a big deal & later a person could screw on one of the other barrels anyway.

[SuperstitionCoues]

Coues,

Now let's talk about your load.  I sure hope that you do not intend on using that bullet for hunting.  Those hollow-point bullets are very accurate, and yes, some people do use them for hunting big game, but I do not advocate it.  Those bullets are generally prone to fall apart upon any impact greater than a lung shot.

Zachary

FYI-

I did some checking with Sierra...

In the situation that you referenced in another thread by Zachary (e.g. a 55 gr. bullet into an animal at 50 yds.) I think that any bullet (bonded or not) would deflagrate and shatter, as you described.  

My opinion is (note how I stated that, I don't have any data to support the following) that at a reasonable range in Arizona - meaning long and uninterrupted by obstructions - a 7mm Sierra 140 gr. or 160 gr Boat tail, soft point or hollow point will serve my needs adequately on a mule deer, Coues whitetail, elk or antelope.  

Winchester PowerPoints and Remington Corelockts penetrated and expanded adequately before I began hand-loading, and I'm not seeing a whole lot of difference in bullet design between these and the offerings of Sierra.  In fact, in Remington's 280 Remington offerings, there is a hollow-point design that is similar to Sierra's 160 gr. HPBT.  If the bullet fragments - fine.  It will have still penetrated, but with more particles to destroy the lungs and the heart.  I pick shot out of my quail and doves after I get them, and it wouldn't be so different regarding venison.

Tell you what I will do, though.  After I shoot the deer, and it's lying there dead as a door nail on the desert floor as I begin to field dress it, I'll ask it if it minded being shot with a typical bullet or if it would have preferred a more expensive, designer bullet as it succumbed to a sudden overdose of essential elements - copper and lead.   I think we get too hung up on new technology.  My 50 cal lead round ball Hawken will also have the same end result as a "designer" bullet.

[nomosendero]

I don't see the big deal on these bullets if that is what you want to use,
especially on all of the animals listed except Elk. And they both will sure
do in an Elk also, I would just be a little careful about quartering shots, esp. if quartering toward you & up close, which sounds like in your case will be the exception rather than the rule. And S.C., like you said that is just an opinion & I use premiums sometimes for insurance for the more
difficult shots mainly because when I hunt Elk it is part of an expensive trip & the occassional edge makes it worth doing for me & sometimes I use them for other reasons, but you are right, we overblow the premium bullet thing sometimes.

Both the 140Gr. Spitzer BT & the 160 Gr. HPBT are listed as Gamekings, in fact Sierra says the following about the 160Gr. Hollow Point Boattail: "The 160 Gr. #1925 Hollow Point Boattail is a true magnum bullet, being somewhat tougher than the #1920 (160Gr. Spit. Boattail for deeper penetration. Contrary to a usual assumption, this hollow point bullet is NOT particularly fragile. The nose opening is closed slightly to help retart initial upset, but even expansion is assured by 4 skives cut into the jacket. "  Sounds good to me & the Sect. Den. of a 160 gr. is high, so if the front blows up , the shank will go on a while at least. So, according to Sierra the 160HPBT would be better for tough animals than both the
140 & 160Gr. Spitzer soft point boat tails!

If I buy that 7WSM, I may try the 160HPBT for Deer.

Good luck & good shooting!!!

[swampthing]

That gun sounds like a keeper.
          I like those Barnes TSX, triple shocks, for hunting. A 150- 160g TSX will harvest whatever you shoot on this continent, even from questionable shot angles. Blood shot meat should be a lot less than with those "quick expanding" balistic tips, especially when your up close.

[Terrill]

I finished this one up an hour ago.  I'll try your loads and see what it will do.
[/img]

[SuperstitionCoues]

I finished this one up an hour ago.  I'll try your loads and see what it will do.
[/img]

You will find my load in the most recent Sierra load manual for the 7mm WSM.

I didn't use the max load, but drop it a few percentage points anyway and start there.  The harmonics of your barrel may be very different from mine, and don't forget to watch out for pressure signs.

[gunnut69]

Coues--
I really hate to get into a word contest over bullet merits but must agree with Zac where the Sierra's are conserned.. Your reply seemed pretty nonchalant but perhaps I misread..  I've hunted for many years and from experience can tell you the bullet is the cheapest insurance you can ever buy! I have no direct experience with the WSM but do have with the 7mm RemMag, the 280 Rem and the 7x57 and the 7-08. All will drive the realtively soft 140 bullet you're using fast enough to fail... A premium bullet won't. I prefer the Partitions from Nosler. They inveriably exit and that's where blood trails come from.. I have had bullets fail. and have used soft bullets from a 7mag. the bullet a Hornaday 162 grain exploded a doe leaving tremendous tissue damage. The waste was terrible and on a lung shot!. I had a 200 grain Speer from a 300 WinMag explode on a bucks ribcage. I switched to 200 grain partitions.. I've never found one of those back but have never lacked a blood trail again! The 140 is a good weight in the 7mm but I'd bet you'd have more consistantancy with a partition bullet..and for elk a 160 would produce the additional penetration these creatures need..

[kudzu]

Try the 150 Swift Scirocco. Use in my 7rum. Very, very accurate(over 94.5 gr RL25) 5 shot groups at 100= one little ragged hole.
On game performance is perfect. Wether I hit lung at 75 yrds or drive thru both shoulders at 330 yrds. Always pass-thru which = blood (if needed). Of the 20+ deer taken with this bullet, I have yet to not have one open up for large exit wounds or to completly pass even on double shoulder shots.  Great bullet IMHO.
Will usse the 180 scirocco in my 300rum on elk this fall.

Did I say great bullet!!!!!!  ,DM