Author Topic: How about a 10mm Semi-Auto Carbine? (Read 5363 times)

papajohn428 · « **on:** June 04, 2006, 04:59:37 PM »

Am I the only one, or would anyone else like to see a 10mm Semi? Something along the lines of a 30-M-1, only beefier, gas-operated, with a 15 to 30 round mag? I've heard of a few rather pricey conversions of other guns in assorted calibers (50 Beowulf?) but I'd rather see a production gun. Add a peep sight or a Scout Scope of low power, and you have the perfect woods/deer/pig gun! Stainless/Synthetic would be a plus, light and handy, matte finish, maybe even add a rail up front for a laser or a flashlight, and you have the perfect house-clearing/entry gun. Low recoil, minimal blast compared to a short-barrelled 223 (MAN are they nasty to be around! :shock: ) and load it with anything from 135-grain HP's for human adversaries to 200-grain penetrators for toothy critters. Keep it short and light, and every pickup gun rack in America would "Need" one.

Or am I the only one who thinks so? :roll:

Papajohn

LEO · « **Reply #1 on:** June 06, 2006, 12:06:32 PM »

I had the opportunity a few years ago to shoot an H&K MP 5 chambered in 10 mm. It was a handy little sub machine gun as all the MP 5s are. The blast was not bad at all, there was practically no recoil and although we were only shooting paper and steel, there was a noticable difference in the impact on steel as opposed to the 9mm. While I have not shot anything living with the 10 mm cartridge, I have read posts on other forums about folks hog hunting with 10 mm handguns and seemed to be fairly pleased with the performance and out of a carbine it should be only better. Olympic Arms did offer a 10mm AR-15 both as a carbine or as an upper only, I am not sure if they still do or not. Also there is a company that offers a 10 mm carbine conversion for 1911 style and Glock pistols. I have no experience with either of these, I have only seen their ads. I have harvested deer with a 41 magnum handgun and was quite pleased with the performance and a 10 mm carbine should be pretty close. Hope it works out for you.

papajohn428 · « **Reply #2 on:** June 06, 2006, 02:24:00 PM »

I've seen those Carbine Conversions, they look pretty cool, if not ugly. But what a neat house gun! A few light hollow points in the mag, the rest heavy slugs for penetration. I may have to look farther into this idea.

PJ

ccoker · « **Reply #3 on:** January 14, 2007, 03:32:19 AM »

http://www.mechtechsys.com/

I would love to try one...

Hairtrigger · « **Reply #4 on:** January 14, 2007, 03:35:24 AM »

Quote from: ccoker on January 14, 2007, 03:32:19 AM

http://www.mechtechsys.com/

I would love to try one...

I have one and love it.
Stop over and you can try it as well

ccoker · « **Reply #5 on:** January 14, 2007, 08:24:19 AM »

where do you live?

glock or 1911?

Hairtrigger · « **Reply #6 on:** January 14, 2007, 08:44:06 AM »

Mine is for a 1911, I had it on my Springfield for quite awhile but since then have put it on my Delta Elite.
Has anyone tried this on a Double Eagle?
I am in Ohio

ccoker · « **Reply #7 on:** January 14, 2007, 08:48:01 AM »

cool
what ammo have you used?
accuracy?
reliabliity?

I have a Springfield 1911
what mags do you use?
capacity? and 10 rounders out there?

etc..
I am in Texas.. so, a bit far to swing by! but appreciate the offer!

Hairtrigger · « **Reply #8 on:** January 14, 2007, 09:26:44 AM »

Quote from: ccoker on January 14, 2007, 08:48:01 AM

cool
what ammo have you used?
accuracy?
reliabliity?

I have a Springfield 1911
what mags do you use?
capacity? and 10 rounders out there?

My Springfield is one of the old Linkless ones that came in 10mm. I have shot only Hornady and Norma ammo thru it besides my reloads. I have not had anything that would not feed. Never any issues there. I had a Nikon scope on it and 2" at 50 yards was no problem. I have only factory 8 rounders for it but plenty of them as I have a Double Eagle, 3 Delta Elites and the Springfield.

BattleRifleG3 · « **Reply #9 on:** February 01, 2007, 05:56:06 AM »

The MP5s in 10mm have been reported to have made aimed kill shots at some pretty impressive ranges. I'm not sure if it was 200 or 300yds, but it was something like that.

Tikker · « **Reply #10 on:** February 13, 2009, 05:12:15 PM »

I have the Olympic Arms flat top upper and have it mounted on my Cavalry Arms MKII lower, I have had it for about 2 weeks now and have yet to order a lower parts kit to complete it. One thing i don't like is the lack of stores in my area that will sell the 10mm, so at the moment I am waiting on Wideners to send my order on a Lee Cast Press and later on I'll be able to order some Bullets; Powder; Primers; and Cases.

So a few more months of saving up to finish up the list of things i need.

I can take some pictures of it later to show you guys what it's like, the magazines i have for it are the grease gun mags that hold 30 rounds of .45acp.

Here's the picture that made me buy the 10mm instead of the 45acp.

Empty Quiver · « **Reply #11 on:** February 13, 2009, 05:45:10 PM »

I've always thought it would be a great idea. How hard would it be to rechamber from 40 S&W to 10mm? Mags would or could be a problem I suppose. The worst thing about a 10mm carbine would be the cost of feeding it. I'm pretty sure ammo cost would kill sales, but I do like the idea of a Beretta Storm pistol and matching carbine in 10mm.

papajohn428 · « **Reply #12 on:** February 14, 2009, 03:25:38 AM »

Imagine my surprise at seeing this thread resuscitated after two years. The ironic part is that a friend from Chicago who's a police trainer spent yesterday afternoon with me at my range, then over dinner we were just discussing the concept of a 10mm Carbine at length!

I still think it's a good idea, and it might be enough to bring the 10mm out of semi-obscurity. With the flurry of new cartridges Hornady and a few others are bringing out, maybe what we really need is a new Carbine for the LE and home-defense market. The Ruger P4C was a good concept, but poorly executed. It needs NOT to be a blowback design, something sturdier, gas operated, and strong. The Marlin Camp Carbine and the Beretta CX4 are halfway there, but still fall short. The MP-5 is the proper execution of the idea, but not pretty enough or cheap enough for public consumption. I still need to investigate the Mech-Tech thing!

PJ

Tikker · « **Reply #13 on:** February 15, 2009, 11:18:58 AM »

Ha

, i should really keep an eye on the dates before resurrecting old threads. Anywho, here's those pics i mentioned earlier.

I repainted the hand guard to match it up with the lower i have, and decided to tape it off and throw some black on it to help break the solid pattern. Soon as i can afford some duracoat I'm gonna go over the whole gun in a Vietnam Tiger Strip.

Oldshooter · « **Reply #14 on:** June 15, 2013, 09:12:05 AM »

I was out on the WWW searching for 10 mm carbine information and found this old thread. Thought I would resurrect it and see if anyone has any new info about a 10 mm carbine.

Tikker · « **Reply #15 on:** June 15, 2013, 01:54:44 PM »

Good thing I had subscribed to this thread, I never frequent this site anymore...too many pop-up add's.

Here's a link to a post on anther site that I use where I just posted a few pics of recovered bullets. [size=78%]www.beyond556.com/bboard/showthread.php?6449-10MM-maybe&p=48898#post48898[/size]

I plan to take the rifle out deer/hog hunting this year, but want to load some all copper bullets.

Oldshooter · « **Reply #16 on:** June 15, 2013, 02:02:10 PM »

Well thanks for stopping by and posting the link to the pics, I'm hankering for a 10 mm carbine and just trying to decide which way to go.

papajohn428 · « **Reply #17 on:** June 16, 2013, 06:40:05 PM »

WOW...........seven years later, this thread still refuses to die. A lot has changed, but I still want a 10mm Carbine!

I explored the whole Mech-Tech idea, but when it came time to lay down my shekels, I opted for the 460 Rowland version with the 1911 lower. I really wanted to do The Ten but I already had a 1911 chambered in 45ACP, and didn't want to have to buy another lower. I'm not a Glock fan but a G-20 with 15-round magazines might still be the way to go! Why doesn't Glock make a 10mm Police Carbine?

In 460 Rowland I've managed to get 185-grain bullets up to a bit over 2,000 fps out of the Mech-Tech's 16 inch barrel, accuracy is VERY good, some 50-yards 5-shot groups have come in under an inch. The downside to the Mech-Tech is that it's heavy, due to the massive bolt, because it's still a blowback design. A very stout blowback design, and very well engineered, but still a blowback.

I still think a gas-operated 10mm carbine is a vacancy in the gun world that needs to be filled.

Oldshooter · « **Reply #18 on:** June 17, 2013, 02:52:10 AM »

Ha!.... I thought i could reel in some of you guys from the past on this one! I am so glad you came and posted again. That Mech tech is so interesting and if the accuracy is good, more the better. Now you may get a nasty note from my CFO(wife) about enabling me on this but its OK her bark is worse than her bite!

Would you say the extra bbl gives better bullet performance. I'm thinking it does but wondering if anyone has chronied one yet.

My interest in this is purely for brush hunting pigs and such but I'd bet one of those buggers would certainly clean up a dirty street if ya know what I mean.

Quote

Why doesn't Glock make a 10mm Police Carbine?

No kidding, or somebody!

Thanks for posting!

papajohn428 · « **Reply #19 on:** June 17, 2013, 06:50:06 AM »

Oldshooter, the problem with the 460 Rowland is that there aren't that many .451" bullets designed for the velocities achievable with the carbine barrel. I've tried Noslers in 185 and 230 grain flavors, but they just aren't made to go that fast, and while there is still a cup-and-core bullet left to recover, there's a lot of lead missing. I'm sure it would be devastating on a lung-shot deer, but for frontal shots on a boar I'd want something more stoutly constructed.......a cast bullet with a fairly large nose flat would seem a VERY good idea.

Back to the 10mm in a carbine, the problem is the same, not many bullets designed for velocities past 1400 fps. Rifle bullets might work better, but then you run into issues with OAL and velocity thresholds. A FMJ or cast bullet might be the best idea for pigs, for deer a Hornady XTP-SP might be just the ticket, but I haven't tested any.

I'm basing most of my conjecture on the fact that a .357" bullet from a Marlin Carbine does right well on deer if a soft-point bullet is used, but the hollow-points at 1800 fps tend to be somewhat fragile. A 180-grain HP out of a 16" 10mm carbine would do a lot of jobs well, but might still be a bit light on pigs with frontal shots.

On Homonid or Zombie targets, I'll take the HP's every time. Humans and deer aren't that hard to stop, given decent shot placement.

Oldshooter · « **Reply #20 on:** June 17, 2013, 07:35:43 AM »

I was thinking of some of these 200gr. WFNGC for the 10mm.

They might be what a fellow could use on porky, ya reckon.

That 460 rowland carbine is very interesting, so many guns so little time! a big hard cast flatnose or fmj might be the ticket.

Bugflipper · « **Reply #21 on:** June 17, 2013, 10:30:14 AM »

At work we used to have mp5s in 10mm. I loved the power and accuracy of it but heck I couldn't even offord a 9mm clone of an mp5 back then. I ended up with a Ron Williams (RMW) D-1 upper about 10 years ago. It just takes grease gun mags and holds 33 rounds. I think the mags were 2 or 3 bucks a piece. It has been a good little deer rifle the few times I used it. Plenty of power for woods hunting and accurate just like any run of the mill AR. I had to make my own magazine limiter out of a piece of wood to hunt with it. I've only taken a few deer with it though. Most of the time it's just been a home defense rifle. I imagine he still fools around with them. Back then Olympic wasn't a very good company. He was in line with what an upper would be from them and you got a quality product. I've heard Oly has gotten better over the years, still wont buy one though. They had the ability to produce a good product back then it just wasn't a tight market so they didn't have to. Today with just about everyone making an AR producing a decent product now they are forced to as well or they'd be out of business.

Graybeard · « **Reply #22 on:** November 27, 2019, 05:20:57 AM »

Let's bring this one back up and see if folks might want to talk more about it.

Bob Riebe · « **Reply #23 on:** January 24, 2020, 10:56:27 AM »

I have looked and looked but twenty some years ago, there was an online article about a gunsmith who converted .30/M-1s to shoot a .375 Wildcat that was based on a common cartridge.
I have looked for years, including in print books on wildcats and have not been able to find it again.
I do remember it had a great review.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #24 on:** January 25, 2020, 12:15:24 AM »

high point is making a 10mm carbine now.