Author Topic: Starting from a blank to build a custom (Read 710 times)

hobbyist · « **on:** January 22, 2005, 07:02:47 AM »

Guys,

What do you think about purchasing a quality blank at your favorite caliber (at a good price if you can find it) like Lilja, Hart, Shilen, Douglas, etc. and having it converted (Cut to Length Install lug and locking bolts, chambered, cut, crowned and drilled & taped for scope and Forend) by a competent gunsmith/machinist to fit an Encore? Advantages, disadvantages? Any thoughts?

I think total price would be less than or equal to OTT, Van Horn, Bullberry, SSK, others, but more than Standard TC or custom FoxRidge.

Graybeard · « **Reply #1 on:** January 22, 2005, 12:33:23 PM »

I think you don't understand the complexity of the process. If you just gotta have a brand blank other than offered I'm sure some of them will use your blank. No I don't think you'll save money and I think the chances of it actually working and being safe are slim to none.

Catfish · « **Reply #2 on:** January 22, 2005, 12:41:51 PM »

I agree with GB. It`s not that it cann`t be done, it`s just that the people who are already set-up to do it can do it so much faster reduceing labor cost. That plus I`ve paid as much for barrel blanks for blot actions as I paid for T/C barrels ready to shoot. I`ve picked-up 2 Bullberry barrels in .17 cal. wildcats for $ 200 each with RCBS dies, and the dies are $ 95 a set new. I like custom guns, but being cheap I usually try to find them that someone else has had built, they are so much cheaper that way.

hobbyist · « **Reply #3 on:** January 22, 2005, 02:59:32 PM »

I have always been a tickler for accuracy. Although havent competed for a few years now and primarily use my guns for hunting, I still want them extremely accurate. :grin: Anyways, I bought a Hart bull barrel in 7-08 made for a Stolle Panda action off ebay recently, with the hopes of keeping the chamber and bore intact and having it modified to fit an Encore, killing two birds with one stone (Have Hart barrel accuracy at the price of basic custom barrel).

Spoke to Mike at OTT a few days ago and will be sending it for his evaluation. I think it should be straightforward modification, as he uses customer blanks regularly. The only problem is that he may need to rechamber the barrel due to the existing threads. That may defeat the whole purpose! Another option is just to have it rethreaded for one of my other rifles (which ever will work). What do you think?

GB, What am I missing? This is equivalent of OTT using one of his (or customer specified) blanks, isnt it? Also, what do you think if I have him rechamber it for the same round as compared to leaving the chamber intact and just having barrel rethreaded for another action?

Catfish, I agree with you. I think time and cost s/b the only difference starting from a blank. I think Lilja and Hart blanks may be the only ones that make it perhaps worthed. Btw, where do you find them at that price? What's your secret?

Guys I really appreciate your insight. I am new to Encore and I am finding my way around.

Graybeard · « **Reply #4 on:** January 22, 2005, 04:56:37 PM »

Mike is already set up to do this. You were asking about sending it to someone other than one of the folks now making TC barrels. That was all I addressed.

hobbyist · « **Reply #5 on:** January 23, 2005, 03:53:44 AM »

Got you. Thanks GB.

Graybeard · « **Reply #6 on:** January 23, 2005, 05:39:13 AM »

With someone like Mike who is already set up to take blanks and make them into barrels the single biggest hurdle I see is that you're wanting to use the factory chamber. A mistake in my mind but I do understand why you want it. If there is enough metal to take off and get it turned down to the necessary dimensions then yeah it likely can be done. BUT then they have to apply the heat right at the chamber area while welding on the lug. Could have an affect on the chamber area that would not be desired.

Plus if it's a USED take off barrel most likely the throat area has some wear and tear that would best be taken out by moving the chamber forward anyway. If a new unused barrel this wouldn't apply.

hobbyist · « **Reply #7 on:** January 23, 2005, 06:46:46 AM »

Great point GB. I didnt think about that.

It is a used take off barrel and previous owner used the barrel for 300m free-rifle competition for two years. How many rounds he shot through it, I dont know, but I suspect he probably put a fair amount thru it and there maybe some throat wear. It is a very heavy barrel and I hope this wasnt his go-to rifle however. He later rebarreled and went to a lighter barrel. Also, I dont have a scope and cant check the throat wear. I am hopping Mike can shed some light on this. As for the barrel, it is 25 SS heavy barrel with 1.25 diameter at the chamber and .855 at the muzzle. The diameter at the threads is 1. Plan was for Mike to shave the radius on the bottom of the barrel to fit the receiver and not touch the upper half.

I dont mind rechambering and shortening the barrel, given the worst-case scenario we discussed. A tight and centered chamber can only increase the accuracy, but only if rechamber results are better than current chamber condition. This is the first time I am using OTT but he seems to have a good reputation, and I think he is more of a machinist than a gunsmith, which is a good thing in this case. What do you guys think?

I think my options are: 1) if throat wear is minimal, turn the barrel to 1 diameter (or a little less) to get red of the threading (and rechamber or not) and weld Lug, etc. But welding heat may crate a problem. 2) If throat wear is excessive, shorten the barrel, rechamber, and install lug, etc. 3) Abandon Encore and have it rethreaded for my Rem 700.

Sorry for the long winded post, but want to give you all the facts and look forward to your thoughts. Thanks.

Graybeard · « **Reply #8 on:** January 23, 2005, 09:29:12 AM »

I guess it isn't clear to me what your ultimate goal is in this project. Personally I'd not spend the money required to fit a used barrel to either. You can buy a new barrel for darn little more than your total is gonna be in this and have the full useful life of a great barrel. If he was a competition shooter the barrel has likely seen quite a few thousand rounds down it. Throat is likely burned out and barrel likely fairly heavily worn already. Not where I'd want to be starting on a new custom gun project but that's me and you're the one with the barrel.

For sure tho I'm thinking a new chamber moved out to remove the burned out throat is advisable.

Yes Mike is a machinist. Since I've not seen any of his work I can't speak from a position of knowledge about the quality of that work. Most who have seen it seem quite pleased so I assume he must do good work. Last time I spoke to JD Jones we had a short discussion regarding Mike and JD seem to think quite well of him from his limited knowledge of him. They spoke often while Mike was getting set up in the barrel making business as I understand.

hobbyist · « **Reply #9 on:** January 23, 2005, 10:21:25 AM »

GB, Perhaps I made a mistake buying the barrel. I will send it to Mike for his examination and will go from there. Thanks for the straight talk. Will post results.

hobbyist · « **Reply #10 on:** February 02, 2005, 02:52:37 PM »

Update:

Mike checked the barrel; rifling and chamber look fine. I like a 22" barrel and dont care for the .306 neck the chamber came in, so I am having him cut the barrel to length and rechamber in std 7-08. Rechambering after a barrel is broken in always increases accuracy so this is a good thing. Also, Mike cuts the chamber (EDM's) after he welds the lug so no chance of warping chamber.

Over all it should be an extremely accurate barrel and I will be saving $150 off of equivalent barrel. Will let you know how it will shoot.

Thanks again for everyones help.

wsmitty01 · « **Reply #11 on:** February 03, 2005, 01:46:28 PM »

Since Mike doesn't taper barrels, I plan on purchasing a blank with a heavy varmint contour 30 caliber from Shilen and have Mike chamber it for 30BR. He doesn't use reamers but the actual round from the gun to measure the cut with. I hope to build an Encore that will shoot consistently in the 2's and 3's at 200 yds. I have been told too many times that an Encore can not shoot with the high end benchrest guns. I have seen groups shot from his barrels that are as good or better than this. Just want to show up at one of our IBS matches and throw a little scare into that crowd. They all shoot 6 PPC, so maybe the bigger hole will give me the advantage on the X count!!! And also it will be a hell of a good deer round!

hobbyist · « **Reply #12 on:** February 03, 2005, 04:14:32 PM »

Smitty, I happen to have a Douglas SS heavy tapered blank in 30 cal that I may consider selling. Just bought it 2 weeks ago, but may change to 35 cal to make a 35 whelen instead of 06.

Send me a PM if you are interested.