Author Topic: Here ya go UFO believers (Read 1413 times)

Dan Mich Trapper · « **on:** December 02, 2004, 06:02:47 PM »

http://search.cometsystems.com/search.php?qry=project+blue+book&origin=csearch&src_id=286&tmpl=1Ben&spelltoken=n-814340024_q-pZ0GR6aAwSupesOfX85VlQABAA%40%40

Jack Crevalle · « **Reply #1 on:** December 03, 2004, 08:28:46 AM »

I read a good book on the subject lately, UFO's and the National Security State. The author uses a lot of declassified materials to show, among other things, how Project Blue Book was a disinformation campaign designed to ridicule and discredit any member of the public that reporteded a sighting while the Air Force had regulations requiring it's own to report UFOs but not talk about them. The CIA also kept track of reports world wide.

The author makes his liberal leanings plain especially early on in the book and he sometimes makes conclusions that are based on a lack of facts rather than facts but overall it is a good work.

Loader 3009 · « **Reply #2 on:** December 04, 2004, 09:39:37 AM »

Jimmy Carter saw a flying saucer. Jimmy Carter is an idiot.

Graybeard · « **Reply #3 on:** December 04, 2004, 11:54:09 AM »

Quote

Jimmy Carter saw a flying saucer. Jimmy Carter is an idiot.

Well yeah maybe but the two things have nothing to do with one another. True he is an idiot. But that has nothing to do with what he might or might not have seen.

I've seen several flying saucers in my day and a few flying coffee cups also. See UFO's all the time. Mrs. GB keeps telling me some of them are airplanes but until I identify them they are technically UFOs. Most of them I do identify Ok but some I never can so they stay classed as UFOs. Heck I even see an occasional UWO, that's unidentifed walking object. When we sit out on front porch at night critters walk past I'm not able to identify from the short view of them so what else can they be but UWO's?

Loader 3009 · « **Reply #4 on:** December 04, 2004, 01:28:01 PM »

I have been wanting to call Carter an idiot for a week but couldn't justify starting a thread to do it. :-D

The idiot built one of his slum houses a block from me and lowered the property values in the neighborhood by %10. Now, it is standing empty.

Jack Crevalle · « **Reply #5 on:** December 04, 2004, 02:50:58 PM »

Quote from: Graybeard

Quote
Jimmy Carter saw a flying saucer. Jimmy Carter is an idiot.

until I identify them they are technically UFOs

Exactly. As Arthur C. Clarke said, "If you haven't seen a UFO you must not be very observant." UFO does not automatically imply extraterrestrial spacecraft. Too much in the natural world has been ignored because the government as well as closed minded people derided people reporting UFOs. "Sprites and jets", seen and reported by pilots at high altitude are one such example. Another is "earth lights". Some people think that earth lights might be a precusor to earthquakes.

There are many examples throughout history of the educated thumbing their noses at things that didn't fit their understanding of the world.

Loader 3009 · « **Reply #6 on:** December 05, 2004, 01:23:53 AM »

After years of study and investigation, I fully well understand what "flying saucers" are. I am not one of the MUFON crowd, but have attended one of their conventions. "Space aliens" have consumed these people's minds.

Here in North Carolina, we have many natural appearing phonomena that many ascribe to ghosts of Indians or slaves, i.e. the Brown Mountain lights and the Ghost of Maco Station. These lights have not been explained by science, but I assure you they are not ghosts or space aliens. When it gets dark, the human mind becomes hyper-active.

Any intelligent person knows that it is physically impossible to travel throught light years of space in a relatively tiny craft with no provisions other than lab equipment. But it is not impossible to imagine this. :grin:

Project Bluebook is a subject that periodically re-surfaces, apparently in subsequent generations along with the Area 51 myth.

I am not denying that people "see" something. Neither did the government when they launched Project Bluebook. People and the government just don't realize what is being "seen", hence the mystery and secrecy.

Much of this, unfortunately, has been exploited by charlatans, movie makers and horror writers. Some folks believe in vampires and werewolves. People love a "campfire tale" and relate them as truth simply because their father or grandfather told them, and everybody knows that Pa or Grandpa wouldn't lie. Corpus delicti.

gino · « **Reply #7 on:** December 05, 2004, 02:12:13 AM »

I used to work with a guy that actually took a ride on a UFO. He also told me he had a vacation cabin on Antares V too so.............
gino

Loader 3009 · « **Reply #8 on:** December 05, 2004, 04:05:14 AM »

The hunting on Antares V is great; the fishing only so-so.

HipShot · « **Reply #9 on:** December 05, 2004, 04:26:41 AM »

IIRC, Ronald Wilson Reagan, (my personal hero), also saw one and commented about it at a press conference.

I've seen some things that leave me scratching my head too. I don't know what to call them. I'm not going to worry about it; I just assume that our tax dollars are being well spent on a good weapons platform.

Other than that there are religious connotations that may be inappropriate for this forum.

To call Jimmy Carter an idiot is to absolve him of responsibility. He's evil.

Graybeard · « **Reply #10 on:** December 05, 2004, 05:14:34 AM »

While I lay no claim to first hand experience with extra terrestial life I have no real problems believing such might exist. There is a LOT of stuff out there in the universe beyond our planet. That other intelligent life might exist somewhere is not a hard concept for me to accept. That some have visited here? Well I dunno. Maybe. That they do regularly? Well I dunno, that's a bit more of a stretch but I'm trying to keep an open mind on that.

That vampires exists, well I have a lot harder time on that one. Sure won't say absolutely no way Jose. But I'm darn near that category on this issue.

Ghosts? Well I have less of a hard time on that one. If we accept the Bible and thus accept that humans have a spirit or soul then why is it so hard to believe that the spirit or soul might at times be seen by the living? I haven't and certainly do not put myself in the total believer category on the matter but for sure have an open mind to this possibility.

I do believe in GOD and the Bible. I do believe in Good and evil both. I have no doubt in my own mind both exist. That both might at times be manifested to us as a visible presence is also not out of the realm of possibility to me. I can't say that I've actually seen either however. But then so far GOD hasn't come and sat down next to me and spoken to me like a person would and carried on a conversation with me. But I do still believe in his existance.

As to creatures like Big Foot, to me the jury is still out on this one. I've seen nothing personally to make me believe. But I don't completely discount stories others to include folks posting here have told of seeing them. Before I move into the category of saying I believe in them however I'd like to have a believable person experience to support it. Until then I stay open to the possibility. I think something is happening that cannot be explained by known events and entities. What I have no clue.

Believing in the Bible and GOD's word I am convinced we're rapidly drawing near to the end times told of in Revelations. Perhaps what we're seeing or experiencing is the beings both good and evil that will be let loose at the end. Not saying that's it, just saying it is one possible explaination.

Loader 3009 · « **Reply #11 on:** December 05, 2004, 05:23:55 AM »

Actually, I believe that he is a combination of the two. :grin:

I will agree that a lot of this phenomena does have, as you say, a "religious" connection......actually more spiritual, but we will go with the "religious" connotation for the sake of discussion.

When I was investigating the saucer/alien phenomenon, I found that there was a dispropotionate relationship between these "encounters" and the religious preferences of the individuals involved. Now, I don't want to start any wars here, so lets just say that some religions are based more on superstition, paganism and gullibility than others.

The MUFON folks are not religious people, but theyare inquisitive. Few will admit to any encounter. One did, however. He told me that space aliens came to his house and he allowed them to play with his children. This fellow is a psychologist. As he was an office in MUFON, I fear that he may be leading these people to mental and spiritual destruction.

Another gentleman, who lives near to me, claims to have been abducted twice. He is a mental/emotional basket case if he is still alive. This man was as sane as you or I at the time of his first encounter.

It is better that we stay away from these things,....especially if we are not equipped to deal with them.

Loader 3009 · « **Reply #12 on:** December 05, 2004, 05:40:21 AM »

GB, you and I posted simultaneously.

The Bible says that 'the dead know nothing'. IF someone actually "sees" a ghost, it is an evil spirit impersonating a formerly living person. The popular concept that people, when they die, go to hell, Heaven or wherever is erroneous. If this were true, why the resurrections? Jesus was the first born by His resurrection....born of the spirit. The rest will follow, the first being the "firstfruits" or "dead in Christ". The second ones will be the elect living at the time of His return. Then all the others will be resurrected in stages spanning a thousand years. There is no "rapture". I challenge anyone to show me where the Bible says that there is.

There is a description of a "flying saucer" in the Old Testament. In Ezekiel, if I remember correctly.

Jack Crevalle · « **Reply #13 on:** December 07, 2004, 02:04:12 AM »

Quote from: Loader 3009

Any intelligent person knows that it is physically impossible to travel throught light years of space in a relatively tiny craft with no provisions other than lab equipment. But it is not impossible to imagine this. :grin:

Project Bluebook is a subject that periodically re-surfaces, apparently in subsequent generations along with the Area 51 myth.

While most debunkers speaking about the extraterrestrial origin of UFOs rely on anthropomorphizing extraterrestrial life (ex. "If they come here why don't they land on the White House lawn?") I think that Carl Sagan had a point when he said that if we find extraterrestril life it will most likely not resemble us in any way. If that is the case, then their motives, physical charateristics and limitations may not have anything in common with us. That said, even if extraterrstrial life was physically like us I can think of at least 3 ggod reasons why it would be possible to cross light years of distance in an apparently small craft.

- The observed craft comes from a larger one. This is how we ourselves construct spacecraft ie. lunar lander.

- The craft are "unmanned".

- The craft operate close enough to the speed of light to take advantage of Einstien's Special Relativity. The closer the craft moves to the speed of light, everything on board slows, clocks, internal clocks, aging. The occupants would arrive much less older than had they travaled the same amount of time at a much lower speed. They would therefore need proportionally less provisions.

As to Project Blue Book, after 50 years of the government's public pronouncements that UFOs are unworthy of serious study, posed no national defense risk, etc., they continued to study them. Since much of this information becomes available in bits and pieces as it is declassified, this results in periodic resurfacsing of decades old topics.

Loader 3009 · « **Reply #14 on:** December 07, 2004, 02:18:24 AM »

So show me one. I await with bated breath.

I have long since relegated Carl Sagan to the same catagory as the highly esteemed James Earl Carter, Esq.

twodollarpistol · « **Reply #15 on:** December 07, 2004, 03:38:17 AM »

Quote from: Loader 3009

GB, you and I posted simultaneously.

The Bible says that 'the dead know nothing'. IF someone actually "sees" a ghost, it is an evil spirit impersonating a formerly living person. The popular concept that people, when they die, go to hell, Heaven or wherever is erroneous. If this were true, why the resurrections? Jesus was the first born by His resurrection....born of the spirit. The rest will follow, the first being the "firstfruits" or "dead in Christ". The second ones will be the elect living at the time of His return. Then all the others will be resurrected in stages spanning a thousand years. There is no "rapture". I challenge anyone to show me where the Bible says that there is.

There is a description of a "flying saucer" in the Old Testament. In Ezekiel, if I remember correctly.

Hey Loader, Good Mornin

First let me say that you and I are on exactly the same page when it comes to so called ghosts or hauntings. BUT, If I may let me respectfully disagree with you about the rapture. First, the word "rapture" does not appear in the Bible. It is not a Biblical word or term. It is a common english word that means "To be carried away". Also let me say that you obviously believe in the Bible and its teachings, but the word"Bible" does not appear in the Bible either. If you would read 1Thes 4:16-18, the rapture is perfectly and completely described. Just a side note, notice that in this description of the Lords carrying us away, The Lord never touches the earth, but we will be" caught up together with them in the clouds" To me this means we are going to leave where we are and going, through no power of our own, to where He is. In other words, we are going to be "CARRIED AWAY" or "RAPTURED"
This for your consideration, and if I dont stop now I'll start preachin or runnin or both.
Have a good one :grin:

Jack Crevalle · « **Reply #16 on:** December 07, 2004, 11:49:31 AM »

Quote from: Loader 3009

So show me one. I await with bated breath.

I have long since relegated Carl Sagan to the same catagory as the highly esteemed James Earl Carter, Esq.

Interresting, because Carl Sagan was/is widely regarded as a debunker because of his stand that there were more "worthy" avenues research than SETI.

I think that it is strange however since his writing contains such conclusions on the nature of extraterrestrial life and how inter dimensional objects might appear to the viewer.

Loader 3009 · « **Reply #17 on:** December 07, 2004, 02:11:53 PM »

[/quote]Hey Loader, Good Mornin

[/quote]

Good morning, yourself, rascal

'cept it's afternoon now and I'm tired.

$2Pistol, remember when they taught you in Sunday school that Noah took the animals on the ark in pairs? Some people still believe this, but the Bible says that he took only the unclean in twos, but the clean in sevens.

Did they show you pictures of a long-haired Jesus? Didn't Peter, the head disciple, tells us that it is wrong for men to have long hair?

They also taught you that Jesus was crucified on Friday and rose on Sunday....two days later. Jesus, Himself said that he would be in the grave for THREE days. Was Jesus wrong or did he lie? (He was actually crucified on Wednesday and rose on the Sabbath... Saturday, the Seventh Day of the week)

Our churches promote the celebration of Christs birth on December 25th., but most will admit that He was probably born in October. December 25th is, in reality, the birthdate of the evil Nimrod.

Where did these, and many other misconceptions originate? They are spurious additions to your Bible. Get a good Bible commentary such as Halley's and cross reference all that you read. You will find many words placed there by man that grossly change the original meaning. In addition, some Hebrew, Greek and Aramiac do not translate well to English.

The trinity was "invented" in the second and third centuries to discourage paganism and has no basis in Biblical teachings.

It seems that one "church" is responsible for most of these inaccuracies....and other churches evolved from this "church".

Do a quick search using the words "rapture" and "false" and you will find many sites explaining this misconception. Here is the first one I found: http://www.newfoundationspubl.org/rapture1.htm I know nothing about this site but I did read the page and found it to be mostly correct in it's analysis.

If you don't agree, that's fine. We were created with freedom to choose.

twodollarpistol · « **Reply #18 on:** December 08, 2004, 01:10:06 AM »

Quote from: Loader 3009

Hey Loader, Good Mornin

[/quote]

Good morning, yourself, rascal

'cept it's afternoon now and I'm tired.

$2Pistol, remember when they taught you in Sunday school that Noah took the animals on the ark in pairs? Some people still believe this, but the Bible says that he took only the unclean in twos, but the clean in sevens.

Did they show you pictures of a long-haired Jesus? Didn't Peter, the head disciple, tells us that it is wrong for men to have long hair?

They also taught you that Jesus was crucified on Friday and rose on Sunday....two days later. Jesus, Himself said that he would be in the grave for THREE days. Was Jesus wrong or did he lie? (He was actually crucified on Wednesday and rose on the Sabbath... Saturday, the Seventh Day of the week)

Our churches promote the celebration of Christs birth on December 25th., but most will admit that He was probably born in October. December 25th is, in reality, the birthdate of the evil Nimrod.
If you don't agree, that's fine. We were created with freedom to choose.[/quote]

Hmmm! You bring up good points. I really dont disagree with any of them to any great extent. Nothing I could really get wraped around anyway. None of these however have anything to do with the rapture. And I do disagree with you on that one. My son is an ordained minister and I disagree with him sometimes too. Tried to raise him right but you know how young'uns can be.
But hey, thats OK too. I may disagree with you a little, but I still love ya.
Have a good one and get some rest.

1911crazy · « **Reply #19 on:** December 08, 2004, 08:24:53 AM »

First, I'm going to open up a can of worms here back during the crusades I think there was a lot of information/truth lost when the churches burned the old books? Then they were rewritten to fit the belief in the church/religion. I believe there is a God but not the way the church presents it. I just think were fed a lot of BS from our goverment and the church too because our goverment hides the truth to keep the peace. There is a lot of UFO information comming out of russia too now. I wish our goverment would open up the secret files they have too. I heard once we captured some aliens and we keeping them alive and there working with us to build copies of their space crafts? And this has been going on for many years too. Maybe these sightings were seeing is actually us flying them? I also believe we have been here before and destroyed ourselves too and started all over again. What happened to all these lost civilizations? We can put a man in space and we can't even answer whats going on here on earth? I think we have the answers and there not telling us. BigBill

I also think there is a power source in the earths grid were not taping too because its free!!!!!!!

Now what about the 10th planet (i think it is) the one they talk about that we don't see but they thinks its there. And they talk about the people being very tall thats why sometimes we have tall people here because of that gene from when there were here at one time and they left us.

Loader 3009 · « **Reply #20 on:** December 08, 2004, 10:46:53 PM »

Hmmmmmmmm...........tall....from another planet.......Hey, you are talking about Dennis Rodman. :-D

gino · « **Reply #21 on:** December 09, 2004, 02:56:41 AM »

If this thread goes on much longer I'm going to put on my tinfoil beanie!
gino

1911crazy · « **Reply #22 on:** December 13, 2004, 10:51:14 AM »

Quote from: Loader 3009

Hmmmmmmmm...........tall....from another planet.......Hey, you are talking about Dennis Rodman. :-D

No it has something to do with the tenth planet!!! Its thought these people were here and helped us then they got pissed at us and left but promised someday to return? Does that sound familiar? I think most of the bible is man written meaning its been altered/changed. While some of it is true for there is a connection to what goes on in the world right now within our two centuries. If the bible is right the end of the world as we know it is soon right? Whats going to happen if some of us live thru it? Like I said we've been here before and destroyed ourselves over and over again and maybe we'll get it right someday and there will be peace on earth? :roll: BigBill