what barrel length for a 358 Winchester

[shotgunner]

I bought a Remington 700 ADL in 243 this week with the intention of sending it to ER Shaw to be rebarreled to 358 Winchester. I am thinking of a fairly short, handy woods rifle. What I am wondering about is barrel length. My thinking is that with the expansion ratio of the 358 that 22" would be about right. On the other hand, if I had it made longer I could always have it cut. Does anyone have any experience with the 358? How about bullets? loads? Any input would help.

Shotgunner

[Graybeard]

No experience with the round as such but I have had 14" barreled TCs in a couple of .35s that approximate it. I've been toying with the idea of having one of my LSS Mtn. Rifle's converted to .358 Win. The 22" barrel is definitely what I am likely to do if I follow thru with the plan. You could drop to 20" with darn little real loss of velocity and no real world loss of effectiveness if you want.

From the 14" barrel of my .358 JDJ I was able to reach 2300 fps with 225s using less powder than they said was max. That was all the recoil I wanted so it was sure enough max for me in that TC Handgun. Since .258 Win. pressures are higher than those for the JDJ rounds you could no doubt duplicate that velocity at same barrel length in a .358 Win. and in a 20" barrel add maybe 150-200 fps more.

[shotgunner]

I am sure that I don't need a long barrel on this one. Perhaps I will go with 21", just to be different. I would like to use quick detachable mounts and a back up peep sight, do you know of a peep that would work? Shotgunner

[Graybeard]

I think 21" would be a good compromise length. I'd personally scrap the idea of a peep sight back up. I'm not aware of any that would be an easy switch. If you're concerned about scope failure just use QD mounts and have an extra scope sighted in and ready in extra QD rings.

Personally I've never yet had a scope fail on me in the field while hunting. I think the idea of having a back up plan "just in case" is over sold. If it were a rifle to be used on dangerous game that might have to be followed into really thick cover when wounded then I'd want an option for going to plain open sights but darn sure not a peep.

[Yukon Jack]

You might consider something like Paul Dressel has done.  This is a 358  on a Grisel Mauser action with, what appears to be, a 20 or 21" barrel.  He's using QD mounts with fixed open sights.

While this rifle is as custom as it gets, fully engraved and exhibition grade walnut, the idea is similar.

There are quite a few peep sights made that attach to the bolt and fold down when not in use.  These were quite popular and fairly common several years ago, but as popular today.  I believe they are referred to as the "H&H Bolt Peep sight".  Tom Delucchi is manufacturing replicas that are true to the originals.  I don't have a picture of one, but believe it is exactly what you are referring to.

[Yukon Jack]

Here's a few images of the Delucchi H&H peep sight.

[Ct Kid]

Shotgunner, had a model seven rebarreled with douglas 22 inch medium contour barrel. The twist is for the heavier bullets its a 1 in 12 . I talked to douglas and thats what they recommended. Mostly shoot 200grs. Shoots under 1.5 inch or better at 100 yards, if the shooters doing his thing.Have not got into the heavier bullets yet but thats comming with time.Have not noticed any disadvantage with the barrel length in heavy brush. Hope this helps.

[PaulS]

I have been following this thread to see where it would go and have decided to join in.
I have a custom rifle that was made using a Remington 700 action. I had it fitted with a heavy barrel that was 24 inches long. It is a bit long for use in close quarter woodland use but it is all I could have expected and more. I shoot only light bullets, 158 pistol bullets and 180 rifle bullets as I am very recoil sensitive. It weighs and handles very much like my sporterized 03A3. Mine shoots sub-caliber groups at 100 and 200 yards. I would think that a 22 inch barrel would be a good length for close quarter woodland use. It would affect velocity very little and be much handier to use.

PaulS

[shotgunner]

I think I am going to go with the Tally mount-peep sight system. I see this project as one that will grow, at least the amount of money I spend on it will grow. I am going to start with the barrel job. If I am as happy with it as I think I might be I will buy the Tally mounts and sight. Then perhaps it will need a better stock. Has anyone used the Talley system, quick detach mounts and peep, that is. Shotgunner

[Con]

Yukon Jack,
Do you have any other photos of that Mannlicher styled 358Win? Absolutely gorgeous!
Cheers...
Con

[Bandito]

I don't know why the peep backup is so bad an idea. I used the NECG sight on the Weaver bases while the scope was off last deer season. I was whitetail hunting in the Missouri Ozarks and it was sleeting for a while. I took off the scope and placed the peep in the rear mount. I put the scope back on when the precip stopped.  The 358 worked later when I shot a meat deer. I used a 200 gr round nose Remington bullet. The deer dropped at the shot and kicked for a few seconds.   At 17 1/4" the Savage 99 brush gun barrel has been shortened, probably due to damage. It doesn't seem to have lost much killing power due to the barrel length. It carries well. I think a 20" barrel would be fine for brush. I would go to that length if I wanted to rebarrel the gun with a quality barrel, but why?  It stops what I shoot.  Later  'Dito

[sgtt]

I opted for a 20" tube on my Encore.  I wish that I had gone with a 21.  Purely for aesthetic reasons.  With a 20" barrel you will not lose much in terms of terminal ballistics.  I have a Rem 788 that was a "scout" rifle long before they were popular.  I used a Williams apature sight, with some slight modification, on the rear.  Works great.  Used the existing rear scope base holes.

[jbmi]

I'm having a 358 made by Montana Rifle and Serengeti Stockworks.
It's wearing a 22" barrel with a 1/12 twist.
I have another 358 Savage 99 that has a 23" factory barrel on it.
It's a great round and perfect for our Mich. whitetails

[Yukon Jack]

Yukon Jack,
Do you have any other photos of that Mannlicher styled 358Win? Absolutely gorgeous!
Cheers...
Con

I don't have any other pictures of that particular rifle, but it was one of a two rifle set, I believe the other was chambered for 243 Win.  I linked those pictures from his website.

I did see them at the ACGG show last year in Reno, and they are very, very nice.  If you like rifles like that, you really need to attend that show coming up in January.  It's held at the Silver Legacy Hotel & Casino in Reno, the same weekend as the SCI show in Reno.  Makes for a really nice 3 day weekend.  You can get your fingerprints all over some really nice rifles and handguns at both shows.

[Graycg]

MY BLR is in 358 and it has a 20 inch barrel, I have no complaints at all.  Velocities with 200 grain bullets runs 2650 FPS with sane loads, recoil gets your attention quickly.  With 250 grain bullets at 2350 FPS that little rifle kicks similar to my heavy old 338 model 70 magnum.  I don't think you can go wrong with an 18-22 inch barrel.
   I was thinking of something along the line of a Ruger Number one international with a 20 inch barrel full stocked....that rifle is shorter than a bolt gun with a 16 inch barrel!  Talk about handy!

regards and you will love all about the 358 except the recoil out of a light rifle.

graycg

[chupiw]

Yesterday I was doing some searches in this forum and found a reference to a H&H peep rear sigh mad by a gentleman named Tom Delucchi.  I have been looking for this type of sight and would like to get one.  I think Yukon Jack is the indiviual who posted some pics of this sight.  I would appreciate any contact information so I can get one of these sights.  Any Information appreciated.

[358Win]

Any thing between 16 and 21 inches would be great for your 358.  Not much is gained after you pass 21 and at 26 you would actually get slightly less than at 22 or 23.

[PaulS]

It is best to fit the length of a barrel to its job and youor own preferences. My barrel is 24 inches. It is a tight barrel and very accurate.
I don't find it difficult to manage, swing, or carry. Others hunt in different terrain and feel better with a shorter barrel. You aren't going to run into a barrel long enough to slow your round down so don't worry about that.