IHMSA Revisions

[41mafia]

This post was made in IHMSA Chat General Discussion.

In the 22 years I've been in IHMSA there has been constant turmoil within the organization. How a bunch of people who love to bust steel and tell lies could goof up an organization so badly is beyond me. Something is very wrong with a system that has a resulted in a revolving door for Officers of IHMSA, not to mention the loss of so many valuable and talented members. So many people have left IHMSA and many qualified remaining members will not get involved because of the internal strife that goes on. I don't want to dress in drag, take an alias and shoot wimp loads or shoot black plastic wonder auto's.(That was only a joke) I want to shoot Silhouettes!
We need a commitment from EVERY IHMSA member to get involved!

The Match Directors, State Directors and Regional/Board Members need to cooperate in making the changes necessary to save our sport. It is not a difficult task to establish an email contact list chain for communications with everyone from the Board on down.and vice versa. It is most likely in existence already, just not being used effectively.
The following are my attempt to formulate the beginings of a plan to involve the members in the future of IHMSA. What ever changes we adopt, the members need to feel they have some input instead of the apathy that is prevalent now.

1. All rule changes, proposal, modifications should be published in the March IHMSA NEWS. Members will have from the Internationals until February to discuss proposals/ideas and send them up the chain. Members would then have 2 months to discuss them at their monthly matches. The results of a club vote can be forwarded up the chain from the Match Directors before June 1st.
2. All issues are to be published/disseminated before a vote by the Board.
3. State Directors will forward the results of his/her States votes to both Region Director and to the clubs as well.
4. Region Directors will then notify State Directors of his/her Regions results.
5. All issues voted on by the Board will be published. All minutes of meetings are to be published either on the IHMSA Web Page or in the News. No secret results of a vote. All Board votes will be publicized. I didn't mean to ramble on, but the just is that everyone knows how eveyone stood for the vote!
This would establish some accountability on everyone’s part. If everyone does their part, the Region Director would have a mandate from his/her members before they vote. This would also show whether or not a Match/State Director or club are not pulling their weight as well.

Please consider these changes and add any constructive ideas you have. I am not placing the blame the IHMSA Board or any individual for the decline in membership. I am not criticizing anyone. I am only trying to start an idea to get us back on track and preserve the game we love. As a MD, it is not really a lot of work if you have over 90% of your club shooters on email like I do. It would only take a few minutes to talk over the proposal/changes at a match. Heck, try it after a match over a few adult beverages and who knows what great ideas will come forward.
I have thick skin (and head) so bring it on!

Last but not least.
It isn't how good you shoot, just how good you look doing it!
Long live the 41 Mafia!

[K2]

Hi Arnie  

The biggest concern I have is the 22 years of turmoil, it is hard to make changes with that long of a history.  I did my part on getting involved since a few months after joining and I now am watching from the sidelines to see if the turmoil can end.  Too often votes come up with no advanced warning and therefore no time for detailed thought.  Often a small change results in a domino effect all down the line.  Simple games need simple well communicated rules. Silly wet is a fun game and I think the problems come in when fellows try to carry it beyond the game status.  I know what the winners circle feels like and it doesn't compare to a simple good day at the range with like minded folks having fun shooting.   There is no money in it, and 1st place (whatever that means) isn't of much interest outside the association anyway.  Gotta know where you want to end up before you can draw up a plan to take you there.  It is time for the membership to tell the Board where they wish to go.   I only need 3 things out of an association. 1. stable rules that I like that I have confidence won't change requiring me to constantly upgrade just to stay even, 2. adequate notice when changes are contemplated so they can be fully discussed, and 3 honest accounting of the memberships money.  

 I lost faith in the Board doing the right thing and now it is time for them to prove to me they really plan on changing the causes of the turmoil around.  Doing lots of membership drives doesn't make sense while alienating the current members.  I know I am not alone in this thought process.  We all know how to knock down targets, that part is fairly easy.  Simple things like getting the minutes of the Board meetings published, comparable financial reports and the Annual meeting minutes should not take an act of God.  

This post was made in IHMSA Chat General Discussion.

In the 22 years I've been in IHMSA there has been constant turmoil within the organization. How a bunch of people who love to bust steel and tell lies could goof up an organization so badly is beyond me. Something is very wrong with a system that has a resulted in a revolving door for Officers of IHMSA, not to mention the loss of so many valuable and talented members. So many people have left IHMSA and many qualified remaining members will not get involved because of the internal strife that goes on. I don't want to dress in drag, take an alias and shoot wimp loads or shoot black plastic wonder auto's.(That was only a joke) I want to shoot Silhouettes!
We need a commitment from EVERY IHMSA member to get involved!

The Match Directors, State Directors and Regional/Board Members need to cooperate in making the changes necessary to save our sport. It is not a difficult task to establish an email contact list chain for communications with everyone from the Board on down.and vice versa. It is most likely in existence already, just not being used effectively.
The following are my attempt to formulate the beginings of a plan to involve the members in the future of IHMSA. What ever changes we adopt, the members need to feel they have some input instead of the apathy that is prevalent now.

1. All rule changes, proposal, modifications should be published in the March IHMSA NEWS. Members will have from the Internationals until February to discuss proposals/ideas and send them up the chain. Members would then have 2 months to discuss them at their monthly matches. The results of a club vote can be forwarded up the chain from the Match Directors before June 1st.
2. All issues are to be published/disseminated before a vote by the Board.
3. State Directors will forward the results of his/her States votes to both Region Director and to the clubs as well.
4. Region Directors will then notify State Directors of his/her Regions results.
5. All issues voted on by the Board will be published. All minutes of meetings are to be published either on the IHMSA Web Page or in the News. No secret results of a vote. All Board votes will be publicized. I didn't mean to ramble on, but the just is that everyone knows how eveyone stood for the vote!
This would establish some accountability on everyone’s part. If everyone does their part, the Region Director would have a mandate from his/her members before they vote. This would also show whether or not a Match/State Director or club are not pulling their weight as well.

Please consider these changes and add any constructive ideas you have. I am not placing the blame the IHMSA Board or any individual for the decline in membership. I am not criticizing anyone. I am only trying to start an idea to get us back on track and preserve the game we love. As a MD, it is not really a lot of work if you have over 90% of your club shooters on email like I do. It would only take a few minutes to talk over the proposal/changes at a match. Heck, try it after a match over a few adult beverages and who knows what great ideas will come forward.
I have thick skin (and head) so bring it on!

Last but not least.
It isn't how good you shoot, just how good you look doing it!
Long live the 41 Mafia!

[volleyman]

Arnie: as a current IHMSA member (unlike AKIHMSA) you can summit rule changes and by-law changes. If you can convince enough members that those changes will take IHMSA in a better direction, they have a strong chance of passing. Just don't expect big changes overnite, IHMSA moves very slowly. Over the years, our rules have been very stable.

I think IHMSA has made some very positive moves recently and we will
turn the corner on memberships and start to grow this game again.
1/5 scale Smallbore is a great new game and will create a lot of
interest with the SB UAS shooters. 1/2 scale AIR may happen
sometime down the road also. Blair H. is working to make the rules
easier for new (and old) shooters to understand. Mike S. has been with IHMSA
for many years and while he has a tough job ahead of him, he will
stick with it and not quit if he doesn't get his way on every vote.

[K2]

Hi Arnie

As a past member (unlike Steve) I can't submit rule changes.  When I was a member I did write the whole section of rules for the AIR game however :wink:  Under those rules the AIR game was the fastest growing segment of the association.  With the changes that were made over my objections the game is now shrinking :roll: .  Looks like the results speak for themselves.  With all the Unlimited games that have been added you might think the production games could be left basic.  Should be enough for all interests.  The key to growth is to expand the base, my way won't work for the racers like Steve and his way doesn't work for the over the counter fellows like me.  No reason not to have both in the game.  You know how big the turn outs were in the early to mid 80's and then there only was Production, Standing, Revolver and just one Unlimited category.The balance has shifted to the Unlimited side and at the same time participation has slipped.  Is there something there to be noticed?  I think so.  By the way I strongly support the 1/2 scale games in all the disciplines, and at the same time want to see a few very basic categories like we had long ago box stock no customizing and no aftermarket parts.   That is what most of us in Alaska shoot.  

Arnie: as a current IHMSA member (unlike AKIHMSA) you can summit rule changes and by-law changes. If you can convince enough members that those changes will take IHMSA in a better direction, they have a strong chance of passing. Just don't expect big changes overnite, IHMSA moves very slowly. Over the years, our rules have been very stable.

I think IHMSA has made some very positive moves recently and we will
turn the corner on memberships and start to grow this game again.
1/5 scale Smallbore is a great new game and will create a lot of
interest with the SB UAS shooters. 1/2 scale AIR may happen
sometime down the road also. Blair H. is working to make the rules
easier for new (and old) shooters to understand. Mike S. has been with IHMSA
for many years and while he has a tough job ahead of him, he will
stick with it and not quit if he doesn't get his way on every vote.

[Japle]

I joined IHMSA in 1977 and was SD Director for 7 years.  I had to move around for a couple of years and always intended to get back into it.  When I finally got serious, I couldn't believe all the classes that had been added.  When I was shooting, there were only four: Production, Revolver, Standing and Unlimited plus .22s.  No scopes.  It was a fairly simple family sport.  Now it's a complex equipment race which is exactly what we wanted to avoid when we started out.
I shot in the first handgun silhouette match in 1975 in Tuscon.  The winner shot a stock Ruger .44 Super Blackhawk.  As I recall, he shot a 26X40.  I came in 6th with a .357 AutoMag.  That match was fun!
The last day of the match, I was talking to Elgin Gates and Jeff Cooper and some other guys.  I said, "The best thing about this sport is, it's impossible.  There's no way to shoot a perfect score, so there won't ever be much in the way of shootoffs.  It's simple and straightfoward".  They agreed, but none of us knew what was coming.  As far as I know, no one ever did shoot a 40X40 with a stock gun that existed in 1975 from the positions we used in that match.  The later Contenders, Rugers and S&Ws have all been much improved and beefed up and the positions greatly refined.  
I have no interest in IHMSA competition as it exists today.  The fun, family atmosphere can't survive the added complexity.  
I mean, please!
Big Bore:
Production (P)
Revolver (R)
Standing (S)
Unlimited (U)
Unlimited Standing (US)
Unlimited Any Sights (UAS)
Unlimited Half-Scale (UHS)
Unlimited Any Sights Half-Scale (UASHS)
Small bore:
Production (P)
Revolver (R)
Standing (S)
Unlimited (U)
Unlimited Standing (US)
Unlimited Any Sights (UAS)
Then add Field Pistol and Airgun?  Who are you kidding?
We used to hold matches in slightly-improved cow pastures with no electricity.  Anyone could get himself appointed as a Match Director and be up an running with a minimum of effort and expense.  A couple of sets of centerfire targets and .22 targets and some welding for the target stands.  Put some ads in the gun shops and the local papre and you've got a match!  Is that still possible?  Am I missing something?

John
Cape Canaveral

[19 Turkeys]

IMHO everyone has valid points here.  Aarnie is correct that we need to quit governing in a smoke-filled room behind closed doors and get things out in the open, and Steve is correct that we need to grow the membership.

To date, the board has not proven to me that the door is open to that smoke-filled room, but I am hopeful that the Nov/Dec issue of the IHMSA News will give us some facts for a change, especially concerning our finances.

While we have added five new members to our club this year (the last being just yesterday), I believe that adding new categories does not bring in new members (AIR being the exception to this rule).  Why do I say this?  Our club has actively promoted what I call Standard Handgun in Field Pistol.  Bring out that concealed carry gun or the one you'd grab to dispatch that varmint in your yard & shoot it.  Posters all around the range promote it.  I bring it up at each of our Board meetings.  I've met with the Cowboy & Action Pistol shooters and talked to your county sheriff about it.

We have also promoted bringing out that lever action rifle or .22 rifle.  Only one person has been returning with his .22 Anchutz on an occasional basis, and he has no interest in joining IHMSA.  (But, he does like our brats done on our world famous $13 tabletop grill for a buck.)

Two non-members have tried Standard Handgun once.  Both have failed to return.  Yes, it keeps members active because they like it, but it has failed to bring in one new member in 9 months even with extensive promotion.

Thus, I believe that adding categories will keep current members active longer, but doing so will not bring in new members.

My real concern is that the people we do add to our membership rolls are generally between 45 & 55 years old.  I'm not sure if this is a fact of life based on the cost of equipment or what.  Somehow, we need to find those mid-thirty types.  I was hopeful that AIR might do that, but we have not seen it in our neck of the woods.

Steve Ware

[K2]

Japle

AIR was totally misunderstood by the board of directors, still is and that is why it has shown no growth.  It is a great sport as originally laid out for those cold South Dakota winters when the big bore and small bore targets are in hybernation.  It is the family sport that is needed but the IHMSA has never truly encouraged a youth area.  Some of this is understandable due to the anti gun atmosphere of the 80's.  However anti gun has run its course, most states show this by having the average joe being able to actually bear his arms.  It is time to rebuild the youth shooting programs that were put on hold for far too many years.  IHMSA's main thrust has been equipment racing for those who need to have an edge on the others and the result of that is the loss of the average guy being interested in the game.  Here in my area we are having a resurgance by going back to the original ideas, Straight wall pistol cartriges in FP of .30 cal or larger, no high rise scope mounts (like you would ever take one in the Field anyway!), and other simpler ideas.  It put the fun back in the game and has a larger participation.  The scoped categories never replaced the numbers lost by going high tech.  We still shoot silhouette but not under the IHMSA banner any more.  Only 40x40's seem to matter there.  I would suggest you go back to the beginning and continue to shoot silhouette if you like the game and forget worrying over an association.  If they get it together then rejoin, if not why let that keep you from shooting a steel target?  Short answer to your question, yes it is possible to simplify the game, it will start in your area with you.  Get busy you are not getting any younger ;~)

IMHO everyone has valid points here.  Aarnie is correct that we need to quit governing in a smoke-filled room behind closed doors and get things out in the open, and Steve is correct that we need to grow the membership.

To date, the board has not proven to me that the door is open to that smoke-filled room, but I am hopeful that the Nov/Dec issue of the IHMSA News will give us some facts for a change, especially concerning our finances.

While we have added five new members to our club this year (the last being just yesterday), I believe that adding new categories does not bring in new members (AIR being the exception to this rule).  Why do I say this?  Our club has actively promoted what I call Standard Handgun in Field Pistol.  Bring out that concealed carry gun or the one you'd grab to dispatch that varmint in your yard & shoot it.  Posters all around the range promote it.  I bring it up at each of our Board meetings.  I've met with the Cowboy & Action Pistol shooters and talked to your county sheriff about it.

We have also promoted bringing out that lever action rifle or .22 rifle.  Only one person has been returning with his .22 Anchutz on an occasional basis, and he has no interest in joining IHMSA.  (But, he does like our brats done on our world famous $13 tabletop grill for a buck.)

Two non-members have tried Standard Handgun once.  Both have failed to return.  Yes, it keeps members active because they like it, but it has failed to bring in one new member in 9 months even with extensive promotion.

Thus, I believe that adding categories will keep current members active longer, but doing so will not bring in new members.

My real concern is that the people we do add to our membership rolls are generally between 45 & 55 years old.  I'm not sure if this is a fact of life based on the cost of equipment or what.  Somehow, we need to find those mid-thirty types.  I was hopeful that AIR might do that, but we have not seen it in our neck of the woods.

Steve Ware

[okiecat]

Hello,  I have been reading the post on this forum.  I came here because I was curious what ever happened to IHMSA..  I joined in 1978 and shot for 5yrs.  I quit when it started getting too rullley and  it seemed a select few with money were changing the rules and the look of the pistols.  When I first started it was a blast, we were shooting in the 20's with our tc's in 44 or if you could find a new 30-30.  I miss the old days.  Was thinking about going to a match until I read alll the classes and confusion.  Adios

[19 Turkeys]

Sorry, but I do not see "all the classes & confusion" as a reason for someone to not participate.  Pick what you want to shoot & shoot it.  Just ignore the rest.  IHMSA #19 is still shooting the basic 6.  Big Bore U, S, P & R & FP P & PAS.  He has a ball!  If you don't want to shoot UAS/HS/UFS/AIR simply shoot what you enjoy & have a great time!

Hope to see you at the range sometime somewhere!

Steve Ware

[teamnelson]

I'm one of them there mid-30's guys, and I joined last year. I personally like the simple things - Standing, Iron Sights (as Major Golden say, "the way a man ought to shoot."). The way I see it, there are two perspectives; for one group of shooters, it's about the score. So they will invest in better gear (guns, ammo, scopes, etc.) to pursue that 40 or 80. For the other group, like me, it's about shooting the best I can with a gun I already have and use for other things, like hunting. If I shoot a mid-20's with a factory S&W, then I feel like I had a good day! So the question to ask is, which of those two groups is your average new shooter going to fall into. If we want to grow IHMSA, you got to do your basic market analysis, or we wind up an elititst guild of esoteric shooters.

[Japle]

I agree with 19 turkeys that, "all the classes & confusion" shouldn't keep an individual from shooting, but that's not the point.  The point is, "all the classes & confusion" make it much harder for a small or start-up club to function.  Fewer clubs=fewer members.  
IHMSA got it's start with a simple set of rules and classes.  
The backyard-BBQ atmosphere is long gone and that atmosphere was the HEART of IHMSA.  

John Lisbeth
Former SD State Director

[19 Turkeys]

The backyard-BBQ atmosphere is long gone and that atmosphere was the HEART of IHMSA.

Hi Japle!

I totally agree with you that the backyard BBQ is/was the heart of the IHMSA experience.  To that end, the JCSA Pistol Silhouette Club in Grants Pass, OR instituted the $13 tabletop BBQ as of two years ago.  We grill brats at every match.  We sell them for a buck.  We take the profits, buy a bunch of burgers, have the wives do a carry in for side dishes and have one whale of a BBQ in August.

Shoot what you like, eat what you like.  That's our motto, and our club has grown to around 25 shooters.

If you're ever in our neck of the woods, we'd be delighted to have you stop by for a bite to eat.  We'll even lend you a handgun.

But, it is important to remember that clubs do not have to offer everything.  A very successful club in KS shoots only Small Bore.  Again, pick what your members want to shoot, buy a tabletop BBQ, and shoot and eat what you want.  The object of the game is to have fun and associate with people of like minded interest.  We have absolutely lost that aspect of the sport, and we need to find it again if we are to survive.

Steve Ware

[K2]

Hi John

There are two separate issues.  One is Handgun silhouette shooting which is a fun game.  The other is association rules and sanction fees etc.  They are mutually exclusive and if you have the targets why not just get the old bunch together and start silhouette shooting any way you wish and forget all the non-sense that made you leave the game?  

That is what we are doing in Alaska and it works fine.  We shoot just as much and do less paperwork.  Just because the IHMSA has a category/class for each active member shooting, doesn't mean you have to do the same thing.  Keep it simple and put an emphasis on fun, it works!

I agree with 19 turkeys that, "all the classes & confusion" shouldn't keep an individual from shooting, but that's not the point.  The point is, "all the classes & confusion" make it much harder for a small or start-up club to function.  Fewer clubs=fewer members.  
IHMSA got it's start with a simple set of rules and classes.  
The backyard-BBQ atmosphere is long gone and that atmosphere was the HEART of IHMSA.  

John Lisbeth
Former SD State Director

[Japle]

Yeah, I agree that doing it that way would work for me as an individual, but that doesn't help IHMSA.

Maybe someone will come along and do for silhouette what IDPA did for practical shooting.  

John

[K2]

That is already in the works John.  Main thing is to settle on what people actually want in a new group.  

What is important to you and what are you willing to pay for it to actually come to pass?

Yeah, I agree that doing it that way would work for me as an individual, but that doesn't help IHMSA.

Maybe someone will come along and do for silhouette what IDPA did for practical shooting.  

John

[Japle]

Excellent!  When it starts somewhere in the Orlando-Melbourne area, I'll be there.

Anybody know where I left my 7R brass?

John

[K2]

Does that mean you are interested in heading up FLA or waiting until someone else is?  Also what is it that you want a shooting sport organization to do/support?  Is tracking and maintaining records shot at the State/National level important to you ie a history of the group or not?  are you interested in a postal format as well as formal competitions so those in areas without many members can still compete at some level?  Do you think having a viable youth division is important?  

As far as I know there are silhouette matches in the central area of FLA.  Are they not meeting your needs?  

Excellent!  When it starts somewhere in the Orlando-Melbourne area, I'll be there.

Anybody know where I left my 7R brass?

John

[Japle]

Does that mean you are interested in heading up FLA or waiting until someone else is?

I've already done the State Director thing.  Doing it again would lead directly to divorce.

Also what is it that you want a shooting sport organization to do/support?

See the 1980 IHMSA rulebook.

Is tracking and maintaining records shot at the State/National level important to you ie a history of the group or not?

Sure.

are you interested in a postal format as well as formal competitions so those in areas without many members can still compete at some level?

No interest in postal.  

Do you think having a viable youth division is important?

 See the 1980 IHMSA rulebook.

As far as I know there are silhouette matches in the central area of FLA. Are they not meeting your needs?

There are?  
I don't know of any IHMSA matches near my home.  Any trips over 75 miles would result in the previously mentioned divorce.  

I shot a local NRA silhouette match a few years ago.  I showed up with a 6 1/2" M-29 and some plinking ammo.  I hadn't sighted in past 25 yds.  No spotters available.
I won the match outright.  That's not enough competition to interest me.

John

[PDM1]

John, there is a IHMSA match held about 30 miles away from you in Geneva, FL at SCGAA.  These matches are every month on the second weekend.  We just finished our annual Shoot the Sun match the last 4 days and had competitors from all over the country.  Hope you can make it out.

Paul

[Japle]

PDM1,

It's about 50 miles, but that's close enough.  Gotta form some 7R cases and load up!

Thanks,

John

[K2]

Thanks for the replies John.

I am also in favor of the much simplified rules.  

You need to separate IHMSA from Silhouette and also must realize that even in 1980 headquarters was not doing a good job of tracking the history of the sport.  Many of the problems that surfaced in the late 80's were laid down in the 1970's but took awhile to rear their ugly heads.  The sport is in its nadir now because it lacked a good foundation.  

On the lack of competition, that comes from a lack of shooters primarily.   If you are not willing to lead that is fine, but you may also die before silhouette has a rebirth because many are also waiting for someone else to lead.  A postal may be the only way for you to compete given the small nature of the sport currently.  

I am very much in favor of a real revolver category for your M29.  Outside of silly wet I know no one with a 10" barreled revolver, just too big to have any practical use.  Your 6 1/2 inch gun is just right!

Does that mean you are interested in heading up FLA or waiting until someone else is?

I've already done the State Director thing.  Doing it again would lead directly to divorce.

Also what is it that you want a shooting sport organization to do/support?

See the 1980 IHMSA rulebook.

Is tracking and maintaining records shot at the State/National level important to you ie a history of the group or not?

Sure.

are you interested in a postal format as well as formal competitions so those in areas without many members can still compete at some level?

No interest in postal.  

Do you think having a viable youth division is important?

 See the 1980 IHMSA rulebook.

As far as I know there are silhouette matches in the central area of FLA. Are they not meeting your needs?

There are?  
I don't know of any IHMSA matches near my home.  Any trips over 75 miles would result in the previously mentioned divorce.  

I shot a local NRA silhouette match a few years ago.  I showed up with a 6 1/2" M-29 and some plinking ammo.  I hadn't sighted in past 25 yds.  No spotters available.
I won the match outright.  That's not enough competition to interest me.

John

[Japle]

I am very much in favor of a real revolver category for your M29. Outside of silly wet I know no one with a 10" barreled revolver, just too big to have any practical use. Your 6 1/2 inch gun is just right!

Well, there's a little problem with that........

I sent the M-29 back to Smith and had them swap the 6 1/2" tube for a 4" one.  They whacked off the ramp front sight and installed a pinned-in Patridge and installed a narow, smooth trigger.  I did an action job and had it hard-chromed at Accurate Plating & Weaponry.  Loaded with Cor-Bon .44 Specials, it's now a (very large) carry gun.  

Still got my Wichita 7R, though.  

John

[K2]

That would make a good short range course (100 yards 1/2 scale targets) revolver unless you had the adjustable rear replaced as well.  Of course finding good 6 inch revolvers is about as easy as falling out of bed, there are lots of them out there both used and new, that are very good shooters.  

Your 7R will be great for the freestyle games in BB.  It'll be a bit much in the recoil zone over the BR series but is certainly manageable.  

I am very much in favor of a real revolver category for your M29. Outside of silly wet I know no one with a 10" barreled revolver, just too big to have any practical use. Your 6 1/2 inch gun is just right!

Well, there's a little problem with that........

I sent the M-29 back to Smith and had them swap the 6 1/2" tube for a 4" one.  They whacked off the ramp front sight and installed a pinned-in Patridge and installed a narow, smooth trigger.  I did an action job and had it hard-chromed at Accurate Plating & Weaponry.  Loaded with Cor-Bon .44 Specials, it's now a (very large) carry gun.  

Still got my Wichita 7R, though.  

John

[41mafia]

Sorry I hadn't been in here for awhile. This topic seems to be picking up some steam. John, welcome to Florida. Come on over to Geneva and bring your 7R. We would be glad to have you. Since I am R-II Director, I welcome any suggestions you and anyone else may have. The forum I started out with precludes any Director from being put in a position that compromises his/her members. The apathy that has spread from the top down, needs to be reversed. The only ones who can cause change are the members themselves.  
My main peeve had always been, just because someone cannot attend the Internationals, who speaks for them. Then in 1998 at Oakridge,I finally realized, even if I did attend, it didn't count anyway. This has nothing to do with the present or recent Board, and I am not pointing fingers at anyone. Changes for the better started a while back and need to continue. I will vote based on the membership from R-II. Seems pretty simple to me.
 
Aarne
fortyonemag@cfl.rr.com

[K2]

I wish you the best Aarne!  If you fellows get things fixed it will be good for the sport.  I left over the finance mess and constantly changing and more and more complex rules that favored equipment that 99%+ of the shooting public simply doesn't own and has no interest in owning.  Simple rules for a simple game make sense.    

Sorry I hadn't been in here for awhile. This topic seems to be picking up some steam. John, welcome to Florida. Come on over to Geneva and bring your 7R. We would be glad to have you. Since I am R-II Director, I welcome any suggestions you and anyone else may have. The forum I started out with precludes any Director from being put in a position that compromises his/her members. The apathy that has spread from the top down, needs to be reversed. The only ones who can cause change are the members themselves.  
My main peeve had always been, just because someone cannot attend the Internationals, who speaks for them. Then in 1998 at Oakridge,I finally realized, even if I did attend, it didn't count anyway. This has nothing to do with the present or recent Board, and I am not pointing fingers at anyone. Changes for the better started a while back and need to continue. I will vote based on the membership from R-II. Seems pretty simple to me.
 
Aarne
fortyonemag@cfl.rr.com