Author Topic: .358 Norma Magnum (Read 14230 times)

kevin.303 · « **on:** January 06, 2003, 08:50:50 AM »

i've taken an interest in this now defunct cartridge. my grandpa used to have mauser-based rifle chambered in this caliber. the man and the gun are long gone but last time i was out at the farm i found about 2 dozen cases. a friend suggested re-chambering a lever-action .35 rem. for this cartridge.is this possible? any help or info would be greatly welcomed.

BW · « **Reply #1 on:** January 06, 2003, 10:27:52 AM »

Well I suspose it's possible, but not a very good idea.

The C.O.L. of the Norma Mag is probably too long to function through the Marlin (I'm guessing) action.

You'd be limited to using flat nosed bullets which are designed for tube magazine fed lever guns.

The twist in most 35 Remingtons is supose to be 1 in 16 inches (I just read that, there's no way I'd know it otherwise

), and that would probably be a bit slow for the norma mag.

I do like the cartridge though, just not in this application.

Daveinthebush · « **Reply #2 on:** January 06, 2003, 11:20:48 AM »

The operationg pressure of the two cartridges is vastly different. The Marlin won't take the pressure of the 350 Norma Mag..

"Maybe" a BLR or a 1895(?) might, but not the Marlin.

Joel · « **Reply #3 on:** January 06, 2003, 11:24:30 AM »

Not only is the COL way too long; 3.72" vs 2.525", the Norma is designed to operate at pressures way beyond what the Marlin can handle. Way beyond.

Dutch4122 · « **Reply #4 on:** January 07, 2003, 07:22:32 AM »

Daveinthebush I like the idea about a BLR re-barreled from .300 Win Mag to the .358 Norma Mag. I think that this would be the only way to get a .358 Norma Mag in a Lever Gun as the 1895 Marlin is basically a modified 336 action and is designed to handle the same kind of pressure (I think the MAX is around 40,000).

Still, a BLR in .358 NM would be a great project. :money:

kevin.303 · « **Reply #5 on:** January 07, 2003, 07:57:59 AM »

:grin: i was talking with my great uncle and he told me that my grandfather's rifle was an interarms Mk x. how available are these, andwhat would the damage to the bank account be? and it was the marlin 336 i was thinking of. i like the blr suggestion, but it would cost a hefty chunk of change. does anyone still make dies for the .358 NM :sniper:

DLH · « **Reply #6 on:** January 07, 2003, 02:23:39 PM »

I just started a rebarrel job in that cal!!!! I have 4- 35 Whelens 2 of them on Mauser 98 actions. I ordered a 26" Adams and Bennett Bbl. from Midway. and will order the reamer as soon as I finish the bolt face.
Bieng that I am CHEAP, I'm going to use 338 Win Mag cases, and open them up. RCBS makes dies as does redding. RCBS $108 ---- REDDING $46 From MIDSOUTH. :-D

Advocate · « **Reply #7 on:** January 07, 2003, 02:33:33 PM »

DLH: Four .35 Whelens? Is that all? Is that the best you can do?

Daveinthebush · « **Reply #8 on:** January 07, 2003, 02:51:01 PM »

Since they already make it is 30/06 I emailed them and asked how hard it would be to make one in .35 Whelen. NO answer. Lets see... they have the right action for the job, .35 caliber barrels......seems like it would not take much to do except a chamber reamer in .35 Whelen.

I would buy one in a second!

DLH · « **Reply #9 on:** January 07, 2003, 02:55:38 PM »

I like the 35!! I have 2 in Mausers, 1 in a Remington 7400, & 1 in a Thompson Encore PISTOL!!!! Thompson's custom shop FOXRIDGE OUTFITTERS made it, and BLACK MESA ported it. It was a real handfull before it was ported!! Still takes 2 hands now or it dents the forehead! I haven't killed anything with it, just paper. but you should see the range officer face when he see what you are stuffing in that gun!!!!

Advocate · « **Reply #10 on:** January 07, 2003, 03:06:56 PM »

DLH: I have a military mauser I would like to "Whelenize" but it is too short. Are all of your mausers commercial, or did you have then altered for the '06 length .35 Whelen rounds?

DLH · « **Reply #11 on:** January 07, 2003, 03:25:14 PM »

Both are Military, 1 CZ24 the other is German, both are 98s.
The actions are long enough for 30/06 so they are long enough for the 35 Whelen. both cases are 63mm long ( the orignal 8mm is 57 mm) all 3 cartridges mentioned here have a rim size of .473" so no modification is needed to the bolt face. I can't speak for the small ring mausers i.e. 95s 96s, but the 98 action is perfect for the whelen!!! :-D

sideironjohn · « **Reply #12 on:** February 08, 2003, 07:09:25 PM »

Never shot one myself, but on paper it really tickles my fancy. About the same energy as factory 375 H&H, and better downrange w/ same bullet weight. It's on my "Top 10" to be sure.
Don't think I'd go to alot of trouble to find a gun for a couple dozen cases, though; they aren't anywhere near valuable. Norma sells them still I believe, and they can be made with Win Mag cases.
Dies are around $100, right somebody?

DLH · « **Reply #13 on:** February 09, 2003, 03:53:29 AM »

Just bought a set of REDDING dies for the 358 NM from MIDSOUTH for $48 something/ about a month ago!!

onesonek · « **Reply #14 on:** February 09, 2003, 05:00:59 AM »

AA, as far as I know the BLR, is factory chambered for the 300Win Mag. O>

sideironjohn · « **Reply #15 on:** February 09, 2003, 12:27:24 PM »

DLH: yeah, you mentioned that! Sorry.

Dand · « **Reply #16 on:** February 09, 2003, 08:33:18 PM »

cruise the gun auctions and you are likely to find an affordable 358 Norma. I see them now and then. Now that Nosler makes some good partitions and Barnes makes some X bullets the 358 Norma has bullets worthy of its power. Other premium makes are out there too.

Daveinthebush - I'm with you. Ever snce they came out with BLRs in the 06 family, I've long wondered why Browning didn't make the BLR in 35 Whelen. I read they plan to make a few in 358 win this year or next. I'd think they'd be better off going to 35 Whelen.

kevin.303 · « **Reply #17 on:** February 11, 2003, 06:26:46 AM »

i have ateacher who is gonig to teach a bit of gunsmithing and who will build me .358 for a low price provided i obtain the basic action and help him with it. i was thinking ether a P-17 or a spanish mauser

kevin.303 · « **Reply #18 on:** September 16, 2008, 07:14:04 PM »

well, almost 6 years later i finally have one, a custom built on 1903 Springfield, Douglas Premium barrel, and a rather nice boyds stock. i can't help but chuckle when i look at my original post of using a 336 to build one. my knowledge and experiance has come a long way since then....

doeroller · « **Reply #19 on:** October 25, 2008, 07:29:24 AM »

I have had one for the last 20 years. It is a rebarreled Ruger 77, that was a 7 mag. The 358 Norma is not complicated to deal with. 338 Win Mag brass necked up and fireformed with cheap 357 pistol bullets work fine. The case is a little short, but after a couple of full power handloads, the case length is just fine. I have used 180-225gr bullets. Powders I have used are 4064, 4895, and 4350. Of course the 4350 is with the 225 gr bullets. Get a chronograph and work up watching for pressure signs. You will find most 358 Norma data on the mild side. I starting using an old Speer Manual and the data there was on the hot side for my gun.

I would suggest rebarreling like I did. I think this would be the best bang for the buck. My gun is very accurate. It shoots 180 gr pistol bullets real well at 100yds. I have used my gun for nilgai, bear, caribou, elk, and deer. Love mine.

kevin.303 · « **Reply #20 on:** October 25, 2008, 04:53:45 PM »

what load are you using for the pistol bullets? thats one thing i haven't tried yet. mine loves the 225 gr Nosler BT(discontinued) that will be my deer load this year.

doeroller · « **Reply #21 on:** November 12, 2008, 02:11:47 PM »

Sorry for the late reply. My fireform load is 70gr of 4350 with a 180 tmj pistol bullet. I have shot deer with the 180 tmj over 78gr of 4064. Be careful this load is max. I use 338 mag brass necked up and fireformed. Trim brass to square case mouth. The brass will be a little short, but will lengthen after a couple of full power handloads.

Hank08 · « **Reply #22 on:** November 13, 2008, 06:09:04 AM »

I built my .358 NM in 1967. M98 and Douglas premium barrel 26". At the time the only decent bullet was the Speer 250 Spitzer. with 4350 chronoed 2890 very accurate but a real kicker. never had to shoot any deer more than once though.
Now I use a 200 gr. Barnes X at 3200. In 1967 i thought I was being overcharged at $16 for the RCBS dies. I bought 100 Norma cases which I'm still using. A few yrs. ago I cut the barrel down to 20" which cost me about 100 FPS but made it handle a little better.
H08

Hank08 · « **Reply #23 on:** November 18, 2008, 05:57:58 AM »

Here she is, still looks pretty good after 41 yrs. many yrs. ago I shot a 2 1/4"group with this .358 NM at 400 yds. with the Speer 250 gr spitzer and 78 grs. 4350. had a 3x9 Leupold on it then and that was a 5 shot group. She's still a shooter.
H08

Cowboybart · « **Reply #24 on:** May 01, 2009, 03:12:40 AM »

Mine is a Rem 700 that started off as a 35 Whelen. I still have the reamer thinking that I'll do another one someday. I don't know why, one 358 Norma is enough. Maybe I'll send the reamer back and get a 416 pilot put on it. I'm getting close to needing that for a 416 Taylor project.

At one time Barnes made 300gr bullets for the 35 cal. I think Woodleigh is the only one making pills over 250gr now.

efremtags · « **Reply #25 on:** May 03, 2009, 01:56:26 AM »

358 is a good caliber in theory, but they lack the bullet selection that 338 and 375 have.

I had a 35Whelen bug for a while, but that was before they had more readily available ammo for it. I scrapped the idea and got a 300WM instead.

I see shy sentimental reasons drive us for a caliber. My favorite is a 7mm mauser becasue that is what my dad hunted with. I fortunately have that gun and re-finished it.

Win 88 · « **Reply #26 on:** June 01, 2009, 08:04:05 AM »

Have a look at Norma´s homepage - www.norma.cc - choose the english section. There is some info about the cartridge and some loads. Norma make the brass, so if you find a dealer, you can go with the right stamp at the head.

Here in Sweden this cartridge is known as efficient on moose, bear and large hogs. The most common rifle is the old Husqvarna 1651, a rough shoulder kicker.

Pete

WL44 · « **Reply #27 on:** August 03, 2009, 09:19:14 PM »

I really like this story - particularly the fact that you finally did it years later. I have a few of these experiences too....

The 358 Norma seems like a great caliber on paper and I've spoken to guys who've used them with great success. In both the US and Africa.

I agree that bullets aren't that available (I looked at a 358 at one point and I'm still considering one). Nosler Partitions I'm told work well and if you want something really tough check out Rhino Bullets from South Africa. They shoot very well in my 375 and others swear by them in smaller calibers, but there are probably more accurate bullets for long range and better BC's.

mauser98us · « **Reply #28 on:** August 04, 2009, 05:22:42 AM »

I had a Schulz and Larsen in 358 Norma mag. Took many elk with it . Fine rifle, fine round, along with the 308 Norma mag amd the 7x61 sharpe and hart.

SCGunNut · « **Reply #29 on:** August 07, 2009, 05:28:11 AM »

I've got an original 1961 vintage Husqvarna Crown Grade in .358 Norma. It is superbly accurate with both factory and handloads. Wish I could report knocking off numerous bruins and moose with it but alas, so far it has only stoned a few whitetails while in my possession. I hope to change that someday...