Author Topic: What would you do? (Read 749 times)

Darrell H · « **on:** March 21, 2004, 03:29:07 PM »

Hi folks:

I have recently had a .308 Win. built on a 700 action. The gun is a beauty and feels wonderful. As I said, I started with a Remington 700 action, had the action blueprinted and a trigger job performed, installed a #4 contour 24" Shilen barrel, and pillar bedded the action into a McMillan fiberglass stock. I topped it off with a Leupold VXIII 3.5-10 scope. All totaled up, I have about $2200.00 in this rifle.

Now here's the kicker. It has the distinct honor of being the most inaccurate rifle I own! :shock: I have just received it back for the third time from the gunsmith who built it . On the last trip back to its creator, it was sent to Shilen who said that their barrel was perfect and should perform superbly.

All I can say is that I have tried 125, 150, 165, and 180 grain bullets of various manufacturers with a number of different powders and I get groups in the 1.5" to 3" range. No big deal if it were a factory rifle, but I would expect better from a rifle costing this much. While working with this rifle, I have been doing load development for a custom 30-30 Contender barrel from Bullberry and a custom .257 Roberts Encore barrel (also from Bullberry) and these two break-action guns are shooting rings around this bolt action gun!!!

I have shot the gun nearly 700 times by now and I'm tired of wasting powder. I've had it nearly a year now. The gunsmith has offered to rebarrel the gun at no cost for labor (I woulld have to buy another barrel), but I just wonder if I trust his work. I'm really considering sending this bolt action gun to Bullberry to see if they can rebarrel it and get it to shooting. I'm so far into this project now, the only way out is to get the gun shooting well.

I thought .308's were supposed to be accurate!! If nothing else, this gun has taught me patience!

Thanks for allowing me to vent!!

X

Coyote Hunter · « **Reply #1 on:** March 21, 2004, 03:46:03 PM »

Wow - $2200 and it still doesn't shoot? Don't know what I would do, but I sure wouldn't be happy!

newfalguy101 · « **Reply #2 on:** March 21, 2004, 04:02:15 PM »

Well let me first say that as I have never been in the place yourself, let me say I feel for you.

I guess I would send it back to the smith and tell him to keep it till it shoots the way it should, or let him pay for someone to fix it for him!!

The way I see it, even FACTORY .308's with good ammo should be able to shoot smaller than 1 1/2 inch with many models with match ammo shooting under 1 inch!

So I guess it kinda comes down to what you expected the gun to do and if you made sure your smith KNEW what you wanted,

even if it seems like common sense that if a guy springs for a Shilen barrel he probably expects match accuracy, if you never told him that, I dont know that I can blame the builder.

Something else, as I reread your post I dont see where you shot FACTORY ammo to get a baseline for comparison.

That may prove interesting, assuming it has a "Match" chamber, try a box of the Federal 168 and see what it will do.

btw, if Shillen checked and confirmed the barrel is good, I would look at the action as the source of the problem?? or the bedding??

As I said before, I have never been in your situatuion, so this is all what ifs and I would do's

just my opinion and my advice is worth no more or less than what you paid for it.

leverfan · « **Reply #3 on:** March 21, 2004, 09:49:03 PM »

That's a lot of work to do to a rifle and still not get tight groups, that's for sure. I see two possibilities here, the first one being that something is loose. It wouldn't hurt to double check all the screws on the rifle, mounts, and rings, if you haven't already done so. It's pillar bedded, so there shouldn't be a bedding problem. I would also put on another scope, one that you trust to be accurate, and see if that's the problem. At the same time, I would take that Leupold and put it on a gun of known accuracy, just to cross-check everything. Since you are able to shoot your other guns well, I assume we can figure that the nut behind the trigger has not worked loose, and eliminate that possibility. :grin:

If nothing in the rifle or the scope is loose, then the problem may be that your gun was put together by a gun assembler, rather than a gun smith. It's hard to say, without knowing the fellow's track record. The first possibility would certainly be the easiest to remedy, the second depends on how willing this guy is to back his work. Good luck, and I look forward to hearing how things go. It eases the pain that I feel when I think about the lemon Winchester that I just bought, and misery loves company. You do have about 1,700 more reasons to be miserable than me, though! :-)

Dave in WV · « **Reply #4 on:** March 22, 2004, 02:59:09 AM »

I may be wrong but I believe a #4 contour barrel is pretty heavy. If so, maybe you could try shims under the barrel near the fore end. The barreled action may be applying torque to the stock with a lot of weight out front. I read a bit about bedding a couple of years ago. I remember reading about target shooters bedding the entire length of the barrel due to the barrel's weight pulling on the rear of the action.

Darrell H · « **Reply #5 on:** March 22, 2004, 04:34:02 AM »

Thanks for the replies guys. It's nice just to have someone to vent to. To answer a few of your questions, I have tried several factory loads (including the Federal Match King 168 grain loads) as well as my own handloads, I have tried three different scopes on the rifle, and I have tried putting pressure on the barrel as well. Nothing seems to work.

I have honestly given up on the gun. I guess I'm down to three choices 1) sell the gun
2) send the gun back to the gunsmith for a rebarrel job
3) send it to another gunsmith for an evaluation

Option #2 seems to make the most sense. The gunsmith came highly recommended and he is sincerely interested in making the gun shoot.

Thanks again guys,

X

SHW · « **Reply #6 on:** March 22, 2004, 04:48:32 AM »

I am currently have a gun built for me. If it turns out like yours, I will probably send it back to the smith & let him shoot it. My smith guarantees 1/2 MOA, we discussed this up front. If he can't get it to shoot, then it is his problem. I am starting with a 700 action, Jewell trigger, #4 stainless fluted Lilja barrel, fluted bolt, & mcmillan stock that will be pillar bedded.

Of your choices, I would go with #3 first, another qualified opinion can be helpful.

Omaha-BeenGlockin · « **Reply #7 on:** March 22, 2004, 05:43:15 AM »

I would REALLY(think--extreme predjudice) push the original builder to make it right----AT NO EXTRA COST----you've already spent enough----for that kind of money it should be right---the first time.

Darrell H · « **Reply #8 on:** March 22, 2004, 06:56:04 AM »

Another thought...

In the gun builder's opinion the gun will shoot, once I find the right load. Like I said earlier, I'm about 700 rounds into shooting this rifle right now. It's going to be worn out before I find that "secret" recipe! It has been my experience that either a gun will shoot or it will not. This gun has shot several sub 1/2" groups. But the next time I shoot the same load, the groups will open up to as much as 3". Talk about inconsistent!! Meanwhile, the Bullberry Encore barrel that I have been trying shoots almost everything I have tried into 1/2" to 1" groups at 100 yards.

X

Omaha-BeenGlockin · « **Reply #9 on:** March 22, 2004, 07:32:41 AM »

Have you tried a different---"known"-----scope???

Darrell H · « **Reply #10 on:** March 22, 2004, 09:10:29 AM »

Omaha-

Yes. I have tried three different scopes including the scope that is on the rifle currently, a 4-12 Nikon Monarch, and a 3-9 Nikon Monarch that is on my Browning 30-06 that shoots MOA with anything I feed it.

Thanks,
X

dbuck · « **Reply #11 on:** March 22, 2004, 09:53:11 AM »

I just had a Remington 700 done just like you, but I had a Kreiger heavy barrel (1 in 10 twist) put on and had the action blueprinted and trigger job done, Kreiger did all the work. I have a H&S sniper stock on mine and this rifle is a tact driver at 200 yards (3/4" groups using Sierra 168 match with 4064 power).

The 308 is pretty easy to load for. If Federal 168 match doesn't work then something is really wrong. I assume you could take two index cards and slide them between the barrel and the stock all the way back to the action, right. Did you tighten up the front set screw before the rear one and torque it using allen head screws.

The gunsmith should make this right. When you have a custom rifle he should guarantee at least 1 MOA at 100 yards. I hate to say this, but I could buy a Savage 308 heavy barrel that would shoot alot better then yours out of the box. Thats what you paid the man for, accuracy.

dbuck

Rustbucket · « **Reply #12 on:** March 23, 2004, 03:29:42 AM »

Just get a Savage!

Rogue Ram · « **Reply #13 on:** March 23, 2004, 04:32:13 AM »

I have the same problem you do, and I WISH I had your money into it! The first smith "did" me big time, the second smith has rebuilt this thing entirely and it still doesn't shoot. He played with it some more and now it doesn't feed right.

If your smith does not have precision equipment, walk away. Did he really blueprint it? Does he recut the receiver threads? How does he chamber a barrel? Compare that against sites for known gun and barrel makers and see the difference.

Dump the gun. Learn a big lesson, and take solace in the fact you are not alone.

RR