6.5mm question

[charles p]

Just read an article about the merrits of the 6.5/284.  Made me wonder how much different would be from a 6.5WSM.  Seems to me that a 6.5WSM would be a logical caliber and one that is not flooded with other similar offerings.
 
I realize the US shooters have never embraced this diameter.  I for one, have always wanted one.

[RevJim]

 I used a 6.5/284 for several years. Since it was on a Mod 700 short action, and I was only using it for antelope and such, I stayed with the 120/125 Noslers. It was extremely flat shooting, bucked the wind very well, and made fast kills. I preferred the 120BT over the Partition for best results. I would shoot elk with that 125 partition if so desired, it was that good. A 6.5 WSM would be a neat Wildcat, but I doubt it would ever make it to a factory design, especially in todays climate. Its almost impossible to find any .338 or .300 RCM ammo, and those are neat little rifles, good calibers, but ammo too iffy.

[roper]

Just read an article about the merrits of the 6.5/284.  Made me wonder how much different would be from a 6.5WSM.  Seems to me that a 6.5WSM would be a logical caliber and one that is not flooded with other similar offerings.
 
I realize the US shooters have never embraced this diameter.  I for one, have always wanted one.

I shot the 6.5x284 Norma which is SAAMI spec OAL 3.228" and that's the one Savage is chamber for.   The 6.5WSM has some following here as a wildcat rd but don't see it happening factory rifle.  The 6.5x284 is a known barrel burner pass 3000fps with 140/142gr VLD bullets and you have that same problem with 6.5WSM.  If you look at some of the F-Class shooters the 6.5x284 and 260 are still being use and have pretty good following.  Lapua making brass for the 6.5x47 Lapua and 6.5 Grendal and interest in the 6.5 Creedmoor so good mix of 6.5 shooter here.

[D Fischer]

As I understood it, the problem with the 284 case is that you can't seat long bullet's out and still fit the magazine. I think the 6.5 Rem Mag had the same problem. I have a 6.5x55 and a 6.5x06 and don't have that problem with either. i've always felt the 284 case was over rated, just to long to work well in a short action with long bullet's.

[Sweet 6.5]

Get your self a 6.5x55 and ream it to AI. you will get very close to 3000fps
with 140gr and will still have very good barrel life. Soft on brass and at low
pressure.
 
I am very keen on doing it with my CZ550 6.5x55. I can't find a reamer here so
I will have to import one form you guys in the US. But then again I am so happy
with the 6.5x55 I am not sure if it is worth the money!
 
 

[Siskiyou]

 I have given my 6.5X55 to my SIL.  But do not misunderstand; I like the case and the diameter of the bullets.  The mild recoil is a plus for the performance. I was getting 2600 fps with a 140-grain Remington C-L with a listed maximum charge of H4831.  Loading data is formed around the pressure limits of Swedish Mauser M96 action.  The action for my sporterized rifle was manufacture in 1916.   Based on case measurement for expansion, stretching, and primer I feel that I could have added powder but I stopped.  According to one source the case will hold approximately 55.0 grains depending on the manufacture.  I should note that my SIL and granddaughters love shooting the 6.5X55 because of its accuracy and light recoil.
 
As noted in earlier post the 6.5-284 Norma is reported barrel burner. I think this comes from the competition crowd that are maximizing velocity shooting very long ranges, and firing more rounds then the average hunter.   But that is the user’s choice and I would not be critical of my brother because he owns one.  The problem is the 6.5 (.264) addiction.  He also owns a modern 6.5x55, 6.5-257 Roberts, a 6.5 Remington Magnum, and 6.5-06.  I have watched him search for 6.5 Remington Magnum cases and 284 Winchester cases for a long time.   I think he has caught up with itch.  I almost forgot the .256-3000 what is a wildcat using the old Savage 250-3000 case opened up to .264 caliber. 
 
His 6.5 Remington is built on a Mark X long action and has a 26-inch barrel.  This rifle handles long bullets without a problem.  I think the key is to keep the velocity of this rifle and other 6.5 rifles using 140-grains under 3000 fps if barrel life is an issue for the users.  I think that those that get 3000 fps out of it and the 6.5-284 are using barrels in the 26-28 inch range. 
 
I came very close to offering to buy my brother’s 6.5-Remington Magnum from him because it is my idea of what it should be with 24-inch barrel.  But when I ran the known velocity numbers over my Chrony with my 140-grain 270 Winchester load with published 6.5 Remington Magnum data the 6.5 Remington is 1-inch flatter at a 1000 yards.

Admittedly my success on deer was a 6.5X55 with a 23-inch barrel.  The ammunition was military surplus with the ball FMJ replaced with a 140-grain Nosler Partition averaging 2553 fps 15 feet from the muzzle.  A 6.5X55 on a modern action with a 23 or 24-inch barrel has a lot to offer.  When I loaded for the 6.5X55 I worked up to the maximum published load using H4831 without any issues.  Depending on the rifle with a modern action such as the Remington 700, CZ 550, Winchester 70, Ruger 77, and the Savage 110 I believe additional velocity can be had.  Hornady Super performance is putting out close to 200 fps more that the old military load.  Some will argue that the M96 action can be pushed beyond the recommend maximum but that is not for me.
 
I like sweet 6.5 improved 6.5x55 concept.  The improved wildcat case can let the reloader take advantage of the case volume of the 6.5x55 case when developing loads using powders in the H4831 burning rate.  The improved chamber will handle the standard 6.5x55 and the improved loading.  The Improved case should come close to achieving 6.5-284 and 6.5 Remington Magnum velocities.  In a jam it is far easier to find 6.5X55 ammunition on the shelf then the others.  I was surprised the other day when I was in a Sportsmen’s Warehouse looking at the depleted shelves of ammunition and there were three or four boxes of Winchester 6.5X55, and a box of 6.5 X 284 Nosler.
 
Back when I gave the 6.5x55 to the SIL I showed him sweet 6.5 excellent posts on the 6.5.  Very good post and pictures by sweet 6.5.

[cwlongshot]

I built my 6.5 on a 270 case & a Argentine '98 Mauser action. It shoots 125 BT billets at close to 3400 fps and 1/2" MOA @100.

142g shoot even better!!!!! But I haven't chrono graphed them.

I shot one deer with a 160RN at about 2600 with little expansion. I did not hit bones and nearly lost the deer. Where it not for the long rane shoots iLife of this caliber and the fact that he had to stop and look back at the other side of the field.

I shot a Corsican ram and a Spanish goat with two 125g partitions at about 3200 fps. Complete pass thrus and quarter sized exits.

It's a wonderful caliber!

CW

[Siskiyou]

cwlongshot:  You got my attention using the 270 over the 30-06.  You must have gone that route based on an advantage or convenience? 

[cwlongshot]

cwlongshot:  You got my attention using the 270 over the 30-06.  You must have gone that route based on an advantage or convenience?

The 270 case is slightly different then the '06, but mostly I did it because I have so many 270 cases...

CW

[Siskiyou]

cwlongshot:
 
Understand that some like the 280 Remington Case for wildcats.  I believe it is because the front shoulder is a little more foreward then on the 270 and 30-06 cases.  Plus the challenge of finding 280 cases. 

How long is the barrel on your rifle?
 
I am conflicted on barrel length.  When I was a kid we went to town and visited the Wards store.  They had a stack of surplus Swede 6.5 carbines and I fell in love.  A love never fullfilled.  I thought they were just right for the low country brush fields.

My thinking change a little when I grew older, and moved.  New hunting spot provide opportunities to ambush deer three and four hundred yards out across a deep arroyo.  The ridge was covered with heavy brush and the deer would quickly disappear if I worked the ridge.  But were not alarmed when I slipped  into postion on the next ridge.  At that point a rifle with a 24-inch barrel might have given just a little more bang on the far side.  It all comes down to a compromise.  The easy of fighting brush and the efficiency of taking the shot; close or distant.
 
 
 

[cwlongshot]

Mine is a Shillen match barrel @ 26". So I do have a small vel advantage as well!

I built this as a long range hunting rifle for light big game. I have yet to really use it for such... The first animal I took with it was that Corcican ram at 250+- yards. 125 BT bullet. I smacked him right behind the shoulder. My guide told me to shoot him again, but I could see the growing tennis ball sized red spot direct behind the shoulder. The shot was not needed as he made a step and crashed on his chin.



CW

[Siskiyou]

Nice ram, and very nice mount.

Sounds like you have a very good combination.  The high B.C. of the .264 bullets is hard to ignore.

You mention the 160-grain bullet.  I am aware of an incident where a hunter killed two bucks in on shot with the 160-grain Hornady.  I thought that was poor judgment on the hunter’s part because he filled his tag and another hunter tag with that shot.
Back in the late 50’s and 60’s table top loads of the Swede’s were sold.  I am amazed at how many families had them at that time and still have them.  A good friend had one as a kid and moved on to the 30-06.  But pleasant memories are there.  When his son started hunting he bought him a Ruger 77 Mark II in 6.5 Swede.  Suspect that rifle will be passed to his grandson in one or two years.
A great rifle and caliber for a hunter start to finish.

This morning’s paper had a Cabela’s ad for a Model 70 Classic in 264 Winchester.  I had to look it up on line.  It has a 26” barrel as the 264 should have.  I can remember all the burned out barrel controversy regarding the 264 Magnum.  I have known hunters that have had them for 40-years and have not burned out barrel.  I came close to buying a .264 in 1968 but I had a young family and baby needed new shoes.
Hunters would like the benefits of a combination short-long barrel but there is a price to be paid. I backed away from the 264 when I went looking for a second rifle because the only ones to be found at that time had 24-inch barrels that produced a lot of muzzle blast and reduced ballistics.

I think you are very wise in building your 6.5-270 with a 26-inch barrel.

I realize there are fast and slow barrels.  I blame it on the Chrony.  I was out one cool April shooting my Savage 110 and Remington 700.  Both rifles have 22-inch barrels and are chambered for the 270 Winchester.  I was testing 140-grain WW Silvertip boattails pushed by WMR.  A very accurate combination but I was disappointed when the Chrony showed the Remington getting an average velocity 30 fps slower than the Savage.  Fortunately worked kept me busy and I was on the road a lot.  When home in the late fall I was able to take a deer with the slow rifle and it was consistently accurate.  And I took a buck with the 6.5x55 which is much slower by 300+ fps with the 140-grain Nosler PT.  That load sent me a message, dummy do not buy another barrel.