biden.We will raise taxes to top earners by a $trillion.

[powderman]

Biden acknowledges he, Obama want to raise $1 trillion in taxes on top earners  Published October 05, 2012
FoxNews.com     

•    Oct. 4, 2012: Vice President Joe Biden speaks in Council Bluffs, Iowa, Thursday. (AP)

  For everyone who claims the Obama administration wants a $1 trillion tax hike, Joe Biden has a message: Yes, we do.
The vice president was referring Thursday to the Democrats' pledge to let the Bush-era tax rates for households making $250,000 and up expire at the end of the year, while maintaining current rates for other Americans. Republicans have called for maintaining the current rates for all Americans.
 
The call for a tax hike on top earners was hardly new, but Biden's characteristic bluntness gave Republicans fresh fodder to criticize the Democratic ticket just days after the vice president said the middle class has been buried during the past four years.
 
"On top of the trillions of dollars in spending that we have already cut, we're going to ask the wealthy to pay more. My heart breaks. Come on man," Biden said, during a stop in the battleground state of Iowa.
 
Biden said Romney and other Republicans often say "'Obama and Biden want to raise taxes by a trillion dollars.' Guess what? Yes, we do in one regard: We want to let that trillion dollar tax cut expire so the middle class doesn't have to bear the burden of all that money going to the super-wealthy. That's not a tax raise. That's called fairness where I come from."
Mitt Romney's running mate pounced on the quote at a campaign stop Thursday night in Virginia.
 
"What we don’t need is a trillion-dollar tax increase," Ryan said. "What we don’t need is a tax increase on our successful job creators that will cost us 700,000 jobs in just two years."
Ryan Williams, a spokesman for Romney, said Biden's comment revealed an uncomfortable truth for Democrats.
"Fresh off admitting that America's middle class has been `buried' over the last four years, Vice President Biden went a step further today and fully embraced the president's job-killing tax increases. The choice facing Americans in this election gets clearer every day," Williams said.
 
Just Tuesday, Biden said that middle class has been "buried" during the past four years, a statement that Republicans immediately seized upon as an unwitting indictment of the Obama administration. It is all part of a pattern in which Republicans have characterized the former U.S. senator as a gaffe-prone liability for Obama on the campaign trail, trying to undermine his role as a vocal, effective surrogate.
 
But Biden is taking aim of his own, saying that Republican presidential nominee Mitt Romney renounced his own tax cut during Wednesday's presidential debate.
At a campaign stop in Iowa, where early voting has already begun, Biden said Romney and running mate Paul Ryan have proposed a $5 trillion tax cut that is the "centerpiece" of their campaign.
 
During the debate, Romney denied he plans to cut taxes, saying an across-the-board cut in tax rates will be offset by the elimination of unspecified deductions and exemptions.
"Last night we found out (Romney) doesn't have a $5 trillion tax cut. I guess he outsourced that to China," Biden quipped.
 
While reviewers generally said Romney scored more political points than Obama during the first presidential debate Wednesday night, Biden insisted the president had done well.
Obama "put forward a clear, specific plan" during the debate, Biden told about 650 people at the Mid-America Center in Council Bluffs. But he said Obama had trouble figuring out Romney's positions on issues.
 
"It's hard to keep up" with Romney and Ryan, Biden said. "You never know what game Gov. Romney is going to come with."
While many of his attacks were delivered with a smile, Biden said Romney's flip-flops on taxes and failure to offer specifics raised questions about his character.
 
"Ultimately, presidential races, unlike any other race, get down to character. They get down to the character of the man or woman and the character of their convictions: Do they mean what they say and will they do what they say," Biden said. "What I find fascinating, though, is that on nearly every issue, they don't tell you what they are for anymore, and they deliberately misrepresent what they say we are for. You saw it again last night in the debate."
Biden's visit to Iowa was his sixth this year. Obama won Iowa in 2008, and polls show him with a narrow lead this year.
The Associated Press contributed to this report.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/10/04/biden-acknowledges-obama-want-to-raise-1t-in-taxes-on-wealthy/#ixzz28QcbBJgo

[magooch]

I remember how well it worked for Mondale to say that he would raise taxes if elected.  Keep up your good work, Joe. 

[painted horse]

I remember how well it worked for Mondale to say that he would raise taxes if elected.  Keep up your good work, Joe.

.
People are further along now understanding how TPTB operates, except so-called conservatives. BHO might have to pull out all stops and divide the nation along majority have nots and the minority have mores.  If they do this and he does not win...then we know the election was rigged.
.
...TM7

Well I belong in the "have a little group", excuse me if I read your post incorrectly, but are you saying, if I have two cows and my neighbor has none, I should give him one of mine?? Or is it more like, the people who have educated themselves, worked hard, made good decisions, and have made "more" money, should be penalized for this and give their earned dollars to those who have done none of the above? Sounds like socialism to me...I apologize if I misunderstood what you're saying..

[garbhead]

This should only matter to the people on here actually in the top 10%.....The top earners don't give a crap about any of us on here, why should any of us be concerned about them?

[rio grande]

I remember how well it worked for Mondale to say that he would raise taxes if elected.  Keep up your good work, Joe.

.
People are further along now understanding how TPTB operates, except so-called conservatives. BHO might have to pull out all stops and divide the nation along majority have nots and the minority have mores.  If they do this and he does not win...then we know the election was rigged.
.
...TM7

Well I belong in the "have a little group", excuse me if I read your post incorrectly, but are you saying, if I have two cows and my neighbor has none, I should give him one of mine?? Or is it more like, the people who have educated themselves, worked hard, made good decisions, and have made "more" money, should be penalized for this and give their earned dollars to those who have done none of the above? Sounds like socialism to me...I apologize if I misunderstood what you're saying..

We're not talking about two cows.
We're talking about $250,000 on up.
We're talking about returning to previous tax rates.
Go for it I say.

That's a start.

Then how about raising the cap on Social Security to 90% of taxable earnings. As AARP suggests.
That is also only a return to prior policy and effects only 6% of taxpayers.

Call it what you will.  I'm tired of working men and women supporting the lifestyles of the rich.

[LONGTOM]

First off let me say that I think Biden is about the best thing Romney/Ryan have going for them so far!!! 
He seems to stick his foot in his mouth about every time he opens it.
 
I am with painted horse on this part.

Or is it more like, the people who have educated themselves, worked hard, made good decisions, and have made "more" money, should be penalized for this and give their earned dollars to those who have done none of the above?

Man, I can't stand it when people whine and complain about someone who is successful because they worked and saved all their life often doing without things just to get ahead while others choose to sit on their butts and do nothing, just waiting and even expecting a free handout from the government which in turn has to come out of the pockets of those that work and pay taxes.
It is not only the wealthy that has to pay for this but all working Americans, but they don't care as long as they get theirs!
They are nothing more then a bunch of lazy bums, parasites on society!!!
 
Our founding fathers didn't set our government up to be the provider for those to lazy to work.
There are those that truly need help and I am all for helping those, as we should, but we were never meant to support the world.
 

The top earners don't give a crap about any of us on here, why should any of us be concerned about them?

Please don't take my reply to this the wrong way but you should be concerned because if it wasn't for the "RICH" then all of us would be in trouble.
For it is the rich that build the factories and businesses that employ the millions of workers in this land.
Take the rich out of the equation and about everyone would be out of work.
In fact, if it wasn't for the rich this country may not even exist for it was those same rich people like GETTY, ASTOR, VANDERBILT, MORGAN, ROCKEFELLER, CARNEGIE, MELLON, FORD that built and paid for this country.
Now we have people like TURNER, GATES, DELL, WALTON, TRUMP and so on that are leading the way just as the ones before them.
Some of you don't seem to grasp that without the rich paying what they do both in taxes and in wages we would all be up S#*! creek.
I don't have the numbers as far as what percentage of what class pays X amount of taxes, nor do I care to look them up because numbers can be construed any way a person wants them to help their side.
I can tell you that the so called super rich pay way more then their share and without them our government would fail overnight at the rate we are spending.
You want to blame someone then blame congress for the waste they spend every second.
Don't blame the rich.
That dog just don't hunt anymore!!!
 
 
LONGTOM
 

[BUGEYE]

LONGTOM, you are correct.  when you hear people complaining about the rich, it's just the green monster rearing his ugly head.
I am not a millionaire for one of two reasons.  I'm either too lazy, or too stupid.

liberals and anarchists are fighting class warfare.

[powderman]

 

[rio grande]

LONGTOM, you are correct.  when you hear people complaining about the rich, it's just the green monster rearing his ugly head.
I am not a millionaire for one of two reasons.  I'm either too lazy, or too stupid.

liberals and anarchists are fighting class warfare.

Ask Warren Buffett about class warfare - he should know...

"There’s class warfare, all right,” Mr. Buffett said, “but it’s my class, the rich class, that’s making war, and we’re winning.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/26/business/yourmoney/26every.html

"There's only one thing worse than a knee-jerk liberal, and that's a knee-pad conservative."
-Ed Abbey

[rio grande]

"...if it wasn't for the rich this country may not even exist for it was those same rich people like GETTY, ASTOR, VANDERBILT, MORGAN, ROCKEFELLER, CARNEGIE, MELLON, FORD that built and paid for this country.
Now we have people like TURNER, GATES, DELL, WALTON, TRUMP and so on that are leading the way just as the ones before them."
-LONGTOM, as posted above.

LONGTOM, all I can say to that is the bosses need the workers far more than the workers need the bosses.
Can we work together? Of course. But it is a matter of give and take. Fair and equitable for both sides.
May God help us all.

[BUGEYE]

LONGTOM, all I can say to that is the bosses need the workers far more than the workers need the bosses.

the Church I attend is in a very affluent area and have a few millionaires.
believe me, the bosses don't need anyone.  all they have to do is cash-out and let the workers fend for themselves.
unless of course, your obama succeeds in implementing communism which you seem to want.

I'm NOT one of those millionaires.

[Bear Rider]

LONGTOM, all I can say to that is the bosses need the workers far more than the workers need the bosses.
Can we work together? Of course. But it is a matter of give and take. Fair and equitable for both sides.
May God help us all.

Ever try to start a company?

Look up "symbiosis". It takes BOTH sides to make a successful company. I've seen many of the most competent, hard-working technical people in the world lose their jobs because the company folded due to bad management.

[rio grande]

LONGTOM, all I can say to that is the bosses need the workers far more than the workers need the bosses.
Can we work together? Of course. But it is a matter of give and take. Fair and equitable for both sides.
May God help us all.

Ever try to start a company?



Look up "symbiosis". It takes BOTH sides to make a successful company. I've seen many of the most competent, hard-working technical people in the world lose their jobs because the company folded due to bad management.

Basically, I agree.
 But owners (and their sometimes poor management) can be replaced by better, hired, management, or management by the workers.  Don't laugh! Most times the workers know better what is needed than the owners, who do not know the conditions on 'the floor'.

Look up "Mondragon Cooperatives", but here is a link.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mondragon_Corporation

If there is any way out of the European and US financial collapse, this is it.
Not perfect! But better than paternalistic (and clueless) exploitation.

[LONGTOM]

Sure they need to work together to keep the country growing but like BUGEYE said, the rich can afford it, the non rich would have to fend for themselves.
 
"Ever try to start a company?"

Bear Rider, if that is directed at me I can answer yes,
My father and I built our trailer business from scratch with out any help from the government and with no employees except myself and him.
When things were good back in the mid to late 90s we grossed a tad over 1 million.
We have never borrowed a dime from anyone at anytime while we were doing it.
It can be done but it takes years with lots of doing without.
Almost all profit went back into the business.
Each year we increased our sales until we were the top trailer dealer on the east coast.
It is just myself and my wife now.
Dad is retired and lives with us.
The last few years have been hard on us since the economy has gone bad but we are still in business and still without any help.
You see, I listened to my Grandfather and Father a long time ago and did without and put money back when things were good just in case the day came when things weren't so good, like now!!!
If more people would have done that instead of spending it as fast as they made it maybe they wouldn't be on such hard times either.
 
 
LONGTOM

[Bear Rider]

Basically, I agree.
 But owners (and their sometimes poor management) can be replaced by better, hired, management, or management by the workers.  Don't laugh! Most times the workers know better what is needed than the owners, who do not know the conditions on 'the floor'.

Look up "Mondragon Cooperatives", but here is a link.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mondragon_Corporation

If there is any way out of the European and US financial collapse, this is it.
Not perfect! But better than paternalistic (and clueless) exploitation.

Exploitation? That's generally  the mantra of the poorly-educated loser.

As I asked before, did YOU ever try to start a company? I already know the answer, but I want to see your answer.

I worked for (and owned pieces of) several software companies at various times in my career. There's not much to a software company, insofar as physical property -- just an office, furniture, computers and equipment, and software.  However, counting overhead, a dozen good software/hardware development people will run you in excess of a million dollars a year, and you're looking at a minimum of two years before you see ANY return.

How many people are willing to risk that much money? Alternatively, how many people have the promotional/organizational/legal skills to bring together that many investors?

Without someone able to either front the money or to line up investors, those twelve people have no jobs. Without competent workers, the owners have just wasted their capital and/or efforts.

That basic relationship holds true for every employee and company out there.

[hillbill]

I remember how well it worked for Mondale to say that he would raise taxes if elected.  Keep up your good work, Joe.

.
People are further along now understanding how TPTB operates, except so-called conservatives. BHO might have to pull out all stops and divide the nation along majority have nots and the minority have mores.  If they do this and he does not win...then we know the election was rigged.
.
...TM7

Well I belong in the "have a little group", excuse me if I read your post incorrectly, but are you saying, if I have two cows and my neighbor has none, I should give him one of mine?? Or is it more like, the people who have educated themselves, worked hard, made good decisions, and have made "more" money, should be penalized for this and give their earned dollars to those who have done none of the above? Sounds like socialism to me...I apologize if I misunderstood what you're saying..

no yu did not understand wrong, start sorting your cows now!run the good ones into the woods and keep the skinny ones in the pen for everybody to see.cuz they will want half yur cows.
 
no matter that they wont know how to care for or butcher your cows. they just want them.yur cows will die in their hands and be wasted. but at least yu wont have them.thats what they want.

[garbhead]

 

The top earners don't give a crap about any of us on here, why should any of us be concerned about them?

Please don't take my reply to this the wrong way but you should be concerned because if it wasn't for the "RICH" then all of us would be in trouble.
For it is the rich that build the factories and businesses that employ the millions of workers in this land.
Take the rich out of the equation and about everyone would be out of work.

Some of you don't seem to grasp that without the rich paying what they do both in taxes and in wages we would all be up S#*! creek.
I don't have the numbers as far as what percentage of what class pays X amount of taxes, nor do I care to look them up because numbers can be construed any way a person wants them to help their side.
I can tell you that the so called super rich pay way more then their share and without them our government would fail overnight at the rate we are spending.
You want to blame someone then blame congress for the waste they spend every second.
Don't blame the rich.
That dog just don't hunt anymore!!!
 
 
LONGTOM

I am not blaming anyone..I am just saying why worry about being an overtaxed multi-millionaire if you  aren't one?  Also few, if any, of the people you mentioned started or inherited their companies with the workers' interests in mind, only their own goals and desires, which is fine . The people who do most all the work are just "tools" or assets of the trade. Sure some care about their people , but most big companies CEOs don't know 99.99999% of their employees.

[nomosendero]

This should only matter to the people on here actually in the top 10%.....The top earners don't give a crap about any of us on here, why should any of us be concerned about them?

Oh, like those who say I don't own an Assualt rifle, it won't affect me, I hunt with a shotgun.
But like those who aren't concerned until they are affected, you won't have to wait long, you will be taxed more too, but not convienient to say for a Lib before the election, so right now it is just the Rich, the ole Marxist game.
First of all, when the Bush tax curt expires (if Obummer wins) YOU will be hit early next year & the hikes will continue. Actually the average folks already have been taxed more indirectly through Higher Gas & food prices, but none of that will affect you.

[garbhead]

The Bush tax cuts will expire no matter who is elected, as our do-nothing Congress will "do-nothing" to stop it...Seems to me like things were pretty good in this country before the Bush tax cuts(and Bush).

[LONGTOM]

The Bush tax cuts will expire no matter who is elected, as our do-nothing Congress will "do-nothing" to stop it...Seems to me like things were pretty good in this country before the Bush tax cuts(and Bush).

Believe it or not I was doing pretty good even under Bush until the DEMs took controll of congress, then it all started going down hill.
 
garbhead:
I wasn't implying that you were blaming anyone yourself.

Also few, if any, of the people you mentioned started or inherited their companies with the workers' interests in mind, only their own goals and desires, which is fine . The people who do most all the work are just "tools" or assets of the trade. Sure some care about their people , but most big companies CEOs don't know 99.99999% of their employees.

On that I agree with you 100%.
 
Bear Rider:

As I asked before, did YOU ever try to start a company? I already know the answer, but I want to see your answer.

Sorry but I'm not sure what you are asking?
 
If you are saying because my company isn't a multimillion dollar corp and doesn't employ a dozen or more people then I didn't start a company I would say you are wrong.
My father and I did start our company and ran it by ourselves and built it into a million dollar plus business.
If you are asking if I risked millions of dollars at a time the answere is no but I have invested as much as $600,000.00 for inventory with different companies in a matter of a few weeks of each other and again without any outside help.
 
 
 
LONGTOM
 
 

[nomosendero]

The Bush tax cuts will expire no matter who is elected, as our do-nothing Congress will "do-nothing" to stop it...Seems to me like things were pretty good in this country before the Bush tax cuts(and Bush).

Nope, don't have to expire, but never mind that, they will increase for all working folks under Obummer.

[painted horse]

I rarely get into political "discussions", as they seem to be a lose-lose situation for all partys involved. Besides if I were really smart enough to have any/all the answers I wouldn't be sitting here on this computor. I know what I think, but in the grand scheme of things, it really matters little..as far as a company/management caring for you as other than a working asset (that's what you actually are) what difference does it make.  If you choose to go to work for a company/individual you have agreed to the conditions outlined at time of employement.  As long as they pay you what they agreed to for the amount/type of work you do, what other requirement is necessary..?  I worked for a VERY LARGE company, (one which I'm sure you would all recognize, and some may work there themselves) the "local" management knew me, whether they liked me or not never mattered, I had the "perfect" working arrangement, they called me to work, I showed up and did my job, twice a month they sent me a paycheck. How can it be any better than that...I never expected them (company) to be a bit concerned about me personally, (unless it affected my job) and why should I..I wasn't concerned about them either (unless it affected my paycheck)....see..perfect arrangement.

[garbhead]

The Bush tax cuts will expire no matter who is elected, as our do-nothing Congress will "do-nothing" to stop it...Seems to me like things were pretty good in this country before the Bush tax cuts(and Bush).

Believe it or not I was doing pretty good even under Bush until the DEMs took controll of congress, then it all started going down hill.
 
 
LONGTOM

So in other words you were doing pretty good with a Republican-controlled congress spending billions and billions with Bush vetoing nothing that landed on his desk, cutting taxes and "paying-for" 2 wars off the books. The first time in history our country simultaneously funded wars and cut taxes.

[rkeltner]

in response to the management not knowing '99.9999% of the employees, look at the attitudes being dispayed here and tell me, why would theyn want to? !!??

[Cuts Crooked]

Bottom line: Tax the rich more and they will take their money elsewhere.

BTW: You ever get a good paying job from a poor man?

[BUGEYE]

Bottom line: Tax the rich more and they will take their money elsewhere.

BTW: You ever get a good paying job from a poor man?

that's right.   it's amazing, but liberals are as jealous of rich folks, as teeny-boppers over some boy.

[LONGTOM]

The Bush tax cuts will expire no matter who is elected, as our do-nothing Congress will "do-nothing" to stop it...Seems to me like things were pretty good in this country before the Bush tax cuts(and Bush).

Believe it or not I was doing pretty good even under Bush until the DEMs took controll of congress, then it all started going down hill.
 
 
LONGTOM

So in other words you were doing pretty good with a Republican-controlled congress spending billions and billions with Bush vetoing nothing that landed on his desk, cutting taxes and "paying-for" 2 wars off the books. The first time in history our country simultaneously funded wars and cut taxes.

  Yes I was.
At that time people were still spending money and buying things they needed/wanted including my trailers.
The last two years under bush is when my business started to drop off.
Maybe it was just coincidence or what ever but that was the same time the Dems took control of congress and for me it has been down hill business wise every since.
 
 
LONGTOM

[BUGEYE]

Painted Horse, that's the way it is in most jobs.
I can guess that the CEO at Delta Airlines couldn't care less about me, he just wanted a warm body in that seat and he could have replaced me with no problems.

[magooch]

So why don't all of you anti "Bush tax cut" guys just pay your taxes by the rates as they were under Clinton?  The tax rates that presently exist are not like speed limits; they are just the opposite--they set the base.  The IRS and by extension, the federal government does not restrict you from paying more taxes than you owe under the present rates.
 
If you're not wealthy, get over it; it's not some rich guys fault--with some rare exceptions.  We used to live in a free country where you were able to make it, or not, if you were willing and able.  That may not be the case anymore.

[nw_hunter]

I rarely get into political "discussions", as they seem to be a lose-lose situation for all partys involved. Besides if I were really smart enough to have any/all the answers I wouldn't be sitting here on this computor. I know what I think, but in the grand scheme of things, it really matters little..as far as a company/management caring for you as other than a working asset (that's what you actually are) what difference does it make.  If you choose to go to work for a company/individual you have agreed to the conditions outlined at time of employement.  As long as they pay you what they agreed to for the amount/type of work you do, what other requirement is necessary..?  I worked for a VERY LARGE company, (one which I'm sure you would all recognize, and some may work there themselves) the "local" management knew me, whether they liked me or not never mattered, I had the "perfect" working arrangement, they called me to work, I showed up and did my job, twice a month they sent me a paycheck. How can it be any better than that...I never expected them (company) to be a bit concerned about me personally, (unless it affected my job) and why should I..I wasn't concerned about them either (unless it affected my paycheck)....see..perfect arrangement.

Welcome to the (Bitter Zone) Drop in more often! Nice to see some still look at things from both sides of the equation.