Author Topic: back to the Lyman GPR (Read 1625 times)

bagdadjoe · « **on:** September 17, 2011, 04:00:58 PM »

I finally got 10lbs of real black powder in yesterday from Powder Inc. and tried some in my GPR tonight. I got a mixture of Swiss, Goex and KIK, 2 granulations of each and tried the KIK 2FG with 6 shots. It groups a bit better than the pyro I was using. I think I just need some more time behind the bench with it. I was using CCI caps and precut/lubed patches and swabbing after each shot with a patch that was dry on one side and had my "Hippy Lube" on the other. That would be beeswax and olive oil with a couple of drops of patchouly oil in it. Swabbed dry, then flip it over to the lubed side and swabbed again. Using Hornady swaged round balls. I like shooting this thing better and better.

50 yds. I was expecting #1 to be off with a clean barrel. I don't know where #5 came from....

Junior1942 · « **Reply #1 on:** September 18, 2011, 03:46:40 AM »

#5 hit a bumblebee between you and the target. It happens to me frequently.

It looks to me like all you need is an unlucky deer! I really like my GPH, and one of these days I'm gonna put a GPR round ball barrel on it.

Rock Home Isle · « **Reply #2 on:** September 18, 2011, 06:57:48 AM »

Heck, bagdadjoe, looks like you are well on your way to having one great shooting rifle there. Keep posting your progress, I'm very interested in seeing how it goes as you try different things and get differing results.

-aim small miss small-

lakota · « **Reply #3 on:** September 18, 2011, 02:06:23 PM »

I have always shot Goex. I never tried Kik or Swiss or any of the other brands. I know the Swiss seems do be a couple dollars more per pound at the Log Cabin Shop where I buy all my powder. Does anyone notice any difference in performance with other brands?

Swampman · « **Reply #4 on:** September 18, 2011, 02:11:34 PM »

Quote from: lakota on September 18, 2011, 02:06:23 PM

I have always shot Goex. I never tried Kik or Swiss or any of the other brands. I know the Swiss seems do be a couple dollars more per pound at the Log Cabin Shop where I buy all my powder. Does anyone notice any difference in performance with other brands?

They all shoot the same for me.

keith44 · « **Reply #5 on:** September 18, 2011, 02:15:43 PM »

Inconsistant pressure on the ram rod at loading can cause about 1/3 of that group spread. Oddly I have also been told that in some cases the patch lube can also cause irregular grouping. So there's two ideas to play with. You are on the right track though, a deer at 50 yards is meat in the freezer.

Rock Home Isle · « **Reply #6 on:** September 18, 2011, 04:26:44 PM »

Quote from: lakota on September 18, 2011, 02:06:23 PM

I have always shot Goex. I never tried Kik or Swiss or any of the other brands. I know the Swiss seems do be a couple dollars more per pound at the Log Cabin Shop where I buy all my powder. Does anyone notice any difference in performance with other brands?

Over the years, I've used Swiss, Elephant and Goex...of the 3 types, I prefer Goex:

*I can find Goex most anywhere that Blackpowder is sold.

*Goex has a very consistant quality

*Goex is usually cheaper or at least the same price as the other two that I've used.

*I've not noticed any appreciable difference in the various brands of blackpowder.

lakota · « **Reply #7 on:** September 18, 2011, 06:23:52 PM »

Thats what I figured-black powder is black powder so I never coughed up the extra bucks to try a different brand plus I have shot GOEX for the past 15 years with good results so why change? I was curious to find out what other black powder folks thought.

Semisane · « **Reply #8 on:** September 18, 2011, 06:26:48 PM »

If you get to playing around with patch lube you will find accuracy better with one lube or another. Also, the amount of lube applied to the patch can make a significant difference. You just have to experiment, and it's a good idea to keep notes while doing so.

Black Jaque Janaviac · « **Reply #9 on:** September 20, 2011, 05:24:08 AM »

Was that shooting offhand or benched?

It looks good. I think if it was benched your GPR is capable of even better though.

Did you pick up any spent patches? What did they look like?

It appears that you have the equipment to weigh powder to the nearest grain. Try sorting through the roundballs and weed out the light ones. That could eliminate those #5s. Some people insist that it doesn't matter, but it seems to help my shooting.

bagdadjoe · « **Reply #10 on:** September 20, 2011, 10:02:37 AM »

I's a listenin'....

I'm going to try to tune this thing in (uh, tune me in..) I'm trying to get my "method" in order. I think one problem I have is follow-through when shooting, if that makes sense. Maintaining that same stillness after the hammer falls and before the bullet takes off. I'll be paying attention to the ramrod pressure next time too. I don't bang the heck out of them, but some slide in easier than others. I try to put it down the barrel in two goes...about half way down then regrip and push it home.
I didn't think to check my patches until the next day and only found two. One was toasty around the edges and frayed. The other just frayed. I'll see if I can't find them all..in sequence next time and scan and post them.
Thanks for the help fellows.

Black Jaque Janaviac · « **Reply #11 on:** September 20, 2011, 11:09:02 AM »

Follow through. . . When I switched to a flintlock I would sit in my backyard and just "poof" the pan with no charge in the bore. I would aim at various objects and wait for the smoke to clear and check to see how well my aim was afterwards. And of course numerous repetitions help develop a habit. I'm no award winner - but I noticed this helped improve my shooting. . . and I notice my shooting goes south when I quit doing this.

I also did this when I got my Plains Pistol, my first handgun. Of course there was no pan to light, but I would watch the sights as I pulled the trigger. At first it was really obvious how much they would move. With concentration I got it so the sights would not move during the trigger pull, and lo, my shooting improved.

. . .now was this shooting off a bench? Or off-hand?

Semisane · « **Reply #12 on:** September 20, 2011, 05:05:11 PM »

It sounds a little hokey, but take a scratch pad and pencil with you to the range. After each shot try to draw a picture of how the sights and target were aligned at the moment of ignition. I'll bet you won't be able to do it for the first shot or two (or three). But if you concentrate on being able to draw that picture after you shoot (and actually do it) your groups will tighten up significantly. Just knowing that you have to draw that picture and do it honestly will do wonders for your concentration.

bagdadjoe · « **Reply #13 on:** September 20, 2011, 05:11:25 PM »

Off the bench. I shoot everything off the bench until I can get some accuracy out of it. Once I have confidence it's dialed in, then I'll know how good I'm shooting. If my back and hip will allow it, I'd like to try some offhand shooting...might go to Friendship and see what I can do. I saw some classes I would like to enter...for the heck of it. I shot some Service Rifle years ago...no you don't see my name in the record books

.

bagdadjoe · « **Reply #14 on:** September 20, 2011, 05:16:51 PM »

Semisane, I'll take that advice. Should improve concentration too....have to get back into my Zen mindset.

keith44 · « **Reply #15 on:** September 20, 2011, 09:16:40 PM »

Quote from: Semisane on September 20, 2011, 05:05:11 PM

It sounds a little hokey, but take a scratch pad and pencil with you to the range. After each shot try to draw a picture of how the sights and target were aligned at the moment of ignition. I'll bet you won't be able to do it for the first shot or two (or three). But if you concentrate on being able to draw that picture after you shoot (and actually do it) your groups will tighten up significantly. Just knowing that you have to draw that picture and do it honestly will do wonders for your concentration.

Sounds like great advice to me, not at all hokey. I'm gonna be readying my .32 flinter for squirrel this weekend so if I can't get a group I like (been a few weeks since I've burned any powder through it) I'll try that only off hand instead of benched.

Rock Home Isle · « **Reply #16 on:** September 21, 2011, 04:33:50 AM »

NOT FAIR. We have to wait till October 1st for our squirrel season to open...My little .32 is dialed in, but the wait is killing me.

streak · « **Reply #17 on:** September 25, 2011, 05:13:56 PM »

bagdadjoe,
Have you had a chance to compare the KIK to the Goex as far as performance both in velocity and accuracy. I have a GPR in the flintlock configuration with a .54 cal barrel. I may have to get some of the KIK and try it out!

bagdadjoe · « **Reply #18 on:** September 26, 2011, 03:20:31 AM »

Havn't compared the two. I bought both in the batch I just purchased. I got the KIK because some of the long range black powder cartridge guys are having great success with it. I had only had p-dex before. I'll try the Goex next can opened. Got this from Powder Inc. hazmat and shipping is included in the price...being cheap like I am....

coyotejoe · « **Reply #19 on:** September 27, 2011, 07:45:25 AM »

Lots of folks would be happy with that group but being the discriminating gentleman you obviously are I'm sure you and your GPR can do much better.
First thing I'd change is your bore swabbing technique. I'd not use a lubed patch to swab the bore. The fouling is not only powder residue but also residue from the patch lube. A lubed patch won't remove patch lube but will only add to it, so you get a build up in the bore. Nothing cuts blackpowder fouling better than plain water so that is the best for swabbing between shots. I favor plain spit both for swabbing and for actual patch lube. Not for hunting of course, if the rifle is left loaded for some length of time it will dry out. But for range work nothing really beats spit and lots of complicated patch lubes aren't nearly as good as spit. Plus you don't need to carry a special container, you never forget to bring spit along, it doesn't get all over your hands and clothing and best of all, it's free.

Black Jaque Janaviac · « **Reply #20 on:** September 28, 2011, 05:04:56 AM »

. . .and if you chew gum your spit will even have that wintergreen smell of Wonderlube

From my experience . . . If you use enough grease, you can shoot indefinitely without swabbing between shots. The problem is, just saturating the ball-patch with grease won't be enough grease.

See my thread on paper cartridges for the rifle. I don't simply grease the paper patch. I form a "wasp-waist" between the patched ball and the powder case and fill that void with grease. This makes for a rather delicate cartridge making storage in a box necessary - loose in a bag I don't think would be good under hunting conditions.

So it has it's advantages and disadvantages, but that's the cool thing with muzzle loading. There isn't a one-size-fits-all method, but there are so many different methods that work you can find one that works for you.

keith44 · « **Reply #21 on:** October 16, 2011, 07:40:01 PM »

A proper patch lube carries lube the full length of the barrel, and keeps the fouling soft enough to allow an almost indefinate number of shots between barrel swabbings. For me a combination of moose's milk, and grease works best, and keeps the patch lube from contaminating the powder charge. My .32 squirrel rifle does best with grease only, about every third shot I add an extra bit of grease between the patch and powder charge. I find that spit patches must be fired immedately after loading.