Author Topic: Salty talk  (Read 3386 times)

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Offline LabRat2k3

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Salty talk
« on: July 17, 2011, 10:34:14 PM »
I read alot about long term survival, but one thing I very rairly see brought up is salt. Salt is a basic requirement for normal body functions, is used as a preservative, and can make meals taste better. So what is your long term plan for acquiring your nessasary daliy salt?

Offline Torwe

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2011, 11:38:54 PM »
Actually for those that live near the coast it would simply be a matter of evaporating sea water. The old timers had saltlicks where they got it but myself I never came across any.
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Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2011, 01:55:40 AM »
thx for bringing it up.  most of the food that I stockpile is already salted, but even at that, it wouldn't hurt to have extra.
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Offline LabRat2k3

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2011, 07:30:24 AM »
It's not something most of us think about. With the amount of processed food most of us take in we even try to limit our salt intake, but once our diet swithched to a more natural supply it would be easy to run into a deficient situation. Ocean water is a good source, but I'm over 200 miles from the ocean. From what I've read most people plan to lay low and try to avoid others so speending a few days on the beach trying to collect enough salt to last for awhile seems to run counter to that idea. I guess if you lived near the salt flats you would be in business, but again that's along ways from me. Any cattle farms near you should have a salt block or two for the cattle,but you may have to be real slick to get that close to a guys beef on the hoof if food is hard to come by. I don't see myself putting a 50 pound block of salt in my bug out bag, but it may be something to cache near areas you plan on bugging out too. I don't have the answer for me and my familey yet, but I'm working on it. Hope I have given you all something else to think about to help you be better prepared for what we hope never happens.

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2011, 07:49:22 AM »
Salt tablets might be the ticket . One a day or every other day . A container of 100 would take up little room. And 1000's could be stored in little space.
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Offline Lost Farmboy

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2011, 11:19:23 AM »
  I am stocking solar sea salt at my bug out location. If the SHTF I will bury it in different locations, creating my own salt mines. I use raw salt at home. The processed stuff sold in the stores is poison. My bug out bag has a bag of “Real Salt”. It's a brand name of mineral salt mined from an old Indian mine out west somewhere.


If your body gets low on salt, your muscles will cramp. Some vegetables are high in sodium and will help, celery for one. If you live near salt water you do not have to evaporate it. Many ancient cultures boiled food in seawater. You could use seawater to stir fry instead of oil. Some ancient cultures who didn't have salt mines or oceans near by cooked with blood. Animal blood is salty.
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Offline Empty Quiver

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #6 on: July 18, 2011, 01:26:23 PM »
The softener is usually half full. But you bring up a good point in that many preservation methods rely on what would now be considered way to much salt.
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Offline reliquary

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #7 on: July 18, 2011, 04:33:30 PM »
I'm glad this thread got started, because it's caused me to see an obvious lack in my preparedness.  I have tucked away 20 pounds of salt in my Doomsday kit, and that's not going to be near enough.
 
Also hadn't thought about salt tablets.  Those things were literally life-savers in training in the South and deployment to RVN in the '60s. 
 
I just talked with an older member of the family who remembers the days when they preserved meat without refrigeration.  He said they might use up to 50 pounds of salt PER HOG to cure the meat before it was smoked.  That being the case, we're going to have to stock a lot more in case of SHTF.  Any ideas who sells it in big bags these days?
 
You may want to cross-post some of this to the thread "One Second After", also on this forum.  In case of the EMP bomb, there sure won't be any electricity for storage.

Offline Pat/Rick

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2011, 09:26:27 AM »
 Besides "iodized table salt", I am trying to increase my supply of "canning salt". It's just salt, nothing else added. This is what you want for canning, pickleing, or smoking/salt cured meats (a skill I need to learn BTW).
 
 IIRC, wasn't Salt used as currency in some parts of the ancient world?

Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #9 on: July 19, 2011, 09:40:30 AM »
Check out Fox Fire books . What they show is much like I remember salting and smoking meat when I was younger.
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Offline Casull

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #10 on: July 19, 2011, 11:32:00 AM »
Quote
I use raw salt at home. The processed stuff sold in the stores is poison.

 
Really.  How long does it take to work.  I've been eating it for almost 50 years and I'm not dead yet.   ::)
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Offline reliquary

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #11 on: July 19, 2011, 04:52:54 PM »
The Foxfire books are a great source of survival information.  I have found that numbers 1-6 contain most everything one would need to know about "plain living."  Most of the articles on preserving meat call for substantial amounts of salt, so we're back to square one.
 
Who sells big bags of salt?
 
What chemicals are in the salt blocks that farmers use for livestock?  Would the blocks be usable for preserving meat?  I think I remember one Foxfire article that used small amounts of sulfur, and another that used one of the nitrates, in addition to salt, for curing meat. 
 
Almost all of them call for some form of smokehouse, and one of the books has plans for building one.
 
 

Offline Empty Quiver

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #12 on: July 19, 2011, 05:09:29 PM »
50# bag of solar salt and a mill oughta get you started.
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Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #13 on: July 20, 2011, 02:51:07 AM »
The Foxfire books are a great source of survival information.  I have found that numbers 1-6 contain most everything one would need to know about "plain living."  Most of the articles on preserving meat call for substantial amounts of salt, so we're back to square one.
 
Who sells big bags of salt?
 
What chemicals are in the salt blocks that farmers use for livestock?  Would the blocks be usable for preserving meat?  I think I remember one Foxfire article that used small amounts of sulfur, and another that used one of the nitrates, in addition to salt, for curing meat. 
 
Almost all of them call for some form of smokehouse, and one of the books has plans for building one.
A smoke house can be anywhere you can have a room. My uncles would burn oak in a wash tub set up on bricks for 8 or more hrs. The room they used was a blocked off corner of a garage.
Most grocy stores sell salt in 25 lb bags , i get it to salt fish . Sam's , Price Club and others also have salt .
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Offline Rex in OTZ

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2011, 07:59:38 AM »
As I remember they started useing Iodized salt because over time useing plain salt you can develope goiters, Cattle feed supply stores you can buy 50# bags of rock salt reasonable, same for Iodized (used to salt and mineral cattle as a kid)
 
http://www.cargill.com/salt/products/agriculture/champions-choice/cc-natural-livestock-block/index.jsp
 
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080220165930AAmAVcF
 
http://www.unitedsalt.com/site/html/agriculture.htm

Offline Lost Farmboy

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2011, 09:01:47 AM »
Quote
I use raw salt at home. The processed stuff sold in the stores is poison.

 
Really.  How long does it take to work.  I've been eating it for almost 50 years and I'm not dead yet.   ::)

 
When I was selling insurance a man said the same thing to me about cigarettes. Smoked for 50 years and it didn't hurt him yet, only coughed about 3 times in the 1 sentence.
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Offline Casull

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #16 on: July 21, 2011, 09:03:53 AM »
   
Quote
   Quote from: Casull on July 19, 2011, 03:32:00 PM
  Quote
I use raw salt at home. The processed stuff sold in the stores is poison.
 
 
Really.  How long does it take to work.  I've been eating it for almost 50 years and I'm not dead yet. 
::)
 
 
When I was selling insurance a man said the same thing to me about cigarettes. Smoked for 50 years and it didn't hurt him yet, only coughed about 3 times in the 1 sentence.
   Uh, was that supposed to be an answer? 
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Offline Lost Farmboy

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #17 on: July 21, 2011, 09:08:47 AM »
 
 
 No, that was just a comment. The first thing that came to mind after reading your comment. This is the answer. I needed a few minutes to look it up. 
I cut and pasted the info because I think you have to be a member to read the article.
 
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2010/08/25/why-has-this-lifesustaining-essential-nutrient-been-vilified-by-doctors.aspx
 
Salts of the Earth
 
 
As it turns out, salt is a very general term that can mean many things. All salts are NOT equal in terms of origin, chemistry, crystal structure, biological effects — or even flavor!
Chemically speaking, a salt is simply any ionic compound arising from the joining of a positively charged ion and a negatively charged ion, so that the product is electrically neutral.
When people talk about salt, they are usually referring to refined table salt, or sodium chloride. But in fact, most minerals are salts, including magnesium sulfate (Epsom salt) and ammonium nitrate (used in fertilizer).
But with typically edible salts, most people do not realize there are enormous differences between common, refined table salt and natural, unrefined salt.
One is health damaging, and the other is healing.
ALERT — Natural Salt is 85 Percent Sodium Chloride and Processed Salt is 98 Percent
Ordinary table salt
undergoes a great deal of processing between the factory and your grocer. It is approximately 97.5 percent sodium chloride and 2.5 percent chemicals such as iodine and moisture absorbents, dried at over 1,200 degrees Fahrenheit. This high heat alters the natural chemical structure of the salt.
By contrast, unrefined salt is 84 percent sodium chloride and 16 percent other naturally occurring minerals, including many trace minerals like silicon, phosphorous and vanadium.
If you want your body to function properly, you need a balanced salt, complete with all-natural elements and free of pollutants. I will speak more about my favorite natural salt a bit later.
The important point is, today's ordinary table salt has nothing in common with natural sea salt.
The Adulteration of Table Salt
What remains after ordinary table salt is "chemically cleaned" is sodium chloride, an unnatural chemical form of salt that your body recognizes as something completely foreign. Therefore, when you add more salt to your already salty Spaghettios, your body receives more salt than it can dispose of.
Typical processed salt has independent crystals that are totally isolated from each other. In order for your body to try to metabolize processed salt , it must sacrifice tremendous amounts of energy.
Inorganic sodium chloride in the form of processed salt can keep you from an ideal fluid balance and can overburden your elimination system.
When your body tries to isolate the excess salt, water molecules must surround the sodium chloride to break them up into sodium and chloride ions before your body can neutralize them. To accomplish this, water is taken from your cells.
This results in a less-than-ideal fluid balance within your cells.
Every gram of excess sodium chloride your body has to neutralize uses up 23 grams of cellular water. Hence, eating too much common processed salt will cause fluid to accumulate in your tissues, which contributes to:
 
  • Unsightly cellulite
  • Rheumatism, arthritis and gout
  • Kidney and gall bladder stones
Processed salt will also oftentimes contain potentially dangerous preservatives.
Calcium carbonate, magnesium carbonate, and aluminum hydroxide are often added to improve salt's "pourability." Aluminum is a light alloy that deposits into your brain — a potential cause of Alzheimer's disease.
A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people.   John F. Kennedy

"If we ever forget that we're one nation under God, then we will be a nation gone under" -Ronald Reagan

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Offline Casull

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #18 on: July 21, 2011, 09:19:15 AM »
That's about what I figured.  No mention of it being "poison" and somehow 84% sodium chloride is great, but 97.5% sodium chloride is awful.  Also tough to figure how 84% sodium chloride is good, but "sodium chloride, an unnatural chemical form of salt that your body recognizes as something completely foreign".    ::)
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Offline Lost Farmboy

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #19 on: July 21, 2011, 09:43:52 AM »
  Ok, so you take raw salt with trace minerals that are vital to your health. Wash them out with toxic chemicals that leave toxic traces. Heat it to over 1200 deg changing the structure to something your body will not recognize, or know how to process. Then add some toxic chemicals to keep it from caking. Now is it good for you? Is it better than before? I guess you can draw your own conclusions. I consider anything harmful to your health be poison. It's the heat treating the makes it an unnatural chemical form, not the percentage of sodium chloride from washing out the nutrients.
A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people.   John F. Kennedy

"If we ever forget that we're one nation under God, then we will be a nation gone under" -Ronald Reagan

“So this is how liberty dies; with thunderous applause.”  Padme Amidala

Offline Casull

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #20 on: July 21, 2011, 10:40:54 AM »
Quote
It's the heat treating the makes it an unnatural chemical form, not the percentage of sodium chloride from washing out the nutrients.

Well, first of all, the sodium chloride is a nutrient, so all the nutrients have not been washed out (just changed what ones are left).  Second, if it is sodium chloride before heating and it is sodium chloride after heating, then its "chemical form" has not been changed.  You may change its physical form, but not its chemical form (sodium chloride is sodium chloride).  Sorry, I just don't buy into things that make no sense.
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Offline Lost Farmboy

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #21 on: July 21, 2011, 10:43:04 AM »
  Pat/Rick mentions “canning salt” nothing added. After finding out how toxic our food supply really is started growing my own as much as possible. Many modern diseases crowns and colitis are caused by our “sterile” food. So I tried to make my own sauerkraut. We made it when I was a kid. Three table spoons of salt for every a five pounds of cabbage. My first batch just rotted. I called my mother and asked her why. She asked me what kind of salt I used. It was uniodized table salt. That was the problem. You have to use canning salt. The table salt kills the bacteria that ferment the cabbage and make sauerkraut. The same pro-biotic bacteria your body needs to extract the nutrients out of your food. Casull more evidence that common table salt is poison. It kills the pro-biotics your body needs to be healthy. You may consider that a good thing. If it kills the lacto bacteria that ferment cabbage it may also cause damage to vital organs. I just don't want to take that chance.
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Offline Lost Farmboy

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #22 on: July 21, 2011, 11:02:05 AM »
Quote
It's the heat treating the makes it an unnatural chemical form, not the percentage of sodium chloride from washing out the nutrients.

Well, first of all, the sodium chloride is a nutrient, so all the nutrients have not been washed out (just changed what ones are left).  Second, if it is sodium chloride before heating and it is sodium chloride after heating, then its "chemical form" has not been changed.  You may change its physical form, but not its chemical form (sodium chloride is sodium chloride).  Sorry, I just don't buy into things that make no sense.

 
So all other nutrients are washed out leaving only one. Are they not important?
 
 
So maybe I didn't use the perfect choice of words. The fact is that heat treating causes an unnatural form that the human body does not recognize. It is processed by the body differently causing physical harm. Using the word chemically instead of physically does not change the fact that it is harmful.


steel is still steel after heat treating. It may be harder or softer depending on the way it is heat treated. But it is different.
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Offline Casull

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #23 on: July 21, 2011, 11:49:40 AM »
Quote
So all other nutrients are washed out leaving only one. Are they not important?

 
I suppose they might be, IF salt was your only source for them.
 
 
Quote

Using the word chemically instead of physically does not change the fact that it is harmful.



Well, that is where we differ.  I don't necessarily consider it "fact" based on a single web source.
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Offline Lost Farmboy

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #24 on: July 21, 2011, 12:16:05 PM »
Quote
So all other nutrients are washed out leaving only one. Are they not important?

 
I suppose they might be, IF salt was your only source for them.
 
 
Quote

Using the word chemically instead of physically does not change the fact that it is harmful.



Well, that is where we differ.  I don't necessarily consider it "fact" based on a single web source.

 


Dr Mercola is not the only source, just the best.

A nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people.   John F. Kennedy

"If we ever forget that we're one nation under God, then we will be a nation gone under" -Ronald Reagan

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Offline Lost Farmboy

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #25 on: July 21, 2011, 12:16:49 PM »
  I said enough. I am sure those who really care about their health will take Dr Mercola's advice seriously. Pat/Rick said it is important to store canning salt besides iodized salt. I strongly agree Iodized table salt is better than no salt. Real raw salt is the best. Most sea salt sold in stores is processed the same way as table salt, so there is no real benefit. That is why I store solar sea salt, it is usually unprocessed. If salt is pure white it was most likely processed.


You can buy “real salt” at some farmers markets. Real Salt is a brand name. The minerals in it make it reddish in color. Many Asian markets sell raw salt from China, it is gray in color, and has many trace elements and minerals.
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Offline SHOOTALL

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #26 on: July 25, 2011, 04:16:29 AM »
I buy red looking salt/minerals in a bag at tyhe farm supply . Cows love it .
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Offline Pat/Rick

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #27 on: July 26, 2011, 12:55:05 PM »
Lost F.,  Where do you get Solar Sea Salt at?? And does it come in Large bags or.... I like having canning salt as it is basic in form but 4 lb boxes are what I find it in. I'm sure it comes in bags IIRC but haven't seen any for a whil now. I have some 30 gallon food grade drums that would be good for storing large amounts of raw/natural salt in.
 
 Costco sells sea salt that is natural with no additives. But it only comes in smallish (30oz.) containers.
 
 If the iodine in iodized salt is a nutrtion requirement, would a drop or two of iodine be a/the equivelent?  Iodine would be a very multi purpose item to have on hand that being the case. First-aid/emergency water purification/ nutrition needs.

Offline Lost Farmboy

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #28 on: July 27, 2011, 01:37:49 AM »
  I got mine from a salt mine in Bonair. It was sold for water softeners. I just got some for storage. Bonair is a small island 60 miles off the coast off the cost of Venezuela. I think I got it at Home Depot a few years ago. I will be looking for more soon.


I saw the salt mine when I was there on a scuba diving trip. The water is the cleanest I have seen anywhere in the world. There is a solar salt mine in LA. I think there is too much pollution there for clean salt.


I think natural sea salt has enough iodine in if it isn't washed out. I have an ounce of iodine in my BOB for and antiseptic. In case of nuclear fallout I would paint a 2' x 2' patch on my arm. Maybe put a drop or 2 in water to purify it once in a while if I didn't have the time or means to boil it. I do not think it is a good idea to consume iodine. I have not done enough research on it yet to be sure. Store some iodized salt, just don't use it all the time and don't use it for preserving any thing.


http://www.foodiemoment.com/2010/08/17/bonaire-sea-salt/


http://wikimapia.org/1496460/Cargill-Salt-Bonaire-N-V-Solar-Salt-Works
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"If we ever forget that we're one nation under God, then we will be a nation gone under" -Ronald Reagan

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Offline Pat/Rick

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Re: Salty talk
« Reply #29 on: July 27, 2011, 08:12:21 AM »
Home Depot huh? I'm in and out of there and Lowe's at least once a month it seems like and sometimes more. I'll look for it the next time I'm there. Thanks.
 
BTW the sea salt that costco sells is from Brazil. Probably the same type of deal, sun evaporated.  (I guess thats another plus for survival being maybe easier on a marine coast line. Not only fish and shell fish, but a salt source, as well as iodine supplements from sea weeds).