Author Topic: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed  (Read 1387 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline 4gabe

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 8
New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« on: September 17, 2010, 08:09:39 AM »
Hello all this is my first post, hope I’m in the right forum. I'm a deer hunter in upstate NY I'm interested in handgun hunting and after researching the topic I think I've decided what I think I want. Would like a sanity check and help understanding all that I’m reading. The idea is to get a pistol that I can use for deer hunting, with light recoil, easy to find ammo, something that has ballistics at least as good as my muzzle loader, be able to take a deer at 200 yards without have to aim a foot high, and if I want to take a woodchuck or coyote it’s not overkill or over expensive.  I think a T/C in a .243 will fit the bill so cool right, well now I see there is a Contender, a G2 a Encore, stainless, heavy barrel, bull barrel…. Ouch my head hurts. Based on my requirements above can someone help my understand what I really need and what is just propaganda, if I can find a used one great, but what should I avoid if I can?     

Offline Curtis

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (65)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1131
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #1 on: September 17, 2010, 08:43:55 AM »
If you've settled on the .243 then that makes it easy.  You only have one choice .......Encore.  The Contender and G2 Contender are not strong enough for the high pressure rounds.  There is a wealth of information here so you've come to the right place.  There is a dedicated TC pistol forum a little ways up the list too.

Curtis

P.S.  If you find the Encore platform a little heavy in pistol configuration (some do) then in my opinion a Contender or G2 Contender in 7-30 Waters would do what you require.
Lord, please help me to be half the man my dogs think I am.

Contender in 17 Rem, 22lr, 22k Hornet, 223 Rem, 256 WM, 6TCU, 7TCU, 7-30, 30 Herrett, 300 Whisper, 30-30 AI, 357 mag, 357 Herrett, 375 JDJ, 44 mag, 45/410..... so far.

Offline pruhdlr

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 109
  • Gender: Male
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #2 on: September 17, 2010, 10:53:43 AM »


This is the .243 that I have been hunting with for a year or so now. It has netted me several coyotes and a deer last year. For the deer sized game I feel that the .243 is an excellent handgun caliber.

I would also reccommend the Encore and better yet,the Pro Hunter. It can be had in almost any caliber that you can think up and it is extremely accurate. ---pruhdlr
RSSZ Camping/Hikeing Club --- '69,'70,'71
Stoner 63 (MK23/XM207

Offline shot1

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1064
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #3 on: September 17, 2010, 12:33:00 PM »
Welcome to the madness, I mean the forum.  ;D
Before you purchase anything check your states regulations on deer hunting to see if they have limitations for handgun hunting. Some states only allow straight wall cases, some have caliber restrictions etc.

The 243 in an Encore would fit the bill of what you want. I would suggest that you get a variable power PISTOL scope. Burris has one with the highest powder it is a 3 - 12 X32 and you can get a ballistic plex that has different aiming points in it. For a good scope that is about half the price of the Burris is the Weaver 2.5-8X28 . I have three of these and they work very well for deer hunting and shooting varmints out to 200 yards easy.

If you want a lighter pistol than the Encore get either one of the Contenders. If it is new it will be the G2 Contender. For factory ammo that is easy to find I would go with a 14" barrel 30-30 Winchester. The 7-30 Waters would be the next caliber on the list. It is just a little harder to find the 7-30 Waters ammo. 30-30 Winchester can be found almost anywhere.

Now here is the bad news. Once you get your first Encore or Contender it is all down hill for your pocket book. You will want to get other barrels soon and you will just have to get into reloading to really make these calibers do their thing. Like I said, "Welcome to the madness'.  ;D

Offline kynardsj

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (54)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1680
  • Gender: Male
  • Sweet Home Alabama
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2010, 12:54:45 PM »
Welcome to handgun hunting and with a TC product welcome to the fun. Contender is a good way to go but I too recommend an Encore. You have a much larger selection of calibers and aren't limited by pressure. A bit heavier but much stronger.
When you were born, you cried and the world rejoiced. Live your life so that when you die the world cries and you rejoice.

Offline pruhdlr

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 109
  • Gender: Male
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2010, 01:52:13 PM »
My wife shoots a 30-30 Ackley Improved chambered in an older Contender. I handload a 190gr SMK, and over the years the weapon had taken quite a few deer. Even the Maine sized ones.

As stated....you WILL be hooked !!  ---pruhdlr
RSSZ Camping/Hikeing Club --- '69,'70,'71
Stoner 63 (MK23/XM207

Offline DANNY-L

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (63)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1084
  • Gender: Male
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #6 on: September 18, 2010, 02:55:36 AM »
Im also from upstate ny and last year I put the 14" 7-30 waters on mine recoil is very mild,I zeroed at a 100yds consistantly 2" or less w/2x7 burris got my first handgun deer at 40yds.The 7-30 is really enjoyable to shoot,the recoil pushes back not up kinda like a rifle and it will fill what your looking for in distance.

Offline 4gabe

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 8
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #7 on: September 18, 2010, 05:50:34 AM »
First I'd like to thank everyone for the replies and the welcome, thank you.

I don't know that I would say I've settled on the 243 it's just that I'm a little familiar with that load in a rifle I know nothing of the 7-30 and to be honest thought it would be hard to find ammo for and just dismissed it unfairly it seems. I will look at the local Gander mt to see if they carry the load that's kind of my is it easy to find test. Now as to the talk of weight between the encore and G2 that is something that never crossed my mind and never really holding the two so maybe ignorance is bliss in this case.  I did look at the pro hunter packages but they only advertised them in the three cal. If i were to get it in a different one I imagine it would cost more and on the TC page they're already $1100 something, and the Chief Financial Officer (wife) is already giving me dirty looks and not the good kind.  It seems that finding a used encore at least locally is not going to happen if I could pick up a used contender that fits the bill I'd be ok with that if it was priced right, but it seems most of them are in the larger cal. at least when you plan on hunting deer. Gander mt will get me a encore 243 with a burris 2-8 scope with weaver rings for about $925 new. so I'm trying to beat that somewhere.     

Offline DANNY-L

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (63)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1084
  • Gender: Male
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2010, 06:08:52 AM »
If your looking for 7-30 waters ammo its only made by federal with 120gr I believe.

Offline Curtis

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (65)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1131
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #9 on: September 18, 2010, 07:42:27 AM »
You are right, ammo availability could rule out the 7-30 Waters.  It seems to be a regional thing so you'd have to do your test or talk to people in your area that shoot it.  Many or most people end up reloading for specialty pistols eventually anyhow.  The returns in performance and accuracy in these pistols are of much greater potential than factory versus hand loads in most rifles.  Other benifits from hand loading include reduced muzzle blast of rifle calibers in short barrels by using slightly faster powders.

I've been shooting Contender pistols and adding to my addiction for almost 25 years.  I have never bought anything new.  I have only bought two complete guns, my first and another in a gun shop at a steal of a price (I mainly bought it for the barrel that was on it).  My other three Contender frames and 14 or so barrels (not to mention scopes, mounts, grips, forends) were all bought used either at gun shows, on forums like this one or from local individuals and gun shops.  If you go with an Encore though, you might have to be a little more patient for what you want to show up on the used market simply because they haven't been on the market as long.  The same applies to the G2 frames and grips, although the barrels interchange between early Contender and G2 Contender and are plentiful new, used and custom.

If you go the Contender route and think you might eventually hand load, you might go with 30-30 AI (Ackley Improved).  It is a great caliber for the Contender and you would be able to shoot factory 30-30 loads in it until you get set up for hand loading and also if you get into an ammo situation in the field somehow.  You would also be fire forming brass for when you eventually hand load 30-30 AI.

I hesitate to go into what to watch for when buying used but you did ask.  ;)  Don't let this make your head spin because none of the differences I'm about to lay out are a show stopper.  On the classic Contender platform, T/C went through several iterations, mainly concerning the hammer configuration and the trigger/trigger guard.  There is an early hammer which has a cheesy hammer block safety that nobody ever uses because if you forget and drop the hammer on it then it is damaged.  This same hammer also requires a screwdriver to switch from the centerfire firing pin selection to the rimfire firing pin selection (Encores only have a center fire firing pin if you were curious).  Later hammer configurations have a selector lever on the top of the hammer with three positions; rimfire, centerfire and safe.  I have both and both work just fine although the latter is a better design.  Another difference you will find among classic Contender frames is the "pre-easy open" frames and the "easy open" frames.  The differences here are the shape of the trigger (no difference in function) and the location of the trigger guard hinge pin.  Relocating the hinge pin gives you a bit more leverage on the trigger guard spur when breaking the action.  I own both and to be honest I cannot tell much difference between the two, but I have a pretty strong grip.  They both take more pull than children or small ladies are likely to be comfortable with (to put it in perspective).  I notice more difference in effort to break the action when I use early barrels with a single piece locking lug versus the split locking lug that is on most barrels.  I will not go into the specifics of barrel lockup because you are unlikely to run into many solid lug barrels and I believe that ALL 14" barrels had split locking lugs.

One thing that must be mentioned concerning the classic Contenders vs. the G2 in a hunting situation.  If you decide not to take the shot and then lower the hammer, on the classic Contenders you must depress the trigger guard fully to reset the trigger.  This has on occasion spooked alert game for some folks.  The G2 and Encore do not have this weakness, but it is said that their triggers take some work to be as good as the classic Contender's trigger out of the box.  I do not own a G2 so cannot attest to that first hand.  There are definitely G2 fans here and one of them would be more qualified to explain its virtues.

That's all I will lay on you for now.  Don't be scared off by these subtle differences, as I said none of them is a show stopper.

Curtis
Lord, please help me to be half the man my dogs think I am.

Contender in 17 Rem, 22lr, 22k Hornet, 223 Rem, 256 WM, 6TCU, 7TCU, 7-30, 30 Herrett, 300 Whisper, 30-30 AI, 357 mag, 357 Herrett, 375 JDJ, 44 mag, 45/410..... so far.

Offline Win 1917

  • Trade Count: (13)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 186
  • Gender: Male
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #10 on: September 19, 2010, 02:53:58 AM »
All great advice so far. The Encore in 243 would be a great choice especially if you don't handload. I started handgun hunting too with an Encore because of the wider range of chamberings available. After playing with it quite a bit and buying and selling a few barrels I started getting into Contenders and now I'm using those as handguns and mostly leaving the Encore's as rifles. So I caught the bug with Encores and then tried other stuff later.

As for buying a gun there's tons of used stuff available. I haven't shopped a lot for complete guns but I would think you could pick up a complete gun with a decent scope for 5-600. The market for used guns is kinda soft right now, good for buyers.   
 

Offline Mikey

  • GBO Supporter
  • Moderator
  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8734
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #11 on: September 19, 2010, 03:29:35 AM »
OK, here's my two cents worth:  personnally I feel the 243 is a bit light for upstate ny Whitetail.  These are nothern animals and they get larger than they get in lots of other places.  If I were to use a 243 I would want to make certain the barrel shot some of the heavier loads for Whitetail as well as the lighter loads you would want to use for varmit hunting. 

Also, the 243, or any just about any rifle cartridge will get the short stroke out of a shorter pistol barrel - you will lose some velocity and will need to assure that you can hit at 200 yds.  You mentioned a 'foot high' trajectory - best check on what the 243 does from a shorter Contender barrel  - it is a flat shooter but not the same as with a 22" rifle barrel.  A successful hunt is all about shot placement - a 70 gn 6mm slug will shoot through a Whitetail chest broadside at 200 yds, about as easily as a 100 gn slug - you just have to place it right to do the job properly. 

My brother has a Contender in 308 but he won't take a 200 yd shot because of the bullet drop.  You may want to find out what the 243 does at that distance before you make your decision.  And, you may wish to consider learning to reload............. just another two cents worth...

Offline xphunter

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 850
  • Gender: Male
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #12 on: September 19, 2010, 09:28:31 AM »
An Encore handgun in 243 Win., is more than suitable for muley or whitetails.
Right, bullet =Right placement= dead deer every-time.
200 yards is no challenge for the 243 either.
Take your time, find what you are looking for, and then practice as much as you can and get used to your specialty pistol.
Hopefully you will want to learn to reload in the future.
If you know this is something you want to do, and you have the goal of wanting to shoot further than 200 yards.
I would buy a used Encore handgun frame and order a MGM barrel.
Get a forend that has a hanger bar on it, and you will end up with a rig that will be capable of better accuracy and reliability in the field.
Factory Encore will easily do 200 yards on minute of whitetail anyday though.
Ernie
"If you think you are perfect, just try walking on water!"

Offline lastchanc54

  • Trade Count: (17)
  • Avid Poster
  • **
  • Posts: 173
Re: New to handguns and I'm a little overwelmed
« Reply #13 on: September 25, 2010, 05:07:21 PM »
Hi, I just went over to gunbroker.com and looked up Encore pistols. I found a blued 15'' Ecore with a 4X Leoupold scope on it for $675. It came with a carrying case and a shoulder holster! Not a bad deal. The hickup is the barrel is a 45/70 instead of a 243. The soultion is to sell the 45/70 barrel on this site and buy a slightly used 243 barrel from this site or offer a trade. For about $700. you will have a fine scoped handgun ready to hunt.
I have built three encores from this site due to the low prices on barrels. An average barrel will run from about 160 to 200 dollars here, and on other sites, the same barrel will go for an asking price of $230 to $255, a noticeable differance.  The Encore on Gunbroker.com is  # 192597422
The more you know, the better. If you are not in a hurry, you can post a WTB (wanted to buy) on this site or keep an eye on Gunbroker and others until you find what you want. Hope this helps, good luck.