Author Topic: Best caliber for 16" lever rifle? (Read 2355 times)

srcjahc · « **on:** December 03, 2003, 02:55:18 PM »

I am going to start hog hunting this year and would like a short (16")carbine in a lever-action. I read somwhere that in a 16" the 44 mag is close to a 30-30 in performance. Since I would have a greater capacity with the 44 this looks appealing to me. Any thoughts as to best caliber and make in a 16" rifle?

Jim n Iowa · « **Reply #1 on:** December 03, 2003, 03:54:13 PM »

I guess I got lucky, I asked my local dealer to check around for a Marlin 1894p (16.25" ported) as I found out they were recently discontinued. They found one that owner had never fired, came in and traded. The 1894 does not feed all ammo well, other than that its a great rifle as I know what it likes. Winchester makes a 16" in a 44 a "trapper". I bought mine for hogs and black bear. I was holding out for a 480 but it never happened. Now it seems Marlin is going to build one. I will stick with the 44 for now.
Jim

Graycg · « **Reply #2 on:** December 03, 2003, 04:30:21 PM »

Both are good pig guns, I'd give the edge to the 44 given the typically shorter ranges found in pig hunting. If you can find a 35 remington shorty that also would be a good choice.

regards,
graycg

NM Brushpopper · « **Reply #3 on:** December 03, 2003, 05:32:14 PM »

Both calibers are good choices. .30-30 in the Winchester '94 onlybecause it was not originally made for pistol calibers. A Marlin '94, or Winchester '92 or clone in .44 mag......or go to 18.5" with a 45/70!

Mikey · « **Reply #4 on:** December 04, 2003, 04:24:58 AM »

srcjahc: about the shortest, lightest and most powerful of levers available today might be in the 444 or 45-70 calibers from either the Marlin Guide Guns, Outfitters, or Winchester 94 Big Bore Timber Carbines or even their traditional Rifle in 444. They are all short and brutal enough for anything youc an hunt. Of course, you can always go for a Winchester 94 in 30-30, or in one of the heavier pistol calibers like the 44 mag. HTH. Mikey.

Castaway · « **Reply #5 on:** December 04, 2003, 07:14:50 AM »

Good question, but like everyone else, I have my opinion. If you handload, a Trapper in 45 Colt will certainly do the job. Is it any better than a 44 Mag? In all honesty, not so's the critter will notice. Dead is dead. I just like the old cartridge

Graybeard · « **Reply #6 on:** December 04, 2003, 07:49:04 AM »

The .44 Mag. or .45 Colt (with reloads or hotter stuff from small makers) will do an excellent job. Marlin has now announced they will be chambering for the .480 Ruger/.475 Linebaugh. Now this one to me is the IDEAL chambering for your needs.

GB

lgm270 · « **Reply #7 on:** December 05, 2003, 04:47:58 PM »

According to most hand loading manuals, there is very little ballistic difference between 20" and 16" barrels in the .30-30 WCF so you don't really loose that much with the 16" Trapper.

Personally, I like the .44 Magnum in the Trapper. For a close range stopper it is fully the equal of the 30-30. Beyond 100 yards, it drops like a stone. You specified close range so the .44 Magnum should fill your needs.

Best of luck.

Old Syko · « **Reply #8 on:** December 05, 2003, 05:24:07 PM »

The Marlin 444p is my choice. The 45-70 Guide Gun also fills the bill. I've never felt the need to carry half a box of ammo in the mag tube when the idea is to make the first one count. If you're set on a shorter round the 480 would sure be worth consideration though.

daddywpb · « **Reply #9 on:** December 07, 2003, 12:42:37 AM »

I have an 1894P, and a Winchester Trapper in 45 LC. I like 'em both. They are both accurate, fun little guns and have fed everything I've thrown at them. I didn't know Marlin has discontinued the 1894P. That's a real shame.

Big Blue · « **Reply #10 on:** December 07, 2003, 03:00:16 PM »

Marlin 1894P, they are still available, but are getting harder to find. The .44 Mag. feeds extremely well in this gun, even the longer handloaded ammo. I use 320 grain Cast Performance bullets in mine at about 1550 FPS, they measure 1.700" and feed as well as any 240 grains. I got a buck on Monday with it. A 70-80 yard shot that dropped the deer in his tracks. I use a Williams peep, firesight setup, that works great on this fast handling little powerhouse.

Don

Big Blue · « **Reply #11 on:** December 13, 2003, 01:00:33 PM »

Quote from: cknight98

Big Blue,

can you post a pic of that sight setup? it intrests me...

i am going out Wednesday through Sunday chasing hogs and whitetails and i am gonna carry my Winchester 94AE Trapper in .44mag...i have plenty of confidence in it as long as i do my part...

Sorry but the only digital camera I have is a POS that I bought when they first came out. About $800.00 then, and doen't work now.
Williams web site might have it posted. This comes from Williams as a set for the 1894 Marlin and probably for the Winchester 94. I had to drill, and reblue, the front sight hood to let light in for the firesight, only to find out that these slotted hoods are available. The set up does work great on these fast handling guns. If I had a scope on this gun, I couldn't have been quick enough to get this deer.

Don

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #12 on:** December 13, 2003, 02:46:21 PM »

graybeard hit it right on the head hold off until Marlin releases the .475s it is going to one sweet little powerhouse.

phydaux · « **Reply #13 on:** December 13, 2003, 03:54:46 PM »

Davidson's Gallery of Guns has a Legacy Sports Intl. 92 Puma in 454 with a 16" bbl. SS . It would be the "Hammer of Thor".

Jason Castello · « **Reply #14 on:** December 15, 2003, 10:08:02 AM »

I set up this 1895 45-70. 16.25 in barrel AO express sights and bushnell 2 -7 pistol scope. We hunt thickets and this normally leaves big holes and lots of blood if the deer runs at all. On this deer it did neither and the deer ran 100 yds. I guess there is always exceptions.

- Jason

lgm270 · « **Reply #15 on:** December 15, 2003, 04:07:53 PM »

Jason: Well done. A great trophy and a great story. What kind of loads did you use and where did you shoot him?

Jason Castello · « **Reply #16 on:** December 16, 2003, 03:57:09 AM »

lgm270,

The load is the factory rem 405 gr 45-70. He was quatering to me at 30 yds and the wind had been swirling all morning so when he gave me a chance to move I took the shot. I always try to split the diffrence between the front legs with the verticle crosshair, then come up 1/3 the deer's body. This will put the bullet through the deer's heart from any angle, but I was thinking about making sure I had that short barrel over the wall of the stand ( I was in a house- It was pouring rain) and hit him about 3 inches higher than I wanted. Hit both lungs and the liver -went over the heart and exited right in front of opposite rear leg real low. The bullet penetrated about 30 inches and I didn't know it exited until we skinned him. Some intestines had pulled through the flank, but stayed under the skin plugging up the hole. I think this load runs at about 1100 fps through this short barrel and mostly just pokes a .45 hole through them. I don't know about expansion- never recovered a bullet.

-Jason

Black Jaque Janaviac · « **Reply #17 on:** December 16, 2003, 12:15:06 PM »

If I felt the need for more gun than my .357mag lever action, I would get a Rossi .454 Casull.

According to the Winchester Ammo guide the .454 already has 1800 ft-lbs FROM A 7.5" PISTOL BARREL. The same booklet lists the KE of a .30-30 at a little over 1900 ft-lbs at the muzzle.

My brother has a T/C Encore with a 15" bbl and we chronographed a 240 grain bullet going over 2000 fps for over 2100 ft-lbs of KE. That's plenty more than a .30-30.

Perhaps the only thing the .454 lacks over the .30-30 is long range. The .30-30 bullets travel a little more efficiently.

Old Griz · « **Reply #18 on:** December 26, 2003, 10:40:13 PM »

I'd get the Winchester Trapper in .30-30.
1. The model 94 was made for the longer .30-30 cartridge. Some folks have had trouble with the pistol rounds in the 94, but Winchester keeps on making it in pistol rounds, so the trouble might not be as bad as it seems, or they're just too stubborn to bring back the model 92. You might not have a lick of trouble with the .44, but why go through all that time, money and aggravation?
2. As someone else suggested, the .30-30 will give you longer range.
3. Marlin has had trouble with their 1894 in 44 mag. For some reason this caliber has really given them headaches with feeding and accuracy. If you go on the Marlin talk forum, this is not a new problem. I got rid of mine because at first it wouldn't feed, and once that problem was fixed, it shot all over the target at 25 yards. No matter what ammo I used, it still ended up looking like I fired a shotgun at the target.
4. If you're really sold on the .44 mag., go with the Winchester 92 if you can find one (especially in a 16"--good luck!), or (best bet) a Puma 92 clone in .44 mag. You can get these with a short barrel I think. Your 16" barrel length is really gonna limit you on choices.

Like Graybeard said, Marlin is comming out with a .480 and .454, but I doubt they will have the barrel length you're looking for (But boy-hidey, they'd sure be great on hogs at close range!)
:cb2:

Yanqui · « **Reply #19 on:** December 30, 2003, 04:35:42 AM »

Quote from: Jason Castello

I set up this 1895 45-70. 16.25 in barrel AO express sights and bushnell 2 -7 pistol scope. We hunt thickets and this normally leaves big holes and lots of blood if the deer runs at all. On this deer it did neither and the deer ran 100 yds. I guess there is always exceptions.

- Jason

Nice SCOUT RIFLE you have there. That is what a true SCOUT RIFLE is supposed to look and handle like. That is what the whole SCOUT RIFLE CONCEPT is supposed to be about.

"A general purpose rifle is a conveniently portable, individually operated firearm, capable of striking a single decisive blow, on a live target of up to 200 kilos in weight, at any distance at which the operator can shoot with the precision necessary to place a shot in a vital area of the target."
-- Jeff Cooper, To Ride, Shoot Straight, and Speak the Truth

Mine is a Winchester 94 Wrangler 30-30 fitted with AO sights and Leupold Scout Scope/AO Scout Mount. I haven't had the luck you have though.

I'm jealous.