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Offline williamlayton

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« on: October 26, 2003, 02:49:12 AM »
i recently saw a program on tv-it was talking about the changing face of fishing. bass fishing is by far and away the most popular form of fishing in america. you say- well duh. but they brought up some things i had not realized--changed before my very eyes and did not see it.
this change has occurred since the 60's. now this was right after i began the sport so it has happened during my watch.
the reasons for change is boiled down to two things--more water impoundment and boats. thinking back i can see the truth in all this.
well- I thought it was interesting.
blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline Skipper

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« Reply #1 on: October 27, 2003, 05:25:42 AM »
I'd give a lot of credit to Ray Scott.  

BASS started in '68, and IMO was the major player in making bass fishing what it is today.  things have changed over the last 10 years, but back in the 70's and 80's every town in the south had a bass club, People fished in them who to be honest didn't care for fishing because it became the thing to do.  Have you ever heard of a Trout Club?  I doubt it, I never have.  Sure, there are Walleye Clubs now fishing tournaments in the mid west, and that sport is a rising deal, but its got a long way to go to catch bass fishing.

Skipper
There's Fishing and then there's Bass Fishing 
Its kinda like the difference between Sandlot Baseball and Playing on the Team. 
The difference is Practice

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Offline williamlayton

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« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2003, 04:52:56 PM »
well i tried ta post but---anywho i'll do it gain.
what i wuz tryin ta splain was growin up most of tha fishin was in tha rivers or small private lakes--ya know cat fishin, bream, crappie, bluegill. there was some effort ta bass fish but it wasn't a big thang. when we started-this part of tha world anyway--poundin up these rivers-lakes livingsto, sam rayburn, toledo bend, ect it made fishin from those old marine plywood flatbottoms purty hard. then tha boats got bigger, motors better an tha bass fishin went an took off.
i member seein my first ceneter console--big ol boston whaler-lotta teak-costed probable 5000$ in 19and68--lotta money.
blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline T/C nimrod

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« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2003, 02:08:12 AM »
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Have you ever heard of a Trout Club? I doubt it, I never have.


You never heard of Trout Unlimited? In my area of Pa. there are two(2) organizations that pertain to fly fishing for trout. And, last time I saw the ESPN Outdoor Games there was a trout fishing competition.

It all depends what your interests are - there are clubs for every species of fish.

Offline williamlayton

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« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2003, 02:22:44 AM »
well there used to be-could still be-an organization called S.A.L.T. (saltwater anglers league of texas)-it began in beaumont-texas by god-and we had a chapter in houston. i belonged for many years but when i left it-jest cause i got outta fishin fer awhile-i didn't keep up with it.
blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline Skipper

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« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2003, 03:01:58 AM »
Our local lake here hosts several hundred bass tournaments in a given year.  There's 2 Tuesday night tournaments that run from late April to October and fish every Tuesday night.  Then there's the Wednesday nighter, the Thursday nighter, Bassin' Baptist, Laurel Outdoors, Poor Boys, and about 2 dozen big money tournaments sponsored by local organizations like the factories and little league football.  Oh, the lake gets about 1.5 million trout stocked in it per year.  Is there a trout tournament?  Nooo.  Not on your life.  Is there interest in trout fishing?  Yes, but the bass fishermen outnumber the trout fishermen by about 100 to 1.  

This is just 1 lake, and it is typical of any lake in the southeast.  Go to Norris, and it has the same thing, so does Douglas, Cherokee, Watts Bar, Dale Hollow, and every other lake in the southeast.  Bass fishing is huge compared to the others.

Skipper
There's Fishing and then there's Bass Fishing 
Its kinda like the difference between Sandlot Baseball and Playing on the Team. 
The difference is Practice

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Offline T/C nimrod

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« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2003, 07:33:17 AM »
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Bass fishing is huge compared to the others


Keep an open mind skipper - bass fishing is more commercialized compared to the others. Walk into your local department store and try to find a Pikie minnow or a Lindy dipsy diver. Then try to fill your cart with shallow running crankbaits, tubes, spinnerbaits, etc.

This relates to a small town I know of. 90% of the people that live in the town drive a Pontiac of some kind. Why? There's one car dealership, I'll give you two(2) guess' what they sell, and the first doesn't count.

You are exactly correct - bass anglers out numbering all other anglers combined. But to say there are no other clubs for other species of fish (trout) isn't based on fact.

Offline Skipper

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« Reply #7 on: October 28, 2003, 10:53:28 AM »
You've got to remember, Bass Fishing as a sport started in the south and spread from there.  I'll give you that in the Mid West, Walleye are far more popular, and there are places that trout are very popular, (North Carolina for instance).  In the southeast though, there is no doubt that Bass are king.  These 2 Tuesday night tournaments I spoke of have about 100 boats between the 2 of them.  Its not uncommon for a Saturday tournament in this part of the country to have in excess of 200 boats, and I have fished in a tournament with just over 380 boats in it.  The irony is, the same lake with that 380 boat tournament will also likely host 1 or 2 other smaller tournaments with between 30 and 50 boats in them.  

I guess talking about BASS in today's new world is a little out of tune for me, but BASS has a ton of members, and a good majority of them fish tournaments.  Yes, I know, Trout Unlimited is an organization, but you'd have to look toward DU or the NWTF to find an organization as big as BASS.  That said, with the ESPN buyout, a lot of people have become somewhat dissatified with BASS, and OP Bass and Fishers of Men have grown their membership.  So really, there are now 3 major bass fishing organizations.  There are in actuality more than that.  I don't really know how many there are, its like asking a cattle farmer, "How many beef breeds are there?"  Well the answer is hundreds, some may only have a couple of herds though.

As far as what the department stores like Wal Mart of K mart stock, I don't put a lot of confidence in that in determining Bass fishermen.  Most that I know of prefer to purchase from a local bait store who caters to them, the memebers of their club, and sponsors their tournaments.  I'd venture to say that the 2 bigger local stores in this area out sell Wal Mart on bait and tackle by a good margin.  Why?  The Wally World computer doesn't know what's biting on what or where to get it or how to sell it.

Skipper
There's Fishing and then there's Bass Fishing 
Its kinda like the difference between Sandlot Baseball and Playing on the Team. 
The difference is Practice

www.Skipsoutdoors.com

Offline 1911crazy

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« Reply #8 on: October 28, 2003, 12:40:59 PM »
I was watching Jerry McKinnis before all these others were even around he is in the bass fishing hall of fame without ever fishing a bass tornie just because he was the very beginning of bass fishing on TV.  This is also a time when you built your own bass boat and Jerry talked about building a new one each year the plywood boats only lasted one season.  I still enjoy Jerry's reruns(old shows) today while they use old tackle the fishing is the same.  It kind of turns back the clock for me anyway. But bass fishing sure has changed your right with the new bass boats it just keeps on getting better.  And your right about trout fishing too I'm not crazy about it but there is too many people who just fish the first month every opening season then their gone the rest of the year.  Our hatcheries are stocking trout every year while our old bass hatcheries just sit and i can't figure that out why they stopped stocking bass to keep up with fishing pressure?  The bass being caught have declined in the past 4 years here its less and less fish.  While the tornie in lake champlain had its best ever catch everyone had fish I think its just the little places taht suffer.  We still have a long way to go all the heavy fishing pressure will get worse as time goes on.  Its not the C&R guys its the ones who eat the bass its not a never ending supply and it must be managed better for the sport to continue.  Maybe a shorter keeper season would be better.                                                           BigBill





Now before Jerry McKinnis there was the "Flying Fisherman"  or "Gad about Gadis" this guy had his own float plane and was a pilot he would fly in isolated lakes and fish.  These were black & white shows.

Offline Skipper

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« Reply #9 on: October 28, 2003, 05:15:13 PM »
Every year they have the trout stocking meetings around here, and every year, the bass fishermen raise sand about it.  They don't care, that's what they are going to do.

I don't think Jerry's hardly that old to have had to have fished out of plywood boats.  I know East Tennessee is sort of special in the bass boat world as is Arkansas, but Mac Crumbley's dad built the first fiberglass Norris Craft in 52 or 3.  About 3 years later, Allison designed a pad V hull to put under it, and the rest is history.  The first bass boat of course was a Skeeter back in the 40's.  They started building fiberglass rigs about the same time Mac did.

When Bass started in 1968, it was about the same time that Ranger boats started.  They were crude at the time, and 75 hp was a huge engine.  By 1975, there was a host of builders.  Astroglass, Pro Craft, Bass Cat, and more, and engines had grown to 115 hp and even 125 and 150's.  Most of the boats of that time period were between 16' and 18' long and rated for 115 hp.  When Merc put out the 150, there became a big market for stickers.  People would hang a 150 on a 16' boat and put 115 stickers on it to get it "legal".  I know, I had one.  The early 80's saw the first 200's and slightly bigger more refined boats.  The pad hull had spread from east Tennessee, and gone were the tri-hulled bass rigs.  through the 80's boats kept getting longer and motors kept getting bigger.  250 hp were somewhat common, and there's nothing like the sound of a wound up Bridgeport Merc scooting a Bullet up the lake at 80+.  Like muscle cars, the liability thing hit the tournament promoters.  18' became the standard bass rig which lasted till the middle 90's.  150 hp became the standard limit for tournaments.  With the right jets though, a 150 can be turned into a 200, and it would take a thorough tech inspection to prove it.  By the middle 90's boats in excess of 90 inch beams became real popular, and as more tournaments began to be held on the great lakes and coastal areas, 20' and 21' boats became more popular.  150 hp wasn't sufficient to push the new 2000lb bass boat hull which had ballooned from around 1200 lbs just 10 years ago.  Most tournaments now allow up to 250 hp as long as you are legal on your coast guard plate.  Oh, the East Tennessee Speed Triangle, many of them come strapped with a 300 hp Pro Max on them and will run 80+ with a tournament load, and just under 100 empty with just a driver.

Have boats changed the way the Bass Fishing game is played?  Yes to an extent, but I don't think they are the major factor.  Amoung other things that BASS has done, probably the most has been made of the "Rules of the Sport".  When people go crappie fishing, the rules are, don't catch more than 60, and they have to be 10 inches long.

Bass Fishing on the other hand has a whole set of unwritten and written rules that have brought structure to a sport that would otherwise just be fishing.  Things like "No Trolling", "No Live Bait", "C & R", and "Sportsmanship" have added a level of structure to a sport that would otherwise be no different IMO for the 2 zillion other species fishing.  I've noticed some things are making their way into other fishing worlds.  C&R and no trolling to name a few.  

I think its the sttucture of the sport that keeps people slapping the water with that blade.

Skipper
There's Fishing and then there's Bass Fishing 
Its kinda like the difference between Sandlot Baseball and Playing on the Team. 
The difference is Practice

www.Skipsoutdoors.com

Offline williamlayton

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« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2003, 01:46:36 AM »
skipper--why do-if i read your post correctly-the bass folks not like the trout stocking program? i suspect there is more in formation that needs to be shared.
by the by--we have a very good re fish stocking program down here and it has really helped the population.
blessings
TEXAS, by GOD

Offline Skipper

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« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2003, 04:15:58 AM »
Bass fishermen feel like they are footing the bill for the fisheries department, and no effort is being put forth on their part to help the bass population, but they will stock 1.5 million trout per year in the lake.  

IMO, while it is true, that trout will make a bass a meal every now and them, I feel like the majority of the time, the trout are eating bait fish that would otherwise feed ole bucket mouth, and 1.5 million fish would tend to eat a lot of bait.

Skipper
There's Fishing and then there's Bass Fishing 
Its kinda like the difference between Sandlot Baseball and Playing on the Team. 
The difference is Practice

www.Skipsoutdoors.com

Offline 1911crazy

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« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2003, 04:38:31 AM »
Just recently they (ESPN) showed Jerry on his old reruns and he was talking while they were showing pictures of one of his old boats that he built.  And he said he built a new one every year.  I wish they showed more of his old shows.                                         BigBill

Its good for all youngins to see where this sport started and where it came from to where it is today.

Offline Skipper

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« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2003, 05:18:23 AM »
I met Jerry once in Alabama years ago.  We were crappie fishing on Weiss, and he was filming a show there.  He'd spent 2 days trying to get footage, and we were catching about 100 a day.  The last day, we put him on fish.

Skipper
There's Fishing and then there's Bass Fishing 
Its kinda like the difference between Sandlot Baseball and Playing on the Team. 
The difference is Practice

www.Skipsoutdoors.com

Offline 1911crazy

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« Reply #14 on: October 29, 2003, 05:53:41 AM »
I always watched his shows for years and still enjoy the old ones today.  I see him on the flw tour shows on espn he did get old??(we did too?)  He is well respected in the bass fishing world today by the pro's and fisherman alike too.                                                               BigBill

Offline Savage

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« Reply #15 on: October 29, 2003, 10:59:29 AM »
Don't trout make good forage for bass? They seem to in Kalifornia.
Savage
An appeaser is one who feeds the crocodile hoping it will eat him last,

Offline 1911crazy

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« Reply #16 on: October 29, 2003, 12:36:43 PM »
Quote from: Savage
Don't trout make good forage for bass? They seem to in Kalifornia.
Savage


YES big bass eat trout in California they eat my panfish here and most likely trout too I have been using the 9" castraic trout lure here and had no luck yet with the bigger bass I have seen.  It was on TV they were fishing for big trophy bass in California with Hank Parker and some of the guys from the trophybassonly website.  They were using the big castraic trout lure it looked like 16" long.  This Hank Parker show  ran for two weeks to complete.  They actually stock the lake with trout and the bass cleanup on them for sure.  I guess their the main diet.     BigBill

I've been trying this trout lure with no luck yet but sooner or later I'll land a new state record I just know it.

Offline Savage

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« Reply #17 on: October 29, 2003, 01:06:48 PM »
Bill,
Keep it up Bill, bet you do catch that big one!
Savage
An appeaser is one who feeds the crocodile hoping it will eat him last,

Offline Skipper

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« Reply #18 on: October 29, 2003, 04:42:58 PM »
Yes, bass do eat trout, but

Most of the time, a trout lives in deep deep water.  On this paticular lake, trout are found at 60+ feet.  That's far below where you'd find a bass.  I figure there's some Kentucky's down there, a few, and some smallies, but the largemouth for the most part are in 20 feet or less.

Trout also get rather large.  It would take a big bass to eat the majority of the trout in that lake.  I'm talking about a bass in excess of 7 lb.  This lake does kind of surprise me from time to time in producing a big largemouth.  In any given year, I expect to hear of several in the 8 lb class, and a few in the 10 lb class.  However, the typical fish is right at 15" and around 2 lbs.  The amount of bass fishing pressure on the lake is tremendous, which IMO keeps the fish on the small side.  15" is a keeper Largemouth and 18" for a smallmouth.  You tend to wade though several before getting a keeper.  I'd say it would be pretty accurate to assume that any bass in the lake that is in the 16" range has been caught at least twice in its lifetime.

Skipper
There's Fishing and then there's Bass Fishing 
Its kinda like the difference between Sandlot Baseball and Playing on the Team. 
The difference is Practice

www.Skipsoutdoors.com