Author Topic: Need a rifle for my neice? (Read 1180 times)

30-30man · « **on:** July 28, 2009, 02:39:06 PM »

I would like to order one of these Handi rifles for my neice. She has shown great interest in hunting with me last year and I would like to buy her something she can use. I don't want to spend a lot because I don't know if she will stick with it and it may become part of my collection. My neice is 12 years-old and can handle the SKS with 154 grains quite well. She is still sensitive to recoil, so I need a light recoil caliber. It's just all the SKS' I have don't group worth a crap. They were never intended to be scoped, I know but it is all I had in a light recoil caliber. I would like to buy her a 243 with a youth stock but want the bull barrel to add weight so recoil is limited. The only guns I see on the site that come with bull barrels are the survivor. Do the bull barrels have to be ordered as a separate item fitted to your receiver? I can't see where that is an option on the H&R site. Any help would be greatly appreciated as I am going to order one at the end of this week. Season opens here August 15th but I doubt we will hunt until late September, it's just too dang hot this year and I have not taken the heat very well lately in my old age.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #1 on:** July 28, 2009, 02:51:44 PM »

The SB2-343 has a 22" bull barrel, or you can send a frame in for that barrel if it qualifies, you'd have to check with them on that, they've tightened requirements for accessory barrels. You can swap stocks easily, buy or trade for a youth stock. You could also get the standard contour barrel which is heavier than a standard sporter weight, and add weight to the stock bolt hole if it's a problem.

Tim

http://www.hr1871.com/Firearms/Rifles/youth.asp

http://www.hr1871.com/Support/accessoryProgram.asp

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/351/products_id/89113

mechanic · « **Reply #2 on:** July 28, 2009, 02:59:37 PM »

Another option would be the 357 mag. rifle, if it can be had. Almost no recoil, low noise excellent shooter.

gstewart44 · « **Reply #3 on:** July 28, 2009, 04:25:30 PM »

3030 barrel on a Handi ....everything she will need.

blind ear · « **Reply #4 on:** July 28, 2009, 04:25:50 PM »

I secound MECHANIC on the 357, especially if you limit her to 100 yd or less. Bullit placement isn't as critical as with the 243. JMHO, eddie

Badnews Bob · « **Reply #5 on:** July 28, 2009, 11:19:14 PM »

.357, my favorite or a .44 would work just fine.

fish280 · « **Reply #6 on:** July 29, 2009, 02:00:32 AM »

.30-30

PHATINJUN · « **Reply #7 on:** July 29, 2009, 02:36:18 AM »

If you are sold on the 243 there are two for a pretty good price right now in the classifieds one being SS. If I were to buy new gun for her and you need it soon I would go with the 30-30 though. Kurt

gofish · « **Reply #8 on:** July 29, 2009, 02:40:50 AM »

+1 3030

vabowhntr · « **Reply #9 on:** July 29, 2009, 03:48:57 AM »

I like the 30-30, Rem even makes reduced recoil loads (

) that would work very well out to 100 yards and recoil far less than a 243. Second choice would be the 357 if shots are not too far.

One other thing to check on, if you have a rifle in 308, 30-06, 7mm-08, 270 (and a few others I have not seen yet), Remingtons Managed recoil ammo has worked very well for me on a few deer. They all have a little heavier bullet than a 243 and still are just as light or lighter in the recoil dept. All managed recoil (except the 30-30 load) are good to about 200 yards on deer. I have killed many deer with the 30-06 managed recoil round. It fires a 125 gr PSP corelokt bullet at about 2600 fps. All shots have been 40-60 yards, and I am yet to recover a bullet and all of my kills have been DRT.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #10 on:** July 29, 2009, 04:07:48 AM »

If you handload, you can make your own managed recoil rounds.

Tim

http://hodgdon.com/PDF/Youth%20Loads.pdf

30-30man · « **Reply #11 on:** July 29, 2009, 04:34:59 AM »

Thanks for the suggestions guys. The only con I can think of is that I've read about a lot of problems with the H&R 243 barrels, does this hold water or is it just internet rag? I have several 30-30s and I have always thought the 243 had less recoil as the bullets were lighter. I use to own a Remington 700 in 243, and it seemed to have less recoil than my Marlins. If I go the pistol round route, wouldn't a slug from a .410 be just as good with about the same range? I already own one of those..Shoot I'm talking myself out of it now....I wish they made a good deer round for the .223, as the biggest deer we've seen around her has been 200lbs. Most are in the 100-160lb range. It's just two hot here for them to get any bigger. I've seen the 223 kill deer good, I'm just a little leery about it as a deer round. I know it has much lower recoil than any of the ones we talked about. Thanks keep the suggestions coming..

petemi · « **Reply #12 on:** July 29, 2009, 04:46:29 AM »

I'm prejudiced, but I'd go with the .357. She can practice with .38s, hunt with .357s, and ream it to max when she's a little older. I traded my 6mm long ago because it didn't kill deer the way I like to. It killed them, but not a bang, flop very often. That was with heavy bullets, and I certainly wouldn't use light ones on deer. I think a 158 or 180 grain pistol bullet out of a Handi will kill better inside a 100 yards. JMHO

Pete

dieselten · « **Reply #13 on:** July 29, 2009, 04:54:10 AM »

30-30 man

send me your address and i will send you a Handi youth synthetic butt stock off of a .22 rimfire rifle. I have no use for it and it sounds like you can put it to good use! You could buy a heavy barrel 243 and put this on it, or put this on a rifle you already have.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #14 on:** July 29, 2009, 04:56:54 AM »

I don't have any problems with my 243 H&Rs, I have 4 of them, two Superlights and two Ultras, one of which I had rechambered to 6mmAI, all shoot excellent, ejector barrels have a bad reputation in general for high pressure rimless chamberings, but even that can be dealt with 3 of mine are ejectors, the only time I've had a case stick was my fault for not wiping the chamber after cleaning at the range. All recent production barrels are extractors making sticking brass a moot issue. The 243s do tend to show a preference for lighter or heavier bullets tho, some like the heavier 95-100gr loads, others seem to like them 90gr or lighter, but that can be said for a lot of rifles, just depends on the barrel.

There are some great 223 deer bullets that have been used very successfully, the 53gr Barnes, 60gr Partition and 64gr Win PP for a few, hopefully some of the fellas that use them will chime in, the 223 isn't legal for deer here, so I can't speak personally on it, but there have been many discussions on it here, the success of others using it have changed my view on it, it's recommended by many state wildlife depts for their youth hunts, with good bullets and proper shot placement and range, it's ideal for little people.

410 Slugs aren't very highly respected for deer if you read in the H&R shotgun forum, but I have no use for a 410 to begin with, so I have no experience with it, so take it for what it's worth, just what I've read there.

Tim

snakeman · « **Reply #15 on:** July 29, 2009, 04:59:49 AM »

I would go with the .357 mag as well. The accuracy is outstanding and the recoil is minimal. I find myself taking this gun more than any other rifle I have. Plus it uses the same ammo as my revolver.

snakeman

30-30man · « **Reply #16 on:** July 29, 2009, 05:22:40 AM »

Thanks for the offer on the youth stock! This is such a great board with great members. PM sent. I am now leaning toward a 223 survivor in 223. I would just add the youth stock and be good to go. The 223 barely kicks at all. I think it would be a good combo for under 10o yards. What do you fellows think?

Couger · « **Reply #17 on:** July 29, 2009, 05:44:20 AM »

Quote from: 30-30man

Thanks for the offer on the youth stock! This is such a great board with great members. PM sent. I am now leaning toward a 223 survivor in 223. I would just add the youth stock and be good to go. The 223 barely kicks at all. I think it would be a good combo for under 10o yards. What do you fellows think?

Nothing wrong with a .223Remy nor in the Survivor mode (if you don't mind the fugly stock and storearm!).

I have one in .308W.

If your state allows shooting deer with the .223R, I believe Winchester offers a load with their 64grn PowerPoint bullet.

Otherwise you'll have the receiver and one of the "must-have" barrels (in .223) in my opinion, to begin collecting other barrels for.

I'm not a .30-30 fan but would have leaned that way twas it me.

Too bad the Hamdi isn't readily available in the 7-30 Waters! I think that would make an excellent mild-recoil deer-killing singleshot, esp if reloaded with pointie boolits.

(120 to 140 grains)

BBF · « **Reply #18 on:** July 29, 2009, 06:16:51 AM »

Recoil from a .243 Win. rifle just boggles my mind. Unless the girl is a midget she should be fine as long as the stock fits her!

wreckhog · « **Reply #19 on:** July 29, 2009, 07:04:13 AM »

Survivor stock is shorter than a regular stock. By the way if .243 is marginal what is .223?

30-30man · « **Reply #20 on:** July 29, 2009, 08:41:08 AM »

I think the 223 will do the job and maybe we can add another barrel when she gets proficient. Our deer here for the most part can be put down with about anything if you use good judgement and shot placement. Any centerfire is legal in SC, just no rimfire. I want her to be able to kill a deer this season. I don't want her to get discouraged and I love the time we get to spend together. It warms my heart that she shows an interest in spending time with me. She lost her dad when she was three due to a motorcycle accident and I have stepped in with my nephew and neice to be a dad I guess. They live down the road from me so they are like my own I guess. The nephew hunts on his own now, and I'd like to give her the same time as I did her brother. I know she can shoot every rifle I have even my old Mosin Nagants that are a bit brutal after a couple of rounds. It's just that I want her to be able to hit what she is aiming at rather quickly. I've seen too many youngsters put off on shooting because of the expected recoil. They develop bad flinching habits rather quickly.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #21 on:** July 29, 2009, 08:59:01 AM »

You may be aware of it, but I'll mention this any way, others may not. Part of "felt recoil" is from the stock comb, a neoprene cartridge carrier with a little foam tucked underneath will go a long ways toward negating the affects of recoil for new shooters. That in conjunction with an aftermarket recoil pad like a Limbsaver and good hearing protection can make for an enjoyable experience for them..... us old guys too!!

Tim

mechanic · « **Reply #22 on:** July 29, 2009, 08:59:44 AM »

My Dad hunted with a 223 the last couple of years of his life. They will kill deer, as he killed three in those last two years...

gstewart44 · « **Reply #23 on:** July 29, 2009, 09:29:15 AM »

I have let my 11 yr old son hunt hogs with 243 (standard 22" handi), 223 (ruger 20" barrel) and 3030 (Win 94 20"). Of course the recoil of the 223 (64 gr PP) is negligible. the recoil of the 243 (100gr PSP) and the 3030 (150 gr FP) he says is about the same, and not a problem. But he is shy of muzzle blast, even with ear protection on. For that reason he says he likes the 3030 the best.

We have taken hogs with all three cartridge and will do so in the future. But I have to agree the 3030 is "tamer" coming out the end of the barrel than the other two....even with my old ears.....

vabowhntr · « **Reply #24 on:** July 29, 2009, 11:09:40 AM »

If you have several 30-30s I definately would take a look at the managed recoil round. Very light recoil with a 125 gr slug with just under 1000 fpe at 100 yards, but less recoil than a 243. Under 6 lbs of recoil in a 8.5 lb rifle/scope pkg. I like having the extra weight on the bullet over the 243 and 223, too. My handi is in .308 with a muzzle break and I shoot the managed recoil rounds and hardly feel a thing.

http://www.remington.com/products/ammunition/ballistics/comparative_ballistics_results.aspx?data=RL30301

Of course, as Tim said, if you reload you can make your own at the recoil level you want. That is what I do now.

If you choose the 223, I have heard decent things about the barnes and the 64gr win. Just too small a bullet for me...

Badnews Bob · « **Reply #25 on:** July 29, 2009, 11:26:44 AM »

the .357 recoils less IMHO than the .223 and also the .357 is a better deer cartridge, once again my opinion. I have both and I have killed deer with both. I much prefer the .357, I think the recoil is less as is the noise, and I like the way the bigger bullets smack a deer.

The .223 is a fine round, I like it for varmits out to 300 yards but for deer inside of 159 gimmie a .357.

A plus side to the .357 is being able to shoot light .38 loads up to uber mag levels and then to the max if you wanna. Lead bullets and light loads can be shot for not much more than .22LRs Nothing else can touch one for that. Also they are usually crazy accurate.

They are in the top three all time favorite Handies for good reason.

PHATINJUN · « **Reply #26 on:** July 29, 2009, 02:55:39 PM »

If you are leary about a 223 stay way far away from the 410 if you are not hand loading them yourself they are just to marginal and you need to really limit your range. Also make sure you stay away from FMJ stuff in the 223 or any bullet for hunting .Don't be scared of the 243 there have been some problems with them but nothing that can't be fixed with loads and stock adjustments.Kurt

briannmilewis · « **Reply #27 on:** July 30, 2009, 04:53:38 AM »

Quote from: mechanic on July 28, 2009, 02:59:37 PM

Another option would be the 357 mag. rifle, if it can be had. Almost no recoil, low noise excellent shooter.

I vote for the 357 Mag too. Haven't shot the 357 Mag in Handi, but I have shot the Marlin 1894C 357 Mag...I am a recoil woos, but that 357 Mag recoil in a rifle is just really mild and controllable. The Handi 357 is on my short list for my next purchase. Using Hornady 357 Mag LeverEvolution ammo, she would be good to go for 150 yards for whitetail. She could plink all day on 38s as well.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #28 on:** July 30, 2009, 05:13:18 AM »

I wouldn't plan on using the 140gr 357mag LE ammo for 150yds, specially if it shoots as bad as it does in mine, 4-5" groups at 100yds, muzzle velocity is a little over 1800fps, it has about 500ft/lbs energy at 150yds.

Tim

flinthead · « **Reply #29 on:** July 30, 2009, 06:00:46 AM »

This has got my interest up... what factory rounds have y'all shot out of the .357 handi's that are shooting so good?