Goex vs Swiss

[Harleytoo]

I am getting back into black powder shooting, now in cartridge reloading. Do you guys have an opinion of Goex vs Swiss. I am finding that black powder is not available in my area any longer and need to place an order. My instinct with what I have been reading is to pay more for the Swiss, but wanted to get some learned insight.

[Lead pot]

They are both good.
I went through a split case of 1.5 and 2F swiss once to see how it shot.
But I went back to Goex Express because I had less fouling control problems, it is softer.
As far as velocity difference between 1F exp and 1.5 Swiss is with in 10 fps if that is important to you.
I also use a lot of Goex cartridge.
It will be interesting to see if Hodgon will keep the powder as good as Goex has.

LP

[Harleytoo]

Seems to be a fair split between users of Swiss and Goex. Not sure the Swiss is worth the extra money.

Sounds like the Goex express may the be the ticket.

So Hogdon bought out Goex?

[John Boy]

Harley, it all depends on how you plan to shoot your BPCR.  If you are a long range shooter - Swiss.  If you are 100 -300yds, Goex will do just fine.
Swiss is the premier sporting powder because of their excellent processing procedures. 

If the wallet is a factor, KIK.  Goex Cartridge works well too

I've shot many pounds of Swiss - the various grades of Goex - Schuetzen (not a bad powder either though the burn rate is lower than Swiss) - KIK (has a high burn rate but on the dirty side) and even Lido, the Chinese firecracker powder.

If you don't shoot pounds of powder each month, my suggestion would be to buy a case with multiple brands and give them all a try.  Ten cans of Swiss 1.5 - 5 cans of Goex FFg - 5 cans of Goex Express - 2 cans of Schuetzen FFg  - 2 cans Goex Cartridge and a can of KIK FFg
The spark plug for black powder is the charcoal.  There are only 3 brands that use the best charcoal, Alder Blackthorn, they being Swiss - Schuetzen and KIK (which went out of business in 2009)
The real benchmark, the top match shooters, use Swiss as the powder of choice

PS:  Goex Express is the same price as Swiss!

[Harleytoo]

John Boy, thanks that is good info. My shooting plans will be bench shooting (precision target) at probably 100-300 yards, as you noted and hunting. Sounds like I should try them all.

[zrifleman]

Goex Express is close to or equal to the more expensive Swiss. Goex burns with softer fouling. After shooting cases of Swiss and Goex, I don't think Swiss is worth the money. Most of my shooting in BPCR is done with Goex 1 FG and Cartridge. In reading posts on the BP forums, I find more top shooters all the time are using or going back to Goex.

[Lead pot]

What zrifleman said are the same as my findings.
When it gets hot and you dont do a good job controlling your fouling swiss gets away from you.
Goex hydrates better than any powder out there.
I shoot between 4 and 5 cases powder each year that is between 100 and 125 pounds at the long range Gong shoots 1000 yards and less and my powder is Goex EXP.
If This powder would not perform good I would not use it.
Powder tests.
Swiss 1.5. 101 grains  689 grain bullet 1254 fps ES 27.6 SD 12.1
KIK 2F 689 grain bullet 1262 fps ES 54.6 SD 20.7 comment fouling very heavy and hard
Goex 1F regular 101 grains 689 gr bullet 1163 fps ES14 SD 9.9
101 grains of Goex exp 689 gr bullet 1249 fps ES 5.0 SD 2.
Like I said above swiss and the exp powders are both good.
I used these numbers because they were all shot at the same temperature and on the same day with equal loads.
The ES and SD figures normally using Swiss and EXP will run less than 10 fps for the ES and less than 5 fps for an SD using swiss or exp.
Current powder prices now by the case.
Regular Goex $13.10 per pound.
Goex exp $18.65
Swiss $19.95
KIk $10.75

[Harleytoo]

Lead Pot, thanks for the detail info. That is very helpful, especially seeing the ES and SD figures.

While I would like to try them all over time, I am more concerned with getting some good loads worked up for two new guns I have. So I think I am going to go with the Goex for now so I can minimize my variables while working up these loads. I really need to get comfortable with both bullet weights and the rifles themselves I think first. Then I can play with powder and primers and such.

Where are you getting the best deal's on powder through?

And, within the Goex brand am I reading correctly that you are seeing better accuracy with Express than standard FFg?

I really appreciate this help guys. Getting back involved in both shooting and being new to BPCR, base info like this is an absolute necessity.

[Harleytoo]

Sorry, reread the post and you already answered the Goex vs Goex express questions.

Is the Express you are using the fg or ffg? Thought the ffg was what I was to use.

[Lead pot]

Sorry, reread the post and you already answered the Goex vs Goex express questions.

Is the Express you are using the fg or ffg? Thought the ffg was what I was to use.

I have six different blk powder calibers. I use fg, and ffg
I been getting my powder for here for quite some time, and I can have it inside three days delivered.
http://www.powderinc.com/cgi-bin/bpstore/perlshop.cgi?ACTION=thispage&thispage=order.htm&ORDER_ID=306286535

[Harleytoo]

Thanks, Lead Pot. I was considering using Powder Inc. They look to have about the best prices.

[zrifleman]

Harleytoo---You didn't say what cartridge you are shooting. If it is a 45-70/45-90 etc.---try Goex 1 FG Express. If you are shooting one of the 50's, I found regular Goex 3 FG works best.

[Harleytoo]

Sorry, I will be shooting 45-70 out of a Pedersoli Sharps, an H&R Buffalo Classic and at Thompson Contender.

[Fairshake]

Let me say that I shoot a lot of Goex 2F and Cartridge powder. I've only shot a few pounds of Swiss. I've also received a lot of information from John Boy and Bill Knight. I consider both to be my friends. I will have to disagree with John Boy on his answer of Swiss for Long Range BPCR. I have recently been privileged to have a few phone conversations with Kenny Wasserburger and Jim Terry. These guys have a lot of gun time on the BPCR circuit. Kenny has more than one championship to his name. He uses Goex Express. I only wish that I could shoot like these guys. If Goex is used by them and they receive the results that they have then I think it's a no brainer. Besides that fact I'm 62 and have all my life believed in this country and buying American Products. I only hope that it stays a solid company in Louisiana and with good home people working. When you buy Swiss, KIK, DiamondBack or any others you are not supporting America.

[zrifleman]

I agree with what Fairshake said. Lately a fair number of long range shooters have "rediscovered " Goex powders. Goex definitely leaves softer fouling---that should contibute to better accuracy. I have tried all the brands and I will stick to Goex unless someone wants to give Swiss away.