Author Topic: .357 mag for bear? (Read 5759 times)

snakeman · « **on:** April 28, 2009, 11:45:51 AM »

I am going on my first elk hunting trip in October. We are going to some private land my friends have in northwest Colorado. I have a Ruger security six in .357 mag that I am going to take with me. Will this gun be enough if I need it for a bear? Thanks in advance.

snakeman

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #1 on:** April 28, 2009, 12:01:13 PM »

Your rifle will be better but if you are carrying meat or going out to take a leak. the 357 will work. i would use the heaviest bullets you can shoot well out of the gun. 158 grain JSP or 180 grain JSP and then there are all the hard cast bullets as well.
For me the Federal/ American Eagle 158 grain Jacked Soft Points are what I can control out of my 4" smith best, but I have been carrying my 44 mag when in Brown bear territory to help carry out meat and do other camp chores when toting a rifle is not practical. Other than that your rifle has 3-10 times the energy in it than your hand gun will generate and is more accurate.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #2 on:** April 28, 2009, 01:42:43 PM »

I hope this don't turn into one of them handgun/bear threads.

But I would step up to a 44 Mag at least. If 357 Mag is all you have, then I guess thats what you use.

Ken ONeill · « **Reply #3 on:** April 28, 2009, 02:26:42 PM »

The .357 Mag. is better than a stick. Use the rifle in the unlikely event that it becomes necessary.

snakeman · « **Reply #4 on:** April 28, 2009, 02:43:44 PM »

I am not looking to start a flame war. I know that a .357 is not the ideal weapon to use but I can't afford to go drop several hundred dollars on a .44. I am just wondering if it is worth taking and using the 180 gr Buffalo Bore rounds I have for it or should I just leave it at home.

snakeman

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #5 on:** April 28, 2009, 03:02:04 PM »

My $.02 worth is to take it. If nothing else as a noise maker for the first round to scare the bear. If you feel you can hit a bear with it, take it.
Again carry it with you as you are doing other things where you do not want to carry your rifle with you.
Collecting fire wood comes to mind.
Carrying your quartered animal back to camp. Helping others carry meat. what have you. In most cases the bear will leave you alone and go the other way if they hear or see you with enough space. just don''t think you can walk up to it like the Grizzley man.
Oh have any of you read the directions on the bear spray?
it says to shake the can for 10 to 15 seconds before using and to shake vigerously while using.
are they kidding?

billy_56081 · « **Reply #6 on:** April 28, 2009, 03:19:27 PM »

The 357 is a good choice for bear and an even better choice against the predator that is a thousand times more likley to attack you, ya know the 2 legged kind.

teamnelson · « **Reply #7 on:** April 28, 2009, 03:50:16 PM »

.357 mag for bear?

Depends ... I've had my bear for a long time now and would hate to part with him, but if your 357 is nice enough, I might trade with you.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #8 on:** April 28, 2009, 04:39:57 PM »

Quote from: mcwoodduck on April 28, 2009, 03:02:04 PM

My $.02 worth is to take it. If nothing else as a noise maker for the first round to scare the bear. If you feel you can hit a bear with it, take it.
Again carry it with you as you are doing other things where you do not want to carry your rifle with you.
Collecting fire wood comes to mind.
Carrying your quartered animal back to camp. Helping others carry meat. what have you. In most cases the bear will leave you alone and go the other way if they hear or see you with enough space. just don''t think you can walk up to it like the Grizzley man.
Oh have any of you read the directions on the bear spray?
it says to shake the can for 10 to 15 seconds before using and to shake vigerously while using.
are they kidding?

It gets shaken while you are running...

Ak.Hiker · « **Reply #9 on:** April 29, 2009, 08:54:37 PM »

Take the 357 loaded with the BB 180 grain cast loads. The 180 grain BB hard cast is a very good load with lots of penetration. Lots of guys carry 357 Magnums as a back up when in the woods. Just think of it as a last ditch save your bacon gun if for some reason you can not get to your rifle. A good elk load in your rifle should be a good back up for bear.

Mikey · « **Reply #10 on:** April 30, 2009, 12:50:04 AM »

snakeman: if you do not reload then get either the Buffalo Bore 180 gn cast loads or the Cor-Bon 200 gn cast loads (I believe Cor-Bon makes them). If you reload then get some 200 gn cast semi-wadcutters from either Mt. baldy Bullets or Colorado Cast Bullets and load them over 12.4 gns of WW296 (old factory load) for approximately 1300'/sec depending on barrel length. This is about the best you can get with a 357. jmtcw....

rockbilly · « **Reply #11 on:** April 30, 2009, 04:27:31 AM »

Keep in mind this area has both Black and Brown Bears. I don't think I would want to tackle a griz with a .357.

Years ago we hunted this area quite a bit, I never ran across a bear in the wild, but had my camp torn up twice by bears. Just be cautious, make lots of noise while walking, and if you have to pack your kill out a quarter at a time, be careful when you return for the next load. A bear will move in on a kill and claim it igiven the opportunity, when you try to reclaim the kill is when the SHTF.

454Puma · « **Reply #12 on:** April 30, 2009, 11:21:59 AM »

I agree stoked with 180gr BB or stout XTP 180 JHP will do for most Blackies! If thats what you got carry it.

Robert357 · « **Reply #13 on:** May 31, 2009, 10:30:59 AM »

Sure it will be fine, but make sure you have ammo that will really penetrate!

May I echo the suggestion of the 180-grain Buffalo Bore loads for your Ruger 357 Mag

http://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=100

For a Ruger Blackhawk SA, I hand load some 357 Magnums on fresh brass with 200 grain Speer TMJ silhouette bullets over enough Alliant 2400 powder that Elmer Keith would smile! The 357 Magnum at "magnum" power levels with heavy penetrating bullets is pretty impressive. If you read some of the older gun writers who hunted just about everything with a 357 Magnum, you will see that a lot of large game has been taken by the 357 magnum, some not too responsibly, but still the kind of confrontation you were implying would likely be at short range and involve multiple rounds fired. Yes, the 357 Mag can be a pretty powerful round.

Mohawk · « **Reply #14 on:** June 01, 2009, 07:26:25 PM »

In a tree stand yes, but would switch to a hard cast SWC and let him die. He should die quick with a double lung hit. I stated before I can not keep a .357 Mag 158gr Semi-Jacketed Hollow Point in a deer(a cross between a JHP and a swaged Lead Hollow Point), it blows on through with a good exit and good damage and supplied good deer meat for the freezer, but with a bear that's a whole different animal, so to speak. We don't have bears down here in Texas that I know of. Go with the SWC Hard Cast 158-180gr.

1sourdough · « **Reply #15 on:** June 02, 2009, 12:57:39 AM »

I would also take it with you. The intention would not be to shoot a bear with it, but to have it holstered at times when you don't want to be carrying a rifle. That would be when helping your partner pack out his game,(or yours) & other times when you want your hands free. In the unlikely event that a bear became a problem I'd rather have it than nothing.

bilmac · « **Reply #16 on:** June 02, 2009, 01:34:45 AM »

There aren't any griz in Colorado, they are all blacks there. A game warden in Alaska fought off a grizzly with a 357, it is way better than your fist.

guzzijohn · « **Reply #17 on:** June 02, 2009, 02:41:05 AM »

"Oh have any of you read the directions on the bear spray?
it says to shake the can for 10 to 15 seconds before using and to shake vigerously while using.
are they kidding."

If a bear is that close to me and the spray is all I have I will probably be shaking vigorously anyway.
GuzziJohn

blhof · « **Reply #18 on:** June 02, 2009, 03:10:57 AM »

Do you know the type of bear by it's spoor? I was asked this by an Alaskan guide. The answer is that the brown bear spoor is the one with bits of bear spray can in it.

billy_56081 · « **Reply #19 on:** June 02, 2009, 05:55:43 AM »

Quote from: blhof on June 02, 2009, 03:10:57 AM

Do you know the type of bear by it's spoor? I was asked this by an Alaskan guide. The answer is that the brown bear spoor is the one with bits of bear spray can in it.

And little bells!

RaySendero · « **Reply #20 on:** June 02, 2009, 06:24:21 AM »

Re: .357 mag for bear?

180 gr Buffalo Bore rounds

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #21 on:** June 02, 2009, 06:26:56 AM »

Is that why the Pepper spray cans for Brown bears come in Cajun and Blackened Flavors?

Hey a 22 will work for bear. All you have to do is shoot the guy next to you in the leg and run.

teddy12b · « **Reply #22 on:** June 02, 2009, 06:33:52 AM »

Quote from: snakeman on April 28, 2009, 02:43:44 PM

I am not looking to start a flame war. I know that a .357 is not the ideal weapon to use but I can't afford to go drop several hundred dollars on a .44. I am just wondering if it is worth taking and using the 180 gr Buffalo Bore rounds I have for it or should I just leave it at home.

snakeman

Yeah, I think it's worth taking with you. Like you said it's not ideal, but it does make a loud noise and big flash and with the right bullet will really do some damage. I think I'd rather take it and have than not have it.

How many other people are going to be with you on this hunt? My cousin & I were talking about going out west on a hunt and the topic of handguns came up. At first the three of us all were talking about a revolver, then I pointed out that 3 guys with 6 guns is being a little over eager. What I'm getting at is that not every man needs a sidearm if you're going to be in a group together 99% of the time.

bangbang47 · « **Reply #23 on:** June 08, 2009, 05:43:42 PM »

Snakeman, I would say that the 357 magnum loaded stiff and heavy as other have suggested is adequate for the job. You are the hunter, possibly guided by a guide and you’re not making your living at bringing home elk daily. But as crazy as it might sound there are a couple old guides still packing a 357 in a very strange way.
I read this article once and have no source, yet it was interesting reading. It was about an Alaskan guide a few days into an elk hunt in bear territory. The hunter was questioning the guide about the guns he was carrying, and the guide said a short levered 45/70 and a 357magnum.” What, just a 357?” The hunter said. The old guide said “yah, that’s right, just a 357”.
The guide said it was something he learned from another guide; the only guide he ever knew that was mauled by a big grizzly and lived to guide again.
The hunter said, “What’s that got to do with you carrying a 357?”
The guide pulled out his revolver and emptied all six carts and said “there all 110 grain HPs!” “110 grain HPs?” The hunter questioned! The guide pulled up the 45/70 from its scabbard and said “it’s all about range”. “ If the bear is going to charge, this is my back-up, if something goes amiss and it can happen, just as I am being mauled I will empty every last 110 grainer in the grizzly’s skull. The guide said “yep it’s all about range”.
That article sent chills. This guide took his job very seriously and had his survival right down to the last few seconds.
In your case, stay with 180 BB.

Cottonwood · « **Reply #24 on:** June 10, 2009, 01:17:19 PM »

Double Tap Ammo

180-gr WFNGC

200-gr WFNGC

Robert357 · « **Reply #25 on:** June 10, 2009, 07:56:19 PM »

Quote from: The Montanan on June 10, 2009, 01:17:19 PM

Double Tap Ammo

180-gr WFNGC

200-gr WFNGC

Elmer Keith would be very happy with that ammo. He liked heavy cast lead bullets and lots of powder for over the top performance.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #26 on:** June 12, 2009, 01:09:21 AM »

probably, maybe maybe not. I guess my thought is that if your going on an elk hunt your laying out some serious coin for the hunt. It wouldnt cost you much to go to your local gunshop and trade it on a good 44mag which would be much better. Personaly if i am going to be inconvienced by the weight of carrying a six gun along with a rifle id want it to be more effective. Usualy if im hunting with a rifle i dont carry a handgun. I either rifle hunt or handgun hunt. If im dragging out an animal i have the gun slung over my shoulder and its no big deal to carry it along even if your doing your duty. Especially hunting Elk your probably going to be putting alot of miles on your boots and i dont need another 3 lbs along for the ride. Aint like im going to drop an 06 or a 300 mag and grab my .357 anyway.

Qaz · « **Reply #27 on:** June 12, 2009, 02:13:10 AM »

At this point your mind is probably made up anyway but here goes. Everyone thinks they need a cannon for protection and you don't. You are not hunting bear with the 357 you are just carrying it as a back up. I believe the old guide is right "It is all about range", at pistol range 25yds or less maybe much less, and you are using a pistol to stop a bear(Brown or Black), I don't think it will matter if it is a 357mag or a 44mag. What will matter is can you get a second shot off with the 357mag, because I doubt you can with a 44mag. I have seen quite a few people keep a 357 level in rapid fire, but no one with a 44mag. Take the 357 and forget about it. You probably already shoot it better than you could a 44mag anyway. I bet when the chips are down, two 35 caliber holes are better than one 44 hole.
Good luck on the hunt!

teddy12b · « **Reply #28 on:** June 12, 2009, 02:19:31 AM »

Another way of looking at this... At one point in time wasn't the 357mag the biggest boy on the block? Didn't the gun writers at the time just fall head over heals for it and hunt everything with it? I thought I read some accounts of that, but I could be wrong. All things considered, you're probably not even going to need it.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #29 on:** June 13, 2009, 04:08:02 AM »

Quote from: Qaz on June 12, 2009, 02:13:10 AM

At this point your mind is probably made up anyway but here goes. Everyone thinks they need a cannon for protection and you don't. You are not hunting bear with the 357 you are just carrying it as a back up. I believe the old guide is right "It is all about range", at pistol range 25yds or less maybe much less, and you are using a pistol to stop a bear(Brown or Black), I don't think it will matter if it is a 357mag or a 44mag. What will matter is can you get a second shot off with the 357mag, because I doubt you can with a 44mag. I have seen quite a few people keep a 357 level in rapid fire, but no one with a 44mag. Take the 357 and forget about it. You probably already shoot it better than you could a 44mag anyway. I bet when the chips are down, two 35 caliber holes are better than one 44 hole.
Good luck on the hunt!

The problem with your thinking is, you may only get one shot, if your lucky. It is not the holes that stop a charge, it is hitting the CNS that will stop the charge, and being able to get there. I want the biggest and best penetration round I can get. The 375 Mag just does not offer that.