Author Topic: 445 Conversion (of a 44 mag) (Read 939 times)

verzilli · « **on:** April 11, 2009, 06:34:05 AM »

Guys,

Read lots of posts, but two questions:

First, if there are inherent problems with the bore size of a 44 mag barrel, why would reaming it out to a 445 Supermag make it any more accurate? Wouldn't it just be a faster 44 mag with all the same problems?

Second, should I go for a 44 mag, ream it to 445, OR just get a 45/70 and load light (when wanted) to elephant killer (when I want to punish myself). This would bypass all the accuracy questions.

Thanks!

Dave

Lefty Dude · « **Reply #1 on:** April 11, 2009, 06:54:46 AM »

You will miss all the Fun, working with a "Wildcat" cartridge.

Lots of Personal satifaction when ya get that sucker to shoot.

And if not, just shoot 44's.

cwlongshot · « **Reply #2 on:** April 11, 2009, 11:15:52 AM »

Quote from: verzilli on April 11, 2009, 06:34:05 AM

Guys,

Read lots of posts, but two questions:

First, if there are inherent problems with the bore size of a 44 mag barrel, why would reaming it out to a 445 Super-mag make it any more accurate? Wouldn't it just be a faster 44 mag with all the same problems?

Second, should I go for a 44 mag, ream it to 445, OR just get a 45/70 and load light (when wanted) to elephant killer (when I want to punish myself). This would bypass all the accuracy questions.

Thanks!

Dave

I believe the consensus is that the bore diameter problems where fixed with the 2007 year production. Reaming a earlier .431 bore to 445 will do nothing for accuracy. (Wont hurt it either.

) Reaming a newer .429/430 bore to 445 would make for a nice improvement over the std 44 mag. I say do it!!

The 45-70 is a great caliber on its own. but if your fond of the 44 and have some bullets, going 45-70 will only delay the enevidable. Do the 445 now and get the 45-70 later.

This is very similar to what I did with my 45 Colt when reaming it to 454 Cassull. I have only fired one loading and all of those went into one single 1" hole at 50 yards.

CW

verzilli · « **Reply #3 on:** April 11, 2009, 11:31:52 AM »

Thanks for the info. I'm looking at a 44 Handi at Gander Mtn (it is an HX serial #, so I'm assuming 2007...) It would be a great match for my Ruger Bisley in 44 mag.

Lefty Dude · « **Reply #4 on:** April 11, 2009, 11:48:13 AM »

Quote from: verzilli on April 11, 2009, 11:31:52 AM

Thanks for the info. I'm looking at a 44 Handi at Gander Mtn (it is an HX serial #, so I'm assuming 2007...) It would be a great match for my Ruger Bisley in 44 mag.

Buy it with no hesitation, I have a Ruger SBH.It is a very nice Combo. Both can stand-up to very stout loads. I shoot full mag loads in my Handi/44 that also shoot well in my SBH, and my Rossi 92/44 Carbine.

With the Handi/44 you can shoot some heavy & long 44's, that will not chamber in the Revolver or a Lever Rifle.

I like the idea of a 445 chamber. I may look into the conversion for my Handi/44.

Rustyinfla · « **Reply #5 on:** April 11, 2009, 03:00:41 PM »

I like the .44 for the versility it offers. I've been using my Marlin Cowboy but I'm thinking the .44 Handi will be even better. Everything from round ball loads on up. I just need another handgun to go with it.

LaOtto222 · « **Reply #6 on:** April 12, 2009, 12:06:31 AM »

I bought my 44 Mag at Gander Mountain. It has a plastic stock and for end; also is an SB 2 frame. That was a special run for Gander Mountain. The other 44 Mags produced that year were the plain wood stocks. The local Gander Mountain said that they had plenty of them in, I think it was 50+. They must have sold out of them, because I have not seen one on a shelf for over a year. Of course I live in Indiana and the 44 Mag was made legal for deer a couple of seasons ago, so they more than likely sold out rather quickly. It may not have been the case in other states and they still have some. They should have a .429 - .430 bore. Mine shoots Winchester 240 grain soft points (white box) real well.

There are some members that reamed their over sized bores to 445 SM in an effort to get them to shoot a little better. I believe that for the most part, they did shoot better. The theory is that the higher velocity upset the bullet enough to get a good grip in the rifling and give it proper spin. Shoot yours and see how it does. If it has the newer bore size, I think you will find it shoots pretty well and the only reason to ream it to 445 is if you want more power, not trying to fix an accuracy problem. Good Luck and Good Shooting

rickt300 · « **Reply #7 on:** April 12, 2009, 05:08:48 AM »

How is the 445 different than the 44 Magnum. I know it is longer but by how much and does it use a shortened 444 case?

verzilli · « **Reply #8 on:** April 12, 2009, 06:53:40 AM »

Thanks for the input guys. I'm probably off to buy it tomorrow. They are on sale at 10% off of $249.

cwlongshot · « **Reply #9 on:** April 12, 2009, 12:05:47 PM »

Quote from: rickt300 on April 12, 2009, 05:08:48 AM

How is the 445 different than the 44 Magnum. I know it is longer but by how much and does it use a shortened 444 case?

Some time back, Jon Taffin wrote a excellent article on the super mags...

I found it!!

http://www.sixguns.com/range/supermags.htm

Enjoy,
HAPPY EASTER!!

CW

rickt300 · « **Reply #10 on:** April 13, 2009, 05:00:45 AM »

Pretty good read. I expect that you can get pretty close to the 445 handgun velocities out of a rifle barreled 44 magnum. I think if I really needed more power than the 44 mag is giving me I would just pul my Marlin 444 out of the gunsafe.

jeepmann1948 · « **Reply #11 on:** April 13, 2009, 05:05:14 AM »

If you want more power consider reaming to 444 Marlin. Brass is more readily available,as are dies (ie Cheaper) .the 444 can be loaded mild or wild or in between

PHATINJUN · « **Reply #12 on:** April 13, 2009, 05:36:50 AM »

Jeepman don't lead this boy astray by telling him to ream all the way to triple 4. He needs to know the facts and that is instead of reamin anything He needs to go out and get the new Ultra Varmint in .444 I think it has the 28" bbl comes in all SS frame .Then he can I believe be the first on the block with a range report. I know Tim has given the report on the Ultra 45/70 but I don't think he has the .444 yet? Kurt

quickdtoo · « **Reply #13 on:** April 13, 2009, 05:50:10 AM »

The SS Ultra 444 is 24", there have been a couple range reports already, the big plus for it or the 22" 444 Marlin made Handi is the 1:20" twist rate compared to the 44mag's 1:38".

Tim

rickt300 · « **Reply #14 on:** April 13, 2009, 07:10:17 AM »

At present I am happy with the 44 mags power level. It would seem with the Handi's long throat you could work up some loads a bit past standard published loads. In my rifle I can seat bullets out nearly 2 tenths of an inch before I get near the rifling.

bajabill · « **Reply #15 on:** April 13, 2009, 09:50:37 AM »

I just did this mod, and some results are in a thread I started on the subject.

I got my 44mag barrel in 11/2006 and immediately slugged it (.430) and shot it before I even entertained reaming it out (it passed my test). When I bought it I had every intention of reaming to 445sm and wrestled with the issue of "why?" since I have a 45-70. Which is why it sat unaltered for a couple of years. I think the same can be said of the 444 if you are a reloader, just not enough difference between them and the 45-70.

But, I liked the idea of doing the reaming operation and having something different yet still be able to shoot cheap off the shelf ammo. The beauty of this game is that you can have many things, regardless of how purely similar they are, for not much of an investment.

myarmor · « **Reply #16 on:** April 13, 2009, 10:04:03 AM »

I am out of the loop. When did they put out a Stainless 24" 444Marlin barrel?
I know of the SS Ultra 45-70 but a 444?

-Aaron

quickdtoo · « **Reply #17 on:** April 13, 2009, 10:26:39 AM »

You snooze, you loose!!

Last year, same time as the 45-70 Ultra.

Tim

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/cPath/36_262/products_id/55753

myarmor · « **Reply #18 on:** April 13, 2009, 02:46:41 PM »

Sorry not to highjack the thread but was this just a limited run or do they sale them in the accessory program?
And to be back on topic I too thought about a 445 SM but figured as many of you, why when you can shoot your 444 or 45-70.

-Aaron

quickdtoo · « **Reply #19 on:** April 13, 2009, 02:58:18 PM »

Neither the SS 444 or 45-70 is on the accessory barrel list yet, but neither is the ULSH which at least one member has had fitted as an accessory barrel, so it's best to just call and ask em as always is the case with new barrel offerings.

Tim

http://www.thegunsource.com/item/83917__HR_Rifles_Shotguns_H_R_SB2-T44_ULTRA_HUNTER_.aspx?SR=1

rockrat · « **Reply #20 on:** April 14, 2009, 04:38:44 AM »

One advantage of the 445sm is that you can use your 44mag carbide dies!!!

kawie · « **Reply #21 on:** April 14, 2009, 01:14:22 PM »

thanks Tim for the pm an giving me a heads up.what i was wondering is the article i read it sounded like you could make 445 brass out of 356 winchester brass an it would be a stronger case too.simular to the post that Tim posted awhile back on the 44 mag max on shooters forum.is this true or am i a noob that just miss read.thanks Kawie

quickdtoo · « **Reply #22 on:** April 14, 2009, 01:49:52 PM »

Using trimmed 444 brass for the slightly oversized 44mag>445 SM chambers has been discussed, but I dunno if anyone has tried it, 356 Win looks like it would work too.

Tim

http://stevespages.com/page8d.htm