Author Topic: H&R .458 SOCOM dreams (Read 2318 times)

Dinny · « **on:** April 08, 2009, 01:12:19 PM »

Hello,
I hope I'm not the only one that dreams about gun projects. My latest one involves reboring and rechambering a barrel or maybe stubbing a barrel for the .458 SOCOM. Does anyone know if an extractor could be developed to extract the .458 SOCOM factory brass? I do know that the brass could be formed from .348 Win brass that's rimmed, but would like to stick to factory ammo, if possible. Here are a few specs to ponder, .458 SOCOM brass base diameter is 0.547" and rim diameter is 0.473". I initially thought that my problems may have been minimized with adapting the .50 AE brass, but learned that it's too short.

Thanks in advance for your collective thoughts.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #1 on:** April 08, 2009, 01:23:20 PM »

Good luck with that rebated rim, that's quite a difference in case head diameter and rim diameter, I used to have a 300WSM which has a rebated rim, but it's only .020" smaller than the case head, you're gonna have trouble getting that much movement out of an extractor to allow it past the post, an ejector may work better tho. The SOCOM has no advantage over a 45-70 in a single shot, that seems like a lot of effort to me, but it would definitely be something different!!

Good luck,

Tim

Dinny · « **Reply #2 on:** April 08, 2009, 02:25:18 PM »

quickdtoo,
I agree about the ballistic difference between the two cartridges, but the 458 SOCOM is legal to hunt with in some states that don't allow rifles like Indiana. Forming brass from .348 Win brass is the only real alternative here. I only wonder how many people would be willing to put forth all the effort and $$ to see this day-dream through to reality.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #3 on:** April 08, 2009, 02:40:11 PM »

I think a 454 Casull from a 45 Colt barrel would be a good a round for the Indiana hunters, no custom work required, you can do the rechamber by hand yourself for about $35..... but where's the fun in that!!

Tim

I get a little over 1900fps with the Colt and 250gr SSTs, the Casull could improve upon that by quite a bit.

dpe.ahoy · « **Reply #4 on:** April 08, 2009, 03:44:02 PM »

Hey Tim, looks like ya might be a bit shy on powder space when ya seat that cast bullet.

Or is that for the 460 ream job? (Wink) DP

Dinny · « **Reply #5 on:** April 08, 2009, 04:59:54 PM »

quickdtoo,
You and I think alot alike. I have already considered reaming my LC to the Casull. I have too much LC brass to give it up yet. Just before becoming a member of Graybeard's I experimentally loaded some of those SST's into my .45LC handi rifle. I recently had a chance to shoot them and they grouped better than most everything else I have tried with the first batch. I have several more loaded for testing, but forgot my pen/pencil that day at the range and had no way to record shooting data. How do you keep from deforming the tips when you load them? How do you crimp them, Lee factory crimp die? Have you tried loading any other ML bullets like the Barnes Expanders? I have good had great luck with Cast Performance LBT bullets, but after shooting a nice deer last year and tracking him for over an hour, I think I need something that expands and delivers more on target energy. I'm red/green colorblind and find it terribly difficult to track bleeding deer. Hence one of the reasons I have considered the .458 SOCOM.

tykempster · « **Reply #6 on:** April 08, 2009, 05:22:16 PM »

45-70 would do as much...how come the 458 SOCOM is legal in some states and isn't a rifle?

Dinny · « **Reply #7 on:** April 08, 2009, 05:34:23 PM »

Indiana DNR states: Rifles must fire a cartridge with a bullet of .357-inch diameter or larger; have a minimum case length of 1.16 inches; and have a maximum case length of 1.625 inches. Some cartridges that are legal include the following:
.357 Magnum
.44-40 Winchester
.475 Linebaugh
.50 Action Express
.500 S&W
.38-40 Winchester
.41 Magnum
.41 Special
.44 Magnum
.44 Special
.45 Colt
.454 Casull
.458 SOCOM
.480 Ruger

Some illegal rifle cartridges for deer hunting are the .30-30 Winchester, .444 Marlin and .45-70 Govt.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #8 on:** April 08, 2009, 05:53:38 PM »

Quote from: dpe.ahoy on April 08, 2009, 03:44:02 PM

Hey Tim, looks like ya might be a bit shy on powder space when ya seat that cast bullet. Or is that for the 460 ream job? (Wink) DP

That cast bullet is either a Ranger Rick 700gr .500" or a 720gr .459", just for comparison.

Quote from: dinny on April 08, 2009, 04:59:54 PM

How do you keep from deforming the tips when you load them? How do you crimp them, Lee factory crimp die? Have you tried loading any other ML bullets like the Barnes Expanders?

I use Hornady New Dimension dies, their seater die is the cat's meow for seating with minimal runout(<.003") and works with pointy bullets very well. Haven't tried any other bullets in the 45 Colt, but I'm now working on the 200gr FTX and the 275gr XPB in the 460S&W, I always crimp with the Lee FCD.

Tim

Dinny · « **Reply #9 on:** April 08, 2009, 06:20:40 PM »

Thanks for the advice. Do you think the 200gr FTX would expand at LC velocities?

quickdtoo · « **Reply #10 on:** April 08, 2009, 08:13:37 PM »

Depends on the velocity, but it has a working velocity up to 2250fps in a 460S&W pistol.

http://www.hornady.com/media/ftx_load_data/460_sw_magnum_ftx.pdf

The 250gr FTX may be a better choice tho.

http://www.hornady.com/media/ftx_load_data/450_bushmaster_ftx.pdf

Tim

Hammerspur · « **Reply #11 on:** April 08, 2009, 11:13:24 PM »

Quote from: quickdtoo on April 08, 2009, 05:53:38 PM

That cast bullet is either a Ranger Rick 700gr .500" or a 720gr .459", just for comparison. ;DTim

Creative pic I must say.

Troyboy · « **Reply #12 on:** April 09, 2009, 01:37:18 PM »

I would think the 500 would do the job. Although rechambers are really cool.

Dinny · « **Reply #13 on:** April 10, 2009, 08:57:11 AM »

Quote from: quickdtoo on April 08, 2009, 08:13:37 PM

Depends on the velocity, but it has a working velocity up to 2250fps in a 460S&W pistol.

http://www.hornady.com/media/ftx_load_data/460_sw_magnum_ftx.pdf

The 250gr FTX may be a better choice tho.

http://www.hornady.com/media/ftx_load_data/450_bushmaster_ftx.pdf

Tim

Tim,
I just got a response back from Hornady tech. They said that the 250gr FTX will not reliably expand at .45LC rifle velocities.

Bigeasy · « **Reply #14 on:** April 10, 2009, 09:04:39 AM »

What about the .450 Bushmaster? 250 grn SST at about 2200 fps. No idea how it would be in a single shot, but works well in a AR-15 platform.

Larry

Dinny · « **Reply #15 on:** April 10, 2009, 09:10:27 AM »

In my opinion, the Bushmaster is good, but the SOCOM is better. .452" versus .458" doesn't sound like much but there is some difference. There are many choices in the .452" range; 450 Bushmaster, 454 Casull, and the .460 S&W to name a few popular ones. Just a dream I have, that's all

quickdtoo · « **Reply #16 on:** April 10, 2009, 09:37:10 AM »

Quote from: dinny on April 10, 2009, 08:57:11 AM

Tim,
I just got a response back from Hornady tech. They said that the 250gr FTX will not reliably expand at .45LC rifle velocities.

That may be true of 45Colt velocities, but top TC/Ruger +P 45 Colt velocities at 1900fps are right in the middle of the Bushmaster data of 1700-2200fps.

Tim

Dinny · « **Reply #17 on:** April 10, 2009, 10:38:04 AM »

Tim,
Do you think they were assuming it may be for a .45LC pistol or maybe even a anemic rifle load, then? Only one way to find out, test it in wet newspaper or gelatin. I deploy soon, when I return I plan to buy a ballistic gelatin kit. I think I will learn alot from using it.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #18 on:** April 10, 2009, 12:07:42 PM »

Yes, if you let them know the muzzle velocity is 1900fps, they'll probably give it a big thumbs up.

And a BIG thanks for your service!!

Tim

Dinny · « **Reply #19 on:** April 13, 2009, 05:53:50 AM »

Your gratitude is greatly appreciated.