Author Topic: Where is the factory ammo?  (Read 2386 times)

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Offline myarmor

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Where is the factory ammo?
« on: March 21, 2009, 05:16:06 PM »
Ever sence I started reloading I rarely buy factory fodder. Still I will buy a box or 2 every now and then especially if I don't have the dies yet to reload for said caliber yet. So I look around and also read on 6mmBr that factory ammo is getting hard to find in even the most popular calibers.
Do you guys believe it's scare buying as many do? WTH...




-Aaron

Offline Sourdough

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2009, 05:48:05 PM »
I hear that the factories are ramping up production due to the shortage.  Don't see it coming into the stores. 

Yes I do think some people are hoarding it, makes sense, stock up.  Yes the military is using a lot, but I don't think they are using that much.

I do think a lot of it is going south of the border.  The drug cartels have the money, and the network to take it out of the country.  A revolution is brewing down there, and I think the people that can afford it down there are also stocking up.  That can account for an awful lot of ammo.
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Offline OldBob

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #2 on: March 22, 2009, 12:45:43 AM »
  I was at our range yesterday, cleaning up and picking up the brass for resale, the border Patrol had been in and left a nice bunch of 40 S & W and........... a bunch of steel case Wolf .223 !!!  Whats up with that ? I don't know if it was just an expediency measure or if that is what is being issued , but it scares me to think that we can't maintain a decent supply of ammo because of the war in Iraq, where would we be at if we were involved in something on the scale of WW II ???????? I'm sure the Chosen One will fix all of this, right after he gets done destroying the economy. ::) ::)
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Offline cwlongshot

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #3 on: March 22, 2009, 01:59:09 AM »
It's the same story here in Connecticut Aaron!! 

 Ammo shelves are getting baron as are the used gun racks!!  Not to mention the reloading supplies.... People are scared, I hope and wish those same people thought about this BEFORE and voted!!!

CW
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Offline PHATINJUN

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2009, 05:37:16 AM »
I have been to 4 places this weekend that sell ammo and every one of them had limits on how many boxes you could buy every where from 2-5 boxes max.The shelves looked very bare heard people talking of legislation that may be coming down the road so manufacturers are not producing much for fear of having ammo stock in thier warehouses. But then I don't put much stock in some of the gunshop rumor mills. Still am glad I am reloading though. Kurt
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Offline Tunaman

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2009, 05:56:44 AM »
I was in cabellas yesterday and I noticed an interesting trend. The usual suspects, 223, 208, 30/06 270 ect. were all sold out, but the oddballs that used to be so hard to find were heavily stocked. They had all of the 257 bob, weatherby, 35 whelen ect that you could ever want. since i own a bunch of oddballs, I got a kick out of that. If I didn't load, I would  have left there with a bunch of ammo.

What little 223 and 308 they did have was way more expensive than it used to be. The one exception was some bulk 55gr Hornady that seemed reasonably priced. I did pick up 200 rounds of it as a back up. It was somewhere around 40 per 100. I also looked at some 338 Laupaua ammo. Boy am i glad that I don't own one of those. I think that the stuff that they had was just under 6.00 a round. No cheaper than the 50 BMG rounds that were on the shelf.


Offline SM Bob

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #6 on: March 22, 2009, 08:26:50 AM »
It's the same story out here on the left coast. I went to a Turner's near my house
the other day to get some new fishing line. I never buy any guns or ammo from
them because I don't like the attitude of the people in the gun department there.
I decided to take a look anyway to see how things were selling. WOW! :o
All the ammo was just about gone! In the gun department they have one of those
glass display cases that is appx. 50 ft long that is usually full of handguns. They
had maybe 10% of what they usually have! Same thing with rifles and shotguns that
they have in racks against the wall behind the counter! :o It reminded me of the
images of the old Soviet Union's food stores. Bare shelves with 1 box of cereal here
and 1 bottle of spoiled milk there! Geez! :o

                                                    Robert

Offline Troyboy

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #7 on: March 22, 2009, 08:51:10 AM »
I do not believe the ammo makers are making more ammo. It quite obvious they are playing the oil game. Low supply lots of demand. This = price increase= more profit. Capitalism at it's finest
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Offline gendoc

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #8 on: March 22, 2009, 09:14:37 AM »
hell,  even powder is scarce here. any powder thats used mainly in handguns are out of the question
which is some of my favorite rifle powder.
my supplier told me that people he has never seen before come in and buy it all!!!!
and he says his supplier can't get but limited quantities.
which don't go around evenly!!!!
demand is very high, supply is very low.....only means one thing :o
sea-ya.....
in tha meen time, i'm wait'n for tha  7th trumpet ta sound !!!

gotta big green tractor ana diesel truck, my idea of heaven's chasin whitetail bucks and asa country boy, you know i can survive............

hey boy, hit this mason jar one time...
burn ya lil'bit did'nt it. ya ever been snipe hunt'n ?  come on...

I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery.

Offline Sourdough

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #9 on: March 22, 2009, 10:12:14 AM »
When I was down South, Florida, Tennessee, Texas, and North Carolina, I heard the same thing.  That when a store had a shipment come in someone would come in and buy all of the .223, or all of the .308.  Or someone would come in and buy all the small rifle primers, and all the common powders, such as 743, 760, RL-22, Varget.

Even here in Fairbanks, I went into Frontier Outfitters, they had just gotten in a shipment of 2,000 small rifle primers.  I bought both bricks. 
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Offline dpe.ahoy

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #10 on: March 22, 2009, 10:37:41 AM »
It's all over, same thing here in Montana :'(.  I buy what I can find, when I can, Have one place that lets me know when they are going to get in a shipment.  I'm setting pretty good except for the powders that I just have one pound of to try different loads, that and 2000 of the Remington 9 1/2 primers that may or may not go bang. :(  DP
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Offline gendoc

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #11 on: March 22, 2009, 11:32:24 AM »
I FORGOT TO MENTION....

no 30cal bullets---NO-WHERE!!!!!
glad it don't cost a arm and a leg to ship them....

midway has been run'n low too...
sea-ya.....
in tha meen time, i'm wait'n for tha  7th trumpet ta sound !!!

gotta big green tractor ana diesel truck, my idea of heaven's chasin whitetail bucks and asa country boy, you know i can survive............

hey boy, hit this mason jar one time...
burn ya lil'bit did'nt it. ya ever been snipe hunt'n ?  come on...

I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery.

Offline wtroger

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #12 on: March 22, 2009, 04:34:53 PM »
Heck there isn't even in 22 lr ammo out there right now and when you find it the discount store stuff is pushing $20.00 a brick.

Offline myarmor

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #13 on: March 22, 2009, 05:11:35 PM »
...now thats just sad! >:(
If something has to give then at least reloading supplies... seems I can't hardly find anything as of late as well :-\




Offline handipardner

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #14 on: March 22, 2009, 05:21:30 PM »
Gun owners have lost touch with reality. The Democrats recognize the voting power of shooters and hunters.

Pelosi on banning assault weapons

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2009/02/26/1812279.aspx

and from the gun nut blog below:

March 18, 2009

Petzal: Why Life is Now More Complicated
As a kid in the 1950s, I was taught that the Democratic Party was the repository of all human evil, and in the ensuing half-century I haven’t seen a lot to make me change that point of view. However, this past week, a pair of Democratic senators have done shooters a great service. To wit:

About two weeks ago, the Department of Defense decreed that surplus military ammo would no longer be sold to the public. Instead, said the DoD, it would be “mutilated,” presumably chopped up and sold for scrap. It’s difficult to see what purpose this would serve from the government’s point of view, but for shooters who handload military calibers and for people who re-manufacture ammo, it would be a catastrophe.

Then, on March 17, Senators Jon Tester and Max Baucus of Montana, Democrats both, sent a FAX to the DoD stating that this would not be such a good idea, and since Senator Baucus is Chairman of the Senate Finance Committee, the DoD locked its heels together and listened. On the evening of the same day, Baucus and Tester received a reply that the decision had been reversed and mutilation was no longer an option.

So, swallowing my bile, I give thanks to these two Senators, and wonder: Where were the Republicans, who are supposedly our staunchest allies, while this was going on?

Mssrs. Baucus and Tester are not enough to make me forget about Senators Schumer, Kennedy, Feinstein, former Senators Biden and Clinton, and a long and dismal list that stretches back to the 60s, but it does complicate matters.

Offline d_hiker

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #15 on: March 23, 2009, 11:40:48 AM »
I have been to 5 Wal-Marts in the area and none of them have seen common handgun ammo in a long time.  9mm, 38spl 357 45acp are all out of stock.  They may get one or two boxes, INDIVIDUAL boxes once or twice a month.  The store close to me had one box of .380, two boxes of .25auto and one box of .40 S&W.  That was the sum total of their handgun ammo, other than some .22lr.
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Offline Cookiemann

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #16 on: March 23, 2009, 12:14:17 PM »
I heard a comment from a FIRST TIME gun owner yesterday.  He had been doin' some reading, somewhere, and said there had been talk of metric calibers being outlawed in the USA.  Anyone hear anything about that.

I too, have seen panic buying and empty shelves in the stores, much the same as most of you.  If you asked me, I think folks are preparing for REVOLUTION right here at home.  Just my 2cents.

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Offline woodchukhntr

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #17 on: March 23, 2009, 12:48:25 PM »
Go to Gander Mountain since their prices are so high, nobody is buying it yet.  A guy was looking for .222 and the 50 gr. pointed was $22.95, while the HP was $39.95.

Offline LaOtto222

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #18 on: March 23, 2009, 01:33:00 PM »
"I heard a comment from a FIRST TIME gun owner yesterday.  He had been doin' some reading, somewhere, and said there had been talk of metric calibers being outlawed in the USA.  Anyone hear anything about that." - Cookiemann

You can't be serious. The 6mm (243 Win among them) and 7 mm (7 -08 and 7 mm Mag + a whole lot more) calibers are very popular in the USA. Did he mean foreign metric ammo?
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #19 on: March 23, 2009, 01:45:44 PM »
Did he mean foreign metric ammo?

Wouldn't surprise me if milsurp was the target, probably some angle to boost the economy!  ::) 

Tim
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Offline gendoc

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #20 on: March 23, 2009, 02:22:11 PM »
PELOSI---stinks

NOW THATS COOL!!!!!
 you write your real feelings and it automatically changes your outlook!!!!!!
sea-ya.....
in tha meen time, i'm wait'n for tha  7th trumpet ta sound !!!

gotta big green tractor ana diesel truck, my idea of heaven's chasin whitetail bucks and asa country boy, you know i can survive............

hey boy, hit this mason jar one time...
burn ya lil'bit did'nt it. ya ever been snipe hunt'n ?  come on...

I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery.

Offline Explorer1

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2009, 06:24:53 PM »
"Do you guys believe it's scare buying as many do? WTH..."

Well, anyone with a computer and 10 mintues to spare can search sales figures, NICS background check numbers, etc. and QUICKLY determine both sales and supply are UP!  Simply the facts maam, simply the facts. 

Here is a starting point..........  http://www.nssf.org/share/PDF/NICS_top10.pdf

I have personally talked with folks in their 80s buying guns for the FIRST time in their lives as they have seen this crap before, and are now worried.

You think ammo is bad?  ARs are 6 months or more, even Lee is admitting custom moulds are about a year wait!

Sales are out the roof in many places, some companies have geared up to take advantage of the market others have not.  Only time will tell if the HIGH prices being paid today are a good investment or sillyness.

Offline handipardner

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2009, 08:47:05 PM »
explorer1 sayes:

"Well, anyone with a computer and 10 mintues to spare can search sales figures, NICS background check numbers, etc. and QUICKLY determine both sales and supply are UP!  Simply the facts maam, simply the facts. "

I checked on the following and their purchases are reasonble.

1) Dick Cheney has been loading up on .410 shells, 500 cases. . Must be preparing for quail.
2)Tyke ordered 200 cases of 45-2000. Didn't know such a cartridge existed!!! Tyke confirmed its a custom one and needs all that brass to work up a load.
3) CW 2000 cases of starline .357 max. He needs the brass to get thru a day of target shooting.

No hoarding here!!! Please check your facts.

Offline bajabill

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #23 on: March 24, 2009, 07:29:17 AM »
When I was down South, Florida, Tennessee, Texas, and North Carolina, I heard the same thing.  That when a store had a shipment come in someone would come in and buy all of the .223, or all of the .308.  Or someone would come in and buy all the small rifle primers, and all the common powders, such as 743, 760, RL-22, Varget.

Even here in Fairbanks, I went into Frontier Outfitters, they had just gotten in a shipment of 2,000 small rifle primers.  I bought both bricks. 


Without other info, I think this is hoarding - and the problem, not the solution.

Offline Chas.

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #24 on: March 24, 2009, 08:12:07 AM »
Without other info, I think this is hoarding - and the problem, not the solution.

Let me get this straight.  Firearm sales have absolutely gone ballistic, but you think folks are hoarding ammo?  What do you think all those new owners are going to use in their new firearms, BB's?  Mega guns sales = mega ammo sales.

Those new owners, I'm sure, are either out there shooting their arse off, or they put the guns in the bedside table drawer, right next to their black magnum Trojans.  The new shooters will soon find another diversion, with summer coming on, and the market will return to normal.

BTW, BB's are still readily available. ;D

Offline bajabill

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #25 on: March 24, 2009, 09:36:31 AM »
Yes, I believe people are buying more than they will shoot between now and when "normal" distribution/consumption returns.  The shelves are bare for this and other reasons which we do not entirely understand.  So, buying anything you see just because you fear you may not see it tomorrow is the problem.  The, if I don't, someone else will, just does not cut it.  This mentality is why in times of real need (WW2) there had to be purchase limits placed on many goods.

I dont think many of the first gun purchase people are shooting that much ammo.  I also dont think people who shoot frequently are shooting that much more frequently.  As a result, I am hoping that sometime (soon hopefully) this will all settle down and a lot of people are going to have a lot of supplies collecting dust.  My guess is that the manufacturers think this also, and therefore are not ramping up production to meet the current "stock my cupboards" level of demand.

If and when I find small rifle primers, I will buy 100.  This will last me over a year.  Until I find these, I can shoot other rifles.  If the supply issues are still around after I exhaust all I have now, I need a new hobby because I don't want the headaches.

Offline pricecw

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #26 on: March 24, 2009, 10:11:54 AM »
If and when I find small rifle primers, I will buy 100.  This will last me over a year.  Until I find these, I can shoot other rifles.  If the supply issues are still around after I exhaust all I have now, I need a new hobby because I don't want the headaches.

OK, you call the guy who bought 2K small rifle primers a hoarder, and then put your definition down.  It appears you shoot a very limited amount, and anyone who says they shoot more, must be a hoarder.  If I could get my hands on 2-4K of small rifle primers, I would do it in a heartbeat.  2K would not last me into the summer, 100, your year + supply, would not last one outing.  As a matter of fact, I took my .223 out after ground squirrels this last weekend, and went through about 150rds (including some factory because I can't get primers).  Of those, about 5 of the factory rnds were shot to get an idea of where they hit wrt the scope (sighted for the handloads).  This was a light shooting day for me, went home earlier than normal.  Also, these were all shot with my TC Encore pro-hunter.  I know guys with ARs that can easily shoot 1K in a day out (although they are generally shooting at targets and having fun, instead of varmints).

To wrap up my point, just because you don't shoot a lot, doesn't mean everyone else is hoarding.  Some of us just like to shoot a lot of ammo.

--Carl

Offline Chas.

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #27 on: March 24, 2009, 10:50:48 AM »

...As a matter of fact, I took my .223 out after ground squirrels this last weekend, and went through about 150rds...

150 rds - Wow!  I know a lot of folks that would have 150 dead ground squirrels.  How many'd you get?

Offline bajabill

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #28 on: March 24, 2009, 10:58:55 AM »
and just because you are not, does not mean nobody is.  My first statement on this thread ( and I knew I would regret getting started ) was -  without other info ...

But, too many stories from too many different places and sources exist for me to believe that it is not happening.


Offline mechanic

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Re: Where is the factory ammo?
« Reply #29 on: March 24, 2009, 11:22:37 AM »
IF  the following is true, it might account for the shortage.  Perhaps manufacturers don't want to be stuck with ammo they can't sell.............


Tennessee

HOUSE BILL 3245

By   LARRY J. MILLER   

D - Memphis



SENATE BILL 3395

By REGINALD TATE
D - Memphis



 

AN ACT to amend Tennessee Code Annotated, Title 39, Chapter 17, Part 13,

to enact the “Ammunition Accountability Act”.

 

BE IT ENACTED BY THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY OF THE STATE OF TENNESSEE:

 

SECTION 1. This act shall be known and may be cited as the “Ammunition Accountability Act”.

 

SECTION 2.  The general assembly finds the following:

(1) Each year in the United States, more than thirty percent (30%) of all homicides that involve a gun go unsolved;

(2) Handgun ammunition accounts for eighty percent (80%) of all ammunition sold in the United States;

(3) Current technology for matching a bullet used in a crime to the gun that fired it has worked moderately well for years, but presupposes that the weapon was recovered by law enforcement; and

 (4) Bullet coding is a new and effective way for law enforcement to quickly identify persons of interest in gun crime investigations.

SECTION 3.   For purposes of this act, "coded ammunition" means a bullet carrying a unique identifier that has been applied by etching onto the base of the bullet projectile.

SECTION 4. 

(a) All handgun and assault weapon ammunition manufactured or sold in the state after January 1, 2009, shall be coded by the manufacturer.

(b) No later than January 1, 2011, all non­coded ammunition for the calibers listed in this act, whether owned by private citizens or retail outlets, shall be disposed.

SB339501197072­1­

SECTION 5.

(a) The Tennessee bureau of investigation (TBI) shall be responsible for establishing and maintaining an ammunition coding system database (ACSD) containing the following information:

(1) A manufacturer registry. Manufacturers shall:

(A) Register with the TBI in a manner prescribed by the department through rules and regulations; and

(B) Maintain records on the business premises for a period of seven (7) years concerning all sales, loans and transfers of ammunition, to, from, or within the state; and

(2) A vendor registry. Vendors shall:

(A) Register with the TBI in a manner prescribed by the department through rules and regulations;

(B) Record the following information in a format prescribed by the TBI:

(i) The date of the transaction;

(ii) The name of the transferee;

(iii) The purchaser's driver license number or other government issued identification card number;

(iv) The date of birth of the purchaser;

(v) The unique identifier of all handgun ammunition or bullets transferred; and

(vi) All other information prescribed by the TBI; and

(C) Maintain records on the business premises for a period of three (3) years from the date of the recorded purchase.

(b) To the greatest extent possible or practical, the ACSD shall be built within the framework of existing firearms databases. The ACSD shall be operational no later than January 1, 2009.

(c) Privacy of individuals shall be of the utmost importance. Access to information in the ACSD is reserved for key law enforcement personnel and shall only be released in connection with a criminal investigation.

SECTION 6.

(a) Any vendor that knowingly fails to comply with, or falsifies the records required to be kept by this act commits a Class A misdemeanor.

(b) Any manufacturer that knowingly fails to comply with this act commits a Class A misdemeanor punishable by fine only not to exceed one thousand dollars ($1,000) for a first violation and punishable by fine only not to exceed five thousand dollars ($5,000) for second and subsequent violations.

(c) Any person who knowingly destroys, obliterates, or otherwise renders unreadable, the serialization required pursuant to this act, on any bullet or assembled ammunition commits a Class A misdemeanor.

SECTION 7.

(a) The cost of establishing and maintaining the ACSD shall be funded by an end­user fee. Vendors shall charge an additional one half cent ($.005) per bullet or round of ammunition to the purchaser.

(b) There is established the coded ammunition fund for deposit of the end­user fees described in this section. Moneys in the fund, upon appropriation, shall be available to the TBI for infrastructure, implementation, operational, enforcement, and future development costs of this act. 

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SECTION 8.

This act shall take effect upon becoming a law, the public welfare requiring it.                                   

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Molon Labe, (King Leonidas of the Spartan Army)