What do you think...

[cwlongshot]

I was thinking on some of the accuracy quirks of handis today. A recent post of fire upon opening also was on my mind....

Has anyone though about the latch spring? I mean its the same for all calibers, yet this opening generally only happens with the higher intensity rounds. So what if someone where to make and install a heavier spring so that recoil didn't have any effect of the latch. I'm thinking that the frame stretch, combined with the sharper recoil could be bouncing that latch. Even if the gun doesn't open, it could very well be moving under recoil causing all kinds of accuracy problems...

Take the 500's for example. They have very sharp and heavy recoil with the HV loadings. What if that latch was moving under recoil. That could account for some of the thrown shots and "flyer's" we so often see....

What do you guys think?

CW

[Smokin Joe]

We've been doing it for about a year now.......Tim has the spring specs.
I might have one laying around....let me look.

[Smokin Joe]

Nope, I'm out, but here's the specs:

http://www.mcmaster.com/

Part # 9657K231 .250" in diameter and rolled from .041" wire, 2" long.

Comments from Tim:

Got my springs today, the indicia on the package indicates they mailed it on Nov 1st, but 10 days from southern California by parcel post is not real, 5 days yes, I think they never took it to the PO to be mailed until much later. They also over paid postage on the 13oz package by at least $3.50 with $7.35 postage on the package, they apparently don't ship by mail often and use UPS, but I prefer mail to my po box, but I did offer them an alternative UPS street address, but they didn't use it. They could have mailed the 6 springs in a small padded envelope for less than a dollar and just threw it into their outgoing mail! They only charged $4 shipping so they really messed up.

The great news is the springs work great, I think 3 springs ~.600"-.575" long out of each piece will do the trick, any longer and the spring won't compress enough to release the barrel. As it is, it takes considerable strength to release it! That length works if the spring pocket bottom is squared up to a depth of .300", without doing that, the spring needs to be much shorter.

I did a trigger job on the frame while I was at it since I had never done one on it,  was 4½lbs which was just acceptable to me for a hunting rifle, now it's at 2lbs-6oz!!

[coop2564]

No dought it could be playing a roll in it. Seems to me its about vibration not kick at least to a point. My ML will kick much harder than my 308 or 243 but the ML is dead on accurate no matter how tight or loose (at least as long as its snug) the forearm is or with or without ramrod. Yet every high vol rifle I have tried hasnt shot worth a darn with out a lot of TLC. I have two friends that have one, one a 25-06 the other a 243 standard barrel both are 2 to 3" and eraditic. I just scratch my head at how accurate some say there guns are when we have been so unlucky with ours. I have sent my 243 SL back twice they put a new barrel on send it back with a pictures of target with a beautiful group; I cant get it to shoot anywhere close to the group they did or say they(factory guys) did. I could of easily brought a $600 bolt gun for what I have spent on trying to make my 243 shoot well yet my 308 has always had some potenial just would shift POI with out cause. But now with it bedded its been solid as a rock I'm not about to take it apart. So its been a love hate relationship with me with more hate than love until recently. And I hate to say it but I cant get that stainless 45-70 out of my mind! There I said it! The 1st step to getting over a addiction is admitting it right? I'm on the road to recovery right? Dang she sure is pretty!

[Smokin Joe]

Something like this maybe?

[cwlongshot]

We've been doing it for about a year now.......Tim has the spring specs.
I might have one laying around....let me look.

 Some how I missed those posts....

 Thank you so much for the update!!  I'll order some today and begin experiments!!

Hopefully Tim will read and post up his experiences since. Maybe I'm barking up the wrong tree...

coop2564,
 Its just that kind of thing that I'm thinking about. I have a couple that where performers right out of the gate. I have a couple that have needed caressing to make shoot well. I have one or two that are more stuburn. The 500S&W is top on that list. I do not expect the same accuracy from it I do from my .223 or Hornet. But even if it shot 8" groups I need them to me synmectrical. Not 8" because it shot 4 in one hole and one 8" out.
 I'm seeing these problems with the more intensive calibers. I'm not so much talking about amount of recoil. Rather the "speed" on that recoil. Your muzzle loader is a very slow recoil as all Bps seem to be. Pistol calibers can be more intense in a handgun, but not in 7-8Lb rifles. That's how I came to this conclusion.
Is that more understandable?

 Oh I know what you mean about the new S.S. lam handis.. MAN are they SEXY!!! I'm only holding off cause I don't shoot the 4 45-70's (Two handis) I have now, why buy anotherone!! 

CW

[LONGTOM]

 Oh I know what you mean about the new S.S. lam handis.. MAN are they SEXY!!! I'm only holding off cause I don't shoot the 4 45-70's (Two handis) I have now, why buy anotherone!!   

CW

TRADING MATERIAL my friend, TRADING MATERIAL!!!


LONGTOM

[quickdtoo]

Stronger springs don't hurt, a small deflection at the latch can cause vertical stringing as Fred has pointed out many times, a seriously don't think there is any frame stretch involved with higher pressure chamberings, but I do believe the latch pin is too light and/or not being fully supported is the culprit to blame for case growth, the heavy spring likely help that, but if H&R either increased the pin size and/or hogged out less metal from the frame so it provides support closer to the latch, it would help a lot. The discussion on the springs is in the FAQs.

Tim