Author Topic: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...  (Read 4316 times)

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Offline AtlLaw

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45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« on: October 15, 2008, 05:57:56 PM »
I like big bores.  Some men dream of large mamalries, I lust for rifle calibers from the 35's on up, not that I have anything against 36D's mind you!   :-[  The 45/70 has long been a pet since I used an old trapdoor to shoot rats in a dump when I was a kid, even as scarce as bullets were then.  But I've got a short, light 45/70 in my old Handi, and while I wish I had bought that '86 Lightweight when I had a chance, I want something different.   :-\

Soooo, while I have long kicked around the idea of another 40 something rifle, I could never settle on anything so I never took the first step.  And the fact that I doubt that I will ever hunt DG in the future took away the sense of urgency from my quest.

If I had my druthers I'd opt for a classic English double in 470 Nitro, like an H&H!  :P  But I'm to old to go through a divorce...  :(   I removed the Kodiak double from my list, but a Ruger #1 in 450/400 is still a possibility.  I've looked at Gibbs, SMLE conversions, Siamese Mauser conversions and Sharps reproductions, but decided against those for one reason or another.

I almost just went and bought a 458 Win Mag figuring I could load it down for hunting.  But they are all HEAVY!   :o  Even if I just sit in a deer stand with one.   ::)

But, hanging around here and reading stuff from Tim and now Tyke, I've gained a new appreciation for the all-American 45's!  However, the "I'm going to take you out and whip your butt" discussion comparing the 45/70 and 375 H&H for use in Africa convinced me that the 45/70 is suited only as an enraged chipmonk stopper and I would suffer the disdain of every PH in Africa if I ever did show up with one!   :(

Then I ask Tim an innocent question concerning the similarity between the 45/120 and the optimal DG cartridge, the 450 Nitro Express.  He refers me to a web site and BAM!!   :o  I'm dreaming again.  :-[

Not long thereafter Long Tom comes along and forces me to buy his BC barrel!   >:(  But that's not a bad thing, considering that I'm now a practiced and - dare I say - accomplished Handi barrel fitter.  But now I'm kicking myself for not buying one of those receivers that have been in the classifieds, but maybe I'll just fit the barrel to my current 45/70 frame.  But I've also got to get new wood and don't like any of the stuff available so I'll probably have to carve my own and I want to keep my little 45/70 light and handy.  Then there is the matter of sights and I think those long brass tubes look really good but the gun needs irons just to look right.  'course that BC barrel is REALLY long and I've been thinking 30 inches would look pretty good, or 32... or 34.

'bout that time I realized the barrel is STILL a 45/70!  So, I've decided the first thing to do is a rechambering to one of the 45/? Nitro Express cartridges.  But now I can't decide which one!  The 45/90 is only .1 inch shorter then the 458 WM and the brass is almost as cheap as 45/70.  The 45/100 is .1 inch longer then the 458 WM and the 45/110 is almost the same length as the 458 Lott!  And NOBODY calls that round underpowered!  To me, the 45/120 is just to much of a good thing, looks wise anyway.

Sooo, rather then a 45/90, I'd just stay with the 45/70, that leaves the 45/100 or the 45/110.  Brass on either one is kinda spendy with the lower price edge going to the smaller case.  The 100 also seems a little bit more available.  I guess my decision is driven by 2 things: the loaded round must be noticeably longer then the 45/70, and I must be able to turn a minimum of 2100 fps with a 500 gr jacketed bullet while keeping the pressures reasonable.

Y'all give me some help!  What would you do if you were me!?  ???














Richard
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Offline quickdtoo

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Offline LaOtto222

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2008, 12:07:34 AM »
There you go. ;) Not everyone has a 45-120 and it will get what you want as far as velocity and the; I have one and you don't factor.
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Offline Swampman

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #3 on: October 16, 2008, 01:34:42 AM »
Is it really worth it if you plan on using smokeless powder?  I can see velocity gains with blackpowder, but not with smokeless.
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Offline STUMPJMPR

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #4 on: October 16, 2008, 02:38:30 AM »
45-120 if your doing it... You can probably get faster velocities with lower pressure due to the increased case size...

Offline LONGTOM

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #5 on: October 16, 2008, 02:40:01 AM »
I told you what I was thinking anout doing with it.
If you are going to do it then go all the way buddy and make it a 50-140 express!.

I am still thinking about doing it to one of my other BCs.
Now there's a BIG LONG CARTRIDGE!


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Offline Badnews Bob

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #6 on: October 16, 2008, 02:49:07 AM »
.45-90s shoot really well I liked shootin Haywoods, I think the 120 is just to much unless you count the wow factor of just lookin at one of those things. I think for looks and power I'd go with the 110. ::)

 Very hard decision to make because if you just want power the .45-70 can be loaded to almost .458 levels. I don't think I would shoot one there but you could, and then the 120 is just so impressive sitting there on the bench.

 Iffn your gonna shoot black I'd definitely go 120 if just smokeless go 90. IMHO of course.
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Offline bill439

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2008, 06:13:12 AM »
Let me see if I'm understanding this??  You're going to load 500gr. bullets to 2100fps and shoot this load out of a handi rifle?  Save your money and just get someone to hit your sholder with a 12lb. hammer, should be very close to the same effect.  This is not going to be a fun event!!!  Have you ever considered why H & R never chambered a handi in .458 ?  anyway I wish you luck with your project.  Bill439

Offline quickdtoo

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2008, 06:40:50 AM »
A good recoil pad and a mercury recoil reducer or lead in the stock bolt hole will do wonders for recoil, the 32" BC barrel weighs more than any 22" Handi barrel to begin with and is a good platform for the 45-90/100/110/120 rechamber, it can be rechambered by hand with a $35 rental reamer, and pressure wise, the 45-120 in the 32" barrel can push the 500gr bullet faster than the 458WM with a lot less pressure. With a nice stock configuration like Stuffit's, recoil would be managed even better.

I say go for it!! ;D

Tim





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Offline LONGTOM

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2008, 08:22:51 AM »
Not trying to highjack the thread but ,
TIM what do you think of my idea I mentioned a couple of replys up about doing one in a 50-140 express?


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"THE TREE OF LIBERTY FROM TIME TO TIME MUST BE REFRESHED WITH THE BLOOD OF PATRIOTS AND TYRANTS".
THOMAS JEFFERSON

That my two young sons may never have to know the horrors of war. 

I will stand for your rights as my forefathers did before me!
My thanks to those who have, are and will stand for mine!
To those in the military, I salute you!

LONGTOM 9-25-07

Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #10 on: October 16, 2008, 08:32:45 AM »
LONGTOM, not to double hijack this, but I built one in .50-90 Sharps and it's a hoot!
 The 140 brass can be hard to find sometimes.....the .50-90 is available from Track of the Wolf. Bullets are easy to get from Western Bullet.

 Hell, if you want it, go for it!
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Offline BillDan

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #11 on: October 16, 2008, 09:09:29 AM »
Watch out for the Buffalo Arms 45-110 brass. It's drawn from Starline 45-100 brass. I don't know how well it would hold up to smokeless loads.

I say ifin your gonna do it, go all the way. 45-120! But I believe you can reach your velocity requirements with the 45-100 using smokeless and have alot less problems.

Offline quickdtoo

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #12 on: October 16, 2008, 09:12:39 AM »
Not trying to highjack the thread but ,
TIM what do you think of my idea I mentioned a couple of replys up about doing one in a 50-140 express?


LONGTOM

What Joe said, the bigger, the better, just be prepared for some real expensive brass!!

Tim

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Offline petemi

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #13 on: October 16, 2008, 10:14:55 AM »
Well ya heard everybody, just pick out the positive posts and do em all :o :o ???
Keep both eyes open and make the first shot good.
The growing Handi/Sportster/Pardner/Topper Family:  .22 WMR, .22-250. 223, Two Superlight 7mm-08s and one .243, .30-30,  .308, 32-20, 18 inch .356/.358 Win., Two 16.5 inch .357 Max., 18 inch 38-55 BC Carbine, 16.5 inch .445 Super Mag., .45LC, 16.5 and 22 inch .45-70s, .50 Huntsman SS, .410, 20 ga., 12 ga., 20 ga. Pardner Pump, Versa-Pack .410 - .22
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Offline Troyboy

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #14 on: October 16, 2008, 11:20:58 AM »
Those 45-120 are unbelievable in person. Pictures just do not convey the size of the round. They are impressive. Make a 45-120


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Offline Spanky

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #15 on: October 16, 2008, 11:29:45 AM »
not that I have anything against 36D's mind you!   :-[ 




+1 on that!! ;D



Spanky

Offline LONGTOM

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #16 on: October 16, 2008, 02:46:32 PM »
"not that I have anything against 36D's mind you!"

I am kind of parcial to the old police stand by of years gone by.
Make mine a pair of 38s!     
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"THE TREE OF LIBERTY FROM TIME TO TIME MUST BE REFRESHED WITH THE BLOOD OF PATRIOTS AND TYRANTS".
THOMAS JEFFERSON

That my two young sons may never have to know the horrors of war. 

I will stand for your rights as my forefathers did before me!
My thanks to those who have, are and will stand for mine!
To those in the military, I salute you!

LONGTOM 9-25-07

Offline dpe.ahoy

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #17 on: October 16, 2008, 03:08:18 PM »
Don't think I'd ever do a 50-140.  Might start to feel inferior when I went to go P.  ;D  DP
RIP Oct 27, 2017

Handi's:22Shot, 22LR, 2-22Mag, 22Hornet, 5-223, 2-357Max, 44 mag, 2-45LC, 7-30 Waters, 7mm-08, 280, 25-06, 30-30, 30-30AI, 444Marlin, 45-70, AND 2-38-55s, 158 Topper 22 Hornet/20ga. combo;  Levers-Marlins:Two 357's, 44 mag, 4-30-30s, RC-Glenfields 36G-30A & XLR, 3-35 Rem, M-375, 2-444P's, 444SS, 308 MX, 338Marlin MXLR, 38-55 CB, 45-70 GS, XS7 22-250 and 7mm08;  BLR's:7mm08, 358Win;  Rossi: 3-357mag, 44mag, 2-454 Casull; Winchesters: 7-30 Waters, 45Colt Trapper; Bolt actions, too many;  22's, way too many.  Who says it's an addiction?

Offline LONGTOM

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #18 on: October 16, 2008, 03:13:37 PM »
I hate young bucks!!

Heck shooting guns is better than sex!  :o
Leave me alone woman I've got a couple of more to sight in!  >:(


LONGTOM
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"THE TREE OF LIBERTY FROM TIME TO TIME MUST BE REFRESHED WITH THE BLOOD OF PATRIOTS AND TYRANTS".
THOMAS JEFFERSON

That my two young sons may never have to know the horrors of war. 

I will stand for your rights as my forefathers did before me!
My thanks to those who have, are and will stand for mine!
To those in the military, I salute you!

LONGTOM 9-25-07

Offline LONGTOM

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #19 on: October 16, 2008, 03:15:19 PM »
Guess we better stick to the subject before someone takes offence and turns us in.


LONGTOM
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"THE TREE OF LIBERTY FROM TIME TO TIME MUST BE REFRESHED WITH THE BLOOD OF PATRIOTS AND TYRANTS".
THOMAS JEFFERSON

That my two young sons may never have to know the horrors of war. 

I will stand for your rights as my forefathers did before me!
My thanks to those who have, are and will stand for mine!
To those in the military, I salute you!

LONGTOM 9-25-07

Offline Badnews Bob

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #20 on: October 17, 2008, 01:23:10 AM »
Yeah like maybe your wife! ::) ::) :o ;D
Badnews Bob
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Offline LONGTOM

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #21 on: October 17, 2008, 02:40:52 AM »
She don't care.
As long as I am shooting she knows I'm not getting in any trouble and it keeps me out of her hair!


LONGTOM
NRA Benefactor Life Member
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"THE TREE OF LIBERTY FROM TIME TO TIME MUST BE REFRESHED WITH THE BLOOD OF PATRIOTS AND TYRANTS".
THOMAS JEFFERSON

That my two young sons may never have to know the horrors of war. 

I will stand for your rights as my forefathers did before me!
My thanks to those who have, are and will stand for mine!
To those in the military, I salute you!

LONGTOM 9-25-07

Offline AtlLaw

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #22 on: October 21, 2008, 05:36:23 PM »
HEY!
I just got home from a few days in deer camp for opening weekend and couldn't wait to see if there were any responses to the thread!   ;D  Well, I did have to cut up the yearling I killed, and I saw the barrel I bought from LongTom had arrived so I had to play with it for awhile, but I'm on my computer now!   :P

However, it's 11:25 and I got court in the morning so I'm going to bed!   :(  BUT  I've got a lot to say so I talk to y'all tomorrow afternoon!   ;D
Richard
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Offline Badnews Bob

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #23 on: October 22, 2008, 02:40:10 AM »
Good job on getting some dinner. I didn't see a single deer this weekend that wasn't in somebodys front yard. :-\
Badnews Bob
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Offline petemi

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #24 on: October 22, 2008, 03:01:43 AM »
Bob, Ya just knock on the door and ask "Can I plink that deer in your front yard.  I'll split the venison with you. ;)  All they can say is "No". :o
Keep both eyes open and make the first shot good.
The growing Handi/Sportster/Pardner/Topper Family:  .22 WMR, .22-250. 223, Two Superlight 7mm-08s and one .243, .30-30,  .308, 32-20, 18 inch .356/.358 Win., Two 16.5 inch .357 Max., 18 inch 38-55 BC Carbine, 16.5 inch .445 Super Mag., .45LC, 16.5 and 22 inch .45-70s, .50 Huntsman SS, .410, 20 ga., 12 ga., 20 ga. Pardner Pump, Versa-Pack .410 - .22
[size=7.4 pt]PLEASE DONATE TO THE GBO SERVER FUND  We're closer to the goal but not there yet, we can still use more donations, thanks

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/topic,191112.msg1098959491.html#msg1098959491

Offline Badnews Bob

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #25 on: October 22, 2008, 04:09:43 AM »
That would be great Petemi but I can't seem to get the deer to understand they need to stay put until I get permission to shoot them. They all run away when I get out of the truck with a rifle. Strange huh. ::) ;D
Badnews Bob
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Offline AtlLaw

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #26 on: October 22, 2008, 06:32:57 AM »
Okay, at my desk now so I can take my time.  :)

Well, when I got back from my 3.5 day opening weekend hunting trip, my new to me BC barrel was sitting in the kitchen.  (My wife puts all my stuff on the kitchen counter since the kitchen is MY domain!  But, that's another story...  ;D)  She never mentioned it and neither did I, but after my butchering chores were done, it and me disappeared into my gunroom!   ;)

Now let me tell you, Long Tom is a great guy.  Did y'all know he is really from Washington State?  Anyway, He had the barrel in the mail to me before I even wrote out the check!  And I had the whole trip to think about what I was going to do!  But let me tell you, I WAS ROBBED!   :o  Oh the barrel looked fine.  Much better then LT's description, but when I pulled out my serial number NC prefix Handi Rifle and put the BC barrel on it, it locked up tight as a drum; a PERFECT fit.   :o  :o  And remember, I'm an expert at handi rifle fitment!   :P

Anyway, I was figuring I'd be able to get some more practice fitting the barrel, and since I'd have to fit it anyway, I might just as well buy another receiver, but that is all out the window now.   :(  All this talent not needed... excess.  :(  :(  I feel so bad about this whole mess that I'm just going mount a scope on that barrel, load up some 45/70's and bring it with me the next time I head out to slay Bambi!

More to follow...
Richard
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Offline AtlLaw

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #27 on: October 22, 2008, 07:18:50 AM »
Now that I have a receiver that mates up perfectly with my BC barrel, I can put my other ideas into action.   ;D  After looking at basic brass for 45/110 and 45/120 brass, I see that they are the same price.  But, being realistic, I'll never hunt DG with this rifle, so the only real reason is "shock & awe!"  Decision.. 45/120.   8)

For some reason I thought the BC had a 34 or 36 inch barrel.   :-\  32 inches is fine.

A good recoil pad and a mercury recoil reducer or lead in the stock bolt hole will do wonders for recoil,... With a nice stock configuration like Stuffit's, recoil would be managed even better.

My thoughts exactly! I don't especially like any available stock for this project, but maybe I'll take a rasp to one of the stocks from Gunstock's Inc. and see what I end up with.   ;D

it can be re-chambered by hand with a $35 rental reamer

I looked at reamer rental and I think I'll give that a try.  One question though.  Does the chamber reamer also set the length and taper of the leade?  I also want to increase the leade in my 45/70, can I do it with that (45/120) reamer?  I've got the name of that reamer rental place here somewhere's but I seem to remember their prices went up.  BTW, do they waive the deposit for forum members?   ;)


Richard
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Offline quickdtoo

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #28 on: October 22, 2008, 07:32:52 AM »
Good choice on the 45-120, that's the same conclusion I came to, shock and awe is what it's all about, just jump on that Cabela's deal while it's still there, I don't think you'll find it much cheaper. I can't really answer the leade question on the 45-120, Smokinjoe can tho, he's done his own, I had mine done by a local smith. I have reamed the throat on three of my 45-70s tho, about .250" deeper so I can load 45-70 "magnum" loads with 350gr and bigger bullets, loads that just have a longer COL. That's covered in the FAQs, GBO sponsor 4D is where I rent my reamers from, I just use a credit card, Fred doesn't charge the card until the reamer is returned and then only for the rent & shpg.

Tim


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Offline Smokin Joe

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Re: 45-90? 100? 110? 120? What to do, what to do...
« Reply #29 on: October 22, 2008, 07:36:13 AM »
The reamer cuts the throat also. If you want it extended, you'll have to get a "throater" also. The last time I used one, the throater was too short for the 120 so you'll have to get an extension.
 4-D waives the deposit when you use credit cards.

They can help you out..........contact 'em:

http://www.4-dproducts.com/contact.php
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