Author Topic: I couldn't resist . . . :)  (Read 1849 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline MGMorden

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2093
  • Gender: Male
I couldn't resist . . . :)
« on: August 17, 2007, 01:47:12 PM »
Well, it's only been 2 weeks since the last gun I bought (and usually I can hold out much longer than this - before the last one I hadn't bought a new gun in almost a year :)), but I stopped into a local pawn dealer on my lunch break yesterday.  Saw this Springfield 1903 sporter and just fell in love with the stock (the grain looks fantastic, and that checkering is hand cut with the forearm pattern wrapping all the way around!), plus my first centerfire rifle was a sporterized 03-A3 that I'd sold off (it wouldn't shoot - keyholed at 50 yards, but I still regretted not keeping it and rebarreling later).  It's another .30-06 and I already have 1, but oh well :)

Managed to get them down to $275 (asking price was $329) for the rifle, scope (a 4x Tasco, but it is one of the older Japanese ones so maybe it isn't total junk :)), mounts, bases, and leather sling.  It ain't perfect; the recoil pad is very sloppily fit (gonna have to have a new one fitted by my smith), there's some dings in the wood and finish (but I've refinished enough stocks to be comfortable stripping the finish off this one and redoing it), and it is missing one windage adjustment screw from the base, but that should be easy to replace (or I can just replace the base for around $15).  The bore looks wonderful though (better than some new rifles I see today), and the action is very slick. 

A bit of a fixer-upper, but I kinda like my guns that way :).






Offline SuperstitionCoues

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 366
  • Gender: Male
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #1 on: August 17, 2007, 02:04:07 PM »
I think you did very well.  I wouldn't mess with the finish of the stock, though.  It is truly a thing of beauty.  Maybe some Old English scratch cover in the right places would help you out?  I think you did very well indeed...
I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed person.

Offline dw06

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (6)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1074
  • Gender: Male
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #2 on: August 17, 2007, 02:13:44 PM »
+1 I think you did very well.That is some nice looking wood!
If you find yourself in a hole,the first thing to do is stop digging-Will Rogers

Offline EVOC ONE

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1373
  • Gender: Male
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #3 on: August 17, 2007, 03:44:27 PM »
I think you did well.  That wood is beautiful!

Good luck and have fun bringing her back to full duty status.

Offline Rangr44

  • Trade Count: (6)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2158
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2007, 12:34:18 PM »
Nice wood - I just love it, when some dufus misfits a recoil pad like that.  It makes it soooo much easier to dicker the price down - and, it's a relatively easy fix.

BTW - I've had good luck, stripping old stock finish off (and out of the checkering) without sanding by using Formby's Furniture Remover, from WallyWorld, on OOOO steel wool pads.
There's a Place for All God's Creatures - Right Next to the Potatoes & Gravy ! !

Offline Graybeard

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (69)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27107
  • Gender: Male
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2007, 12:59:21 PM »
Other than the pad which I do NOT believe was installed by the stock maker you seem to have gotten a gun put together by a very proficient smith or smiths and stocked by a true stock maker. Such guns were very popular back in the 50s and 60s but since so many good factory rifles are now available are no longer in vogue. That means some excellent hunting rifles can be had at bargain prices now. I'm sure whoever had that build paid far more for it than than you have now.

Get rid of that ugly pad and get a proper one installed to compliment that beautiful stock and use a real classic rifle from the 50s or 60s.


Bill aka the Graybeard
President, Graybeard Outdoor Enterprises
256-435-1125

I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!

Offline TribReady

  • GBO Supporter
  • Trade Count: (8)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1059
  • Gender: Male
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #6 on: August 19, 2007, 07:28:10 AM »
Although I would never advocate sporterizing an '03 now, getting one that's been done already "back in the day" is awesome.
You can tell it was done well and not just chopped together like some Bubba.

A rifle like that has it's own history and is a classic.  The stock looks great...I'd leave as is, maybe just touch up a few spots and fit a new buttpad or buttplate. You don't find wood like that on rifles these days---atleast not for $275!

Great find and great rifle, enjoy!!
A government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take everything you have. -Thomas Jefferson


...if my people, who are called by my name, will humble themselves and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and I will forgive their sin and will heal their land.  -2 Chronicles 7:14

Offline Sweet 6.5

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 373
  • Gender: Male
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2007, 07:23:51 AM »
HOW does it shoot??

Offline MGMorden

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2093
  • Gender: Male
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2007, 08:56:43 AM »
No clue yet.  Gotta get that windage adjustment screw in first and then I'll post some results.  I found that Midway sells a 10 pack (5 silver, 5 blue) for around $5, so as soon as they're back on stock I'll be ordering those, along with a 1" Medium Hogue recoil pad (solid black - will look nice on this rifle I think) that I'll be having a local smith put on.

Offline 35Rem

  • Trade Count: (7)
  • A Real Regular
  • ****
  • Posts: 550
    • Remington Model 8 and 81 Autoloading Rifles
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #9 on: August 20, 2007, 09:57:20 AM »
Beautiful wood! That's a looker.
Why not put a limbsaver on it?
Is that a Leupold/Redfield base that's missing the windage screw? Call some gun shops/smiths and see if they have on laying around. I'd hate for you to wait too long to shoot it.
Remington Model 8 and 81 Autoloading Rifles
http://thegreatmodel8.remingtonsociety.com/
Vintage Semiauto Rifles
http://vintagesemiautorifle.proboards105.com/index.cgi

Offline jvs

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1539
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #10 on: August 20, 2007, 10:21:15 AM »
I bought a .30-06 03A3 Sporter in the Spring of 2006 for $300.  The guy I bought it from put it together in the late '60's. 

The one I bought came with a 22" barrel, a Bishop Stock and Redfield Micrometer Peep Sights.  When I was checking the rifle out before I bought it, I noticed that it probably wasn't the original barrel that was cut down.  I asked the Gentleman about the barrel and he told me that at the time he was building it, the Philadelphia Naval Yard was liquidating their Military Match Barrels, and that is what he put on.

At the time I was debating with myself as to whether I should try and get the price down a little.  After trying to think of what other .30-06 I could get, in that kind of shape, I decided that $300 was a fair enough price.

Where else am I going to find a rifle in decent shape, with a military match barrel, a Bishop Stock and Micrometer peeps for $300 ?

btw, it shoots great !

ONE WORD OF CAUTION !    Not all 03A3's were made at the Springfield Armory.  Some early Production 03A3 Receivers were not Heat Treated properly and have been known to explode when fired.  I suggest you search the Web for information for the Serial Numbers and Armory's that had the problem receivers due to improper heat treating. 

There are alot of good 03A3's out there, but I know you don't want one of the questionable ones. 

I did a quick search of the net and found this Paper written by Joseph L. Lyon, M.D., M.P.H. - Which states :

The U.S. Model 1903 rifle, commonly called the Springfield, was used by the U.S. Military between 1903 and 1945. When the United States declared war on Germany in April 1917 there was a marked increase in the use of this rifle for training. Between July and December 1917 eleven rifle receivers shattered, causing one severe and 10 minor injuries to the soldiers using the rifle. Despite the intense demand for rifles caused by our entry into the war, production at both Springfield Armory and Rock Island Arsenal was halted in early 1918, and an investigation launched to determine the cause of the problem.

It was determined that the workers responsible for heat treating the receivers had used an "eyeball" method that relied on the color of the heated metal to determine if the steel had been heated to the correct temperature. Unfortunately, according to General Hatcher, the officer in charge of the investigation, "... it was quickly found that the ‘right heat’ as judged by the skillful eye of the old timers was up to 300 degrees hotter on a bright sunny day than it was on a dark cloudy one" (See Hatcher, Julian Hatcher’s Notebook , Third Edition, Stackpole Books, Harrisburg, Pennsylvania, 1966, page 215). Heating to the higher temperatures led to crystallization of trace elements within the steel, making it too hard, and rather than deforming under high pressure, the receiver shattered, often permitting the bolt to exit the receiver, causing injury to the shooter. Between 1917 and 1929 three soldiers lost an eye to receiver failure, and six more had unspecified injuries consider serious. An additional 34 soldiers received minor injuries from receiver failures. There were no deaths reported from the failure of a Springfield receiver.

The heat treating method was immediately changed to a double heat treatment, and pyrometers were used to determine the temperature of the heated receivers. The change in heat treating was instituted between serial number 750,00 and 800,000 at Springfield and by serial number 285,506 at Rock Island Arsenal. Rifles manufactured after these serial numbers are referred to as "high numbered" receivers and are commonly stated to be safe to shoot.
 

You can read the full article here: http://m1903.com/03rcvrfail/
 If you want to run with the Wolves, you can't Pee with the Puppies.

Offline MGMorden

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2093
  • Gender: Male
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #11 on: August 20, 2007, 01:22:11 PM »
Why not put a limbsaver on it?

Honestly, because the Hogue looks better to me :).  When I was growing up almost all of my deer hunting was done with 12ga 3" 00 Buck (dog driving - it's pretty big in SC though they're starting to scale it back a lot here - I give it 10 years before it's gone entirely).  As such I've not noticed many rifles whose recoil bothers me.  My first '06 had a plain old plastic buttplate and I was fine shooting it, so I figure anything rubber behind the stock will provide more than enough cushion.  I'm just looking for something that looks proper :).

To JVS: Yeah, I was aware of the issue with the serial numbers, and when I first picked it up it scared me, as when I looked at it it had the tell tale "Hatcher Hole" drilled in the side, which I've always read was done by the Marine Corps to salvage the low number rifles, but after checking the serial numbers this one is well past the 800000 mark (it's in the 3 million range), and was made by Remington which never had any problems.

Offline jvs

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1539
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #12 on: August 21, 2007, 10:42:13 AM »
My 03A3 is marked Springfield Armory and the Serial Number is also well above the troubled receivers.

Do you know if there is a Database that has the Serial Numbers when Remington and Smith Corona made the pieces?   I have only ever saw one Smith Corona, and that was about 20 yrs ago.

I do know one thing...  A Sporter made from one of those 03A3's is a nice piece.  I understand that when Sporterizing them was more popular, the Actions and Barrels could have been had for very little money by todays standards.  Not any more though.
 If you want to run with the Wolves, you can't Pee with the Puppies.

Offline 41 mag

  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Contributor
  • ***
  • Posts: 254
    • My Pictures
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2007, 12:32:45 PM »
First off let me say that even with the very few inperfections that is one very nice piece. I picked one up not to long ago myself. The barreled action is perfect but the stock is a cheap replacement. It does however shoot 1" groups consistantly at least out to 100yds. I simply stood it in the safe next to my pops until I get a chance to do something with it.

Here is a site which might shed a little light on what your looking for. It is a VERY well kept database on these fine older rifles.
http://vishooter.home.att.net/m1903.html

Good luck with yours and I would not try to adjust the finish on that wood. I would fix the recoil pad and leave the rest along. Sometimes that older wood does weird stuff once the finish is worked on. I would simply chaulk it up to charactor.


Offline jvs

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1539
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2007, 01:47:04 PM »
I actually have that website stored in my computer.  I found it after I generated that last post and I didn't get around to letting anybody know I found it again.

I researched my 03A3 before I bought it and forgot what I did with the website I found until the other day.

I showed my Sporter to one of my friends and he thinks I should have it drilled and tapped for a scope.  I am against doing that.  I think I will keep it in the general condition I found it.   Since mine was put together in the late 60's, it comes from a time when WWII Vets had Mil-Surps Sporterized, some without scopes.    Not many people had scopes back then and the Military didn't teach them to shoot scoped rifles for War.  Some today still don't want a scoped rifle. 

I can still see WWII Vets at the range every fall shooting open sights, even though there are fewer every year.  Soon there will be none, but at least one of their hunting rifles will be passed down to a future generation.

 
 If you want to run with the Wolves, you can't Pee with the Puppies.

Offline 30-06man

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2604
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #15 on: August 26, 2007, 03:00:57 PM »
i would do all what you said. but i would look into a vx3 scope 3-9x32 with the gloss. that would make that gun nice. it would be a real shooter. although i wouldn't hunt with it. too nice of wood and gloss
The sportsman lives his life vicariously. For he secretly yearns to have lived before, in a simpler time. A time when his love for the land, water, fish and wildlife would be more than just part of his life. It would be his state of mind

Rick

Offline corbanzo

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2405
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #16 on: August 27, 2007, 10:42:06 AM »
although i wouldn't hunt with it.

You are breaking the hearts of many a good deer, bear, and moose out there with that one.   ;)
"At least with a gun that big, if you miss and hit the rocks in front of him it'll stone him to death..."

Offline 30-06man

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2604
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #17 on: August 27, 2007, 01:54:50 PM »
its way to pretty. i would be taking off my rain coat to cover it. i would have it all rapped up in stuff to keep it from getting scrached. it would be a target gun. if i hunted with it i would look into haveing another stock for it. possibly synthtic and keep the pretty wood for show at the range lol. i have had guns that was just too nice to hunt with. and i don't know why i bought them. i am wanting the t/c icon and have no use for it its too pretty to hunt with. it would be topped off with nice optics and be put just for shooting.
The sportsman lives his life vicariously. For he secretly yearns to have lived before, in a simpler time. A time when his love for the land, water, fish and wildlife would be more than just part of his life. It would be his state of mind

Rick

Offline randyb

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 45
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #18 on: August 28, 2007, 07:33:12 AM »
Very nice wood.  A true beauty. 
A vote is like a rifle: its usefulness depends upon the character of the user.
Theodore Roosevelt

Offline Graybeard

  • Administrator
  • Trade Count: (69)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 27107
  • Gender: Male
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #19 on: August 28, 2007, 10:32:35 AM »
I am constantly amazed at folks who own or just look at guns owned by others and think it too pretty use actually use and want to put it up on a shelf to look at. Guns are made to be shot not looked at. I have a cousin who owns a Browning O/U that is a grade three and every time he brings it to the skeet range which is extremely rarely he continually talks about it being so pretty he hates to shoot it for fear it might get a scratch.

I've never worried about such and just understand when I get them they are gonna get some character marks on them. My grade seven guns got shot regularly when the cousin moaned his much lower grade three was too nice to chance a scratch on. I paid $12,500 for my Kreighoff and it was the single most beautiful shotgun I amd most everyone I shot with had ever seen. Of that we all agreed. The wood on it had 100% fancy figure and I've never even seen a photo of a gun with such wood much less one in person which is why I bought it to begin with. I shot it regularly but mostly with the 28 gauge tube set in the barrels. It was such a heavy gun that before I finished the second round with it each day my back was hurting me so badly I could barely walk.

Sadly I gave it up and sold it as it was just too danged heavy for me to use. Within a couple months of me selling it the fellow who bought it was shooting a tournament with it and he and some buddies he was shooting with who also owned high grade guns of similar value put them in the truck of one of their vehicles and went to lunch in another. When they came back all were stolen from the vehicle and have never been seen again. I hope all had adequate insurace because the take that day was likely worth over $50,000.

But by golly no matter how pretty it is a gun is made to be shot and if it comes home with me shot it will be it won't be an object to be tucked away in a safe to be taken out rarely to admire and put back.


Bill aka the Graybeard
President, Graybeard Outdoor Enterprises
256-435-1125

I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!

Offline Brithunter

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2538
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #20 on: August 28, 2007, 11:19:19 AM »
HEAR ............ HEAR  ;)

     GB has hit the nail squarely on the head.

Offline jvs

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1539
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #21 on: August 28, 2007, 11:42:47 AM »
I agree with GB  99.7% .

I am still debating with myself as to whether I should shoot the 2 Remington .30-06 Commemoratives I bought last year, and so far the answer is NO.   While one probably has a large mintage, the other one is only 1 of 100.

As to other rifles or handguns that are not as limited, I would certainly shoot them.
 If you want to run with the Wolves, you can't Pee with the Puppies.

Offline 30-06man

  • Trade Count: (2)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2604
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #22 on: August 28, 2007, 01:05:15 PM »
never once did i say i wouldn't shoot it. i would a lot. at competitions too. but not hunting. you have your own ideas and that's not mine. if i paid $12500 for a gun i would shoot it at skeet ranges and use it for competitions. now if i since this rifle was so cheap i might would. there is no way i would take it out on a rainy day. and if i had a limited addition gun i would never shoot them i would never open the action unless it already has been done. because as we all know it will gain in value. jvs if its 1 out of 100 i wouldn't dare shoot it!! i like collecting guns like that and i try to get 2 so i can shoot one and keep another one in mint condition. but some guns are made pretty and ment to shoot but not to hunt. if i was desperate i would. i guess i would hunt with it but i would worry about the weather. i would hunt with it because i only paid around 2-300 for it. i wouldn't put a gun in the back of my truck like that.  its stupid. you know some thug will see it and know its worth something and sell it to a pawn shop.
The sportsman lives his life vicariously. For he secretly yearns to have lived before, in a simpler time. A time when his love for the land, water, fish and wildlife would be more than just part of his life. It would be his state of mind

Rick

Offline Brithunter

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2538
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #23 on: August 29, 2007, 11:16:39 PM »
Hi all,

     Well I use them for that which they were designed and built. Here is one such rifle, it's the only one of it's kind and as you can see I hunt with it:-



The deer is a Muntjac and yes they are that small and it's fully grown!

  This is 1 of 389 made, it's a BSA CF2 in 7x57:-





   A Whitetail Doe and 9 point Buck taken in Missouri back in 2003. Now I have no idea how many rifles were made like this one but it cannot be many as Rigby's were better known for thei Mausers than Mannlichers, it's a Rigby Mannlicher Mdl 1892 built for a Mr dent of  London and yes it's been hunted with :-



   Although I personally have not hunted with it as I need more practice with iron sights.



Offline TNyoteboy

  • Trade Count: (1)
  • Member
  • *
  • Posts: 75
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2007, 04:49:43 AM »
Very pretty wood. Slick it up a little and find you a screw and you're in business.

Offline DalesCarpentry

  • Trade Count: (32)
  • Senior Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6111
  • Gender: Male
  • I would rather be shooting!!
Re: I couldn't resist . . . :)
« Reply #25 on: September 06, 2007, 07:02:49 PM »
I know you have heard it many times all ready but that is some very pretty wood. Take it from a carpenter. I also think you got a great deal.       Dale
The quality of a mans life is in direct proportion to his commitment to excellence.

A bad day at the range is better than a good day at work!!