So many, which one?

[Ruskin]

I have been looking at Ridgeline.  I have overlooked Ford and Dodge. The Dodge Dakota is interesting.  My buddy has one and satisfied.  His is a 4x4. Any comments?

The ridgeline price for 06 is as high as 07 RT which is thier plane jane.  I want a tow package which means I would have to go to 07 RTX.  I believe the price is held up due to factory warranty.  I had an 07 RT offered by dealer for 21,800.00.  It seems like a good by; however, no towing package. There is some price pressure on the 07 RT because the 08 is hitting.  On E bay the prices seem to defy my econmics 101 about prices being pushed down by the new models.

Anyone else pricing?
 

[30-30man]

I have never taken the truck by Honda seriously. My wife wanted one bad but when I looked at what was underneath, I gave a definite no. It had a fully boxed frame but that was it.  The springs and suspension looked more like their mini-van.  I think the Ridgeline only has something like a 5000 max tow rating.  In reality, you can divide that by 1/2 to be comfortable.  All the 1/2 tons right now advertise that they can tow up to and over 7500 lbs, and at 5000lbs, things can get whiteknuckled with that much weight. If you are going to do any towing, I would suggest one of the big five 1/2 tons at least.  Dodge,Ford, Chevy, and even Toyota/Nissan, none of them make a bad truck. The Honda would not even come close to hauling a half ton, I saw one at Lowe's with a 1 pallet of sod and it was squating down to the axles.  I've hauled two pallets in my Dodge and it only sagged a little.  A real truck should have the option of a v-8, Hondas only come with a V-6.  For the $20+grand they want for the Ridgeline, you could get something much better equiped to tow.

[H666]

My buddies have said that if you want a truck for towing, nothing beats a Ford or a Dodge Ram.  A friend of mine had a Dakota and that was a really nice truck, smooth on the road or offroad, plenty of power and space.

In Iceland, the official farming truck is a Toyota Hilux (don't know the American name, Tacoma maybe?) with a 2.4 liter diesel.  Those things are pretty much maintanance free, but man are they stiff offroad.  Plus the 2.4 liter diesel is rather slow.  It has a decent tow for a four-cyliner though.

[Keith L]

I don't know if you can even get a diesel in a light truck here in the states.  I drive a Ford Focus for a commuter vehicle and hear with envy about how well the Focus Diesel works in Europe.  It is time we got off the stick here and started following your lead on this.

[rockbilly]

Toyota was the only light truck manufacturer to offer a diesel, but they discontinued that in the mid-eighties.  My friend had one, it was a great truck, good gas mileage.  I had the same truck with a 22R gas engine.  We had bass boats that were very similar, I could run away from him on the highway, but he would pass while I was stopped to gas up.

I don't know why Toyota discontinued the diesel truck, but at today's cost of diesel fuel I really don't see much of an advantage to the diesel, other than the longevity of the engine, but that too, is worth debate, my gas engine lasted 260K and was going strong when i sold it.

[R.W.Dale]

Toyota was the only light truck manufacturer to offer a diesel, but they discontinued that in the mid-eighties. 

 Nope! In the mid 80's just about every manufacturer had a diesel small pickup. Ford, Isuzu, Nissan, Chevy, Dodge, Plymouth ect ect. The little Isuzu's are very sought after in my aera.

but at today's cost of diesel fuel I really don't see much of an advantage to the diesel,

  getting 32+ MPG from a little truck is one HECK! of an advantage. Even at today's prices

[goodwrench6710]

The biggest problem with the diesel engine today is meeting the federal emissions standards for the year models. VW no longer sells a diesel powered vehicle in the USA due to this reason. The TDI doesn't meet the emissions standards for 2007 & newer. This is causing the manufactures to have to almost reinvent the diesel engine.

[R.W.Dale]

The biggest problem with the diesel engine today is meeting the federal emissions standards for the year models. VW no longer sells a diesel powered vehicle in the USA due to this reason. The TDI doesn't meet the emissions standards for 2007 & newer. This is causing the manufactures to have to almost reinvent the diesel engine.

 YEP you got it! typical for the US government. In one hand the say we need to drive more efficient cars and cut out fossil fuel consumption and on the other they FORCE us to use fuel hungry gasoline engines.

[goodwrench6710]

Right now the best thing going is the hybrid system. If you never took one for a test drive, you should. They have more power than the standard gasoline engine powered vehicle & the biggest advantage is the environment. The emissions levels are very low. If driven correctly they get much better fuel mileage. Believe it or not, they are very reliable for the amount of technology in these vehicles (at least the Toyota's are). The disadvantage is the cost. I do believe there are tax breaks in federal taxes on the purchase of a new hybrid car & some states offer tax rebates too. That can offset the cost.
I figured I'd give you something to think about, fuel savings & environmentally friendlier.

PS: When push comes to shove, I'm still an old school small block Chevy camhead! It's just not practical at todays fuel prices & the distance I travel.

[R.W.Dale]

, fuel savings & environmentally friendlier.

 I don't know about that. A Golf TDI would pull off mpg numbers I have yet to see from any hybrid. And all those heavy metals contained inside those battery packs on hybrids are rather extremely environmentally unfriendly.

 What I don't understand is why on hybrids they don't do away with the traditional transmission drivetrain and go with wheel motors like a locomotive and just have the gas motor drive a generator.

[goodwrench6710]

Toyota's design of transmission is the electric motor & has a clutch to engage when the engine is started when the power demand is greater than what the electric motor can supply.  This way on heavy acceleration it can use electric & gas engine power to gain speed even faster. On deceleration the motor is still spinning & generates electricity to charge the batteries. The transmission which contains the electric motor is also the starter for the engine. When the brake pedal is pushed, a computer determines the amount of force applied & will use the motor to slow it down or if needed applies the hydraulic brakes. Brake life can be over 100,000 miles. Out of the 7 years of Toyota selling hybrids in the USA, the dealership where I work has replaced 0 hybrid batteries. They can be recycled too. Yes the VW TDI is a fuel sipper & is probably the best engine that VW makes, the feds won't allow it. I can also say the Toyota will cost less in repair in the long run & more reliable though. The dealer I work for sells Toyota, Scion, VW & Audi. I work on all 4 lines, about 90% of the repair work is VW & Audi.
As far as being the most efficient, the hydrogen fuel cell is the ticket, but to set of the facilities to refuel these vehicles would be very costly.
So for now, the hybrid is about the best we can do to try & help the environment.
A hybrid isn't for all people though, it's not good for extended high speed driving because at speeds of 90 mph. & over, the batteries will be depleted.

[Ahab]

I have been looking at Ridgeline.   I had an 07 RT offered by dealer for 21,800.00.  It seems like a good by; however, no towing package. There is some price pressure on the 07 RT because the 08 is hitting.  On E bay the prices seem to defy my econmics 101 about prices being pushed down by the new models.


They all come with a standard towing package. The hitch and wiring harness are x-tra but i bet you  could talk them into throwing them in for free. I've had mine for 2 years now and it sees the same use as my old F150 without a whimper and in much better comfort and better gas mileage. It is not a rock crawler but does quite well in the boonies.
 

[goodwrench6710]

If you want a truck, buy a truck! Not a uni-body wanna be a truck, unless you're gonna use it to go grocery shopping. If that's the case, buy a car & use less gas. A truck has a FRAME. If you want to work it & tow you need a full frame.

[R.W.Dale]

A truck has a FRAME. If you want to work it & tow you need a full frame.

 I beg to differ, those unibody Jeep MJ's are plenty real enough in my book. Just cause the big three refuse to be drug into the 21'st century doesn't mean there isn't a better way. If the ridgline will do everything a conventional 1/2 ton truck can do how is it not in your words "a real truck"


 The Jeep Comanche A UNIBODY TRUCK.

unless you're gonna use it to go grocery shopping.

 What do you think 99.8% of trucks get used for these days? They certianlly ain't haulin loads of rock from the quarry day in day out. People think they've worked the pee out of their trucks these days pulling a bass boat

As far as being the most efficient, the hydrogen fuel cell is the ticket, but to set of the facilities to refuel these vehicles would be very costly.
So for now, the hybrid is about the best we can do to try & help the environment.
A hybrid isn't for all people though, it's not good for extended high speed driving because at speeds of 90 mph. & over, the batteries will be depleted.

 There is a technology out there that will require NO new infrastructure and is much more efficient yet NOBODY talks about them. COMPRESSED Air powered cars are beginning to see widespread usage in countries like India.

one of a handful of planned Air Car models, can hit 68 mph and has a range of 125 miles. It will take only a few minutes for the CityCAT to refuel at gas stations equipped with custom air compressor units; MDI says it should cost around $2 to fill the car’s carbon-fiber tanks with 340 liters of air at 4350 psi.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars/4217016.html

 if available stateside at a reasonable price I wouldn't waste any time buying one. My get to work fuel cost's would go from $40 per week getting 20mpg to $4

[goodwrench6710]

Unfortunately most people are in to much of a hurry to travel at 68 mph. or would be to inconvenient to have a travel distance of 125 miles. With the temperature extremes & the compressed air car I could see this as a possible pain in the butt. Like freezing half to death like the old Beetle  . Air compressor don't like cold weather & tend to freeze up & or break. I could see all the air powered cars frozen up along the road when it's below 0 deg. F.
When it boils down to it. The way things are starting to fall in place, we are moving to a socialist government & they are gonna tell you what your allowed to drive! Who knows, maybe they'll tell you what you're allowed to think! Sorry about unloading that on you guys, but that's one of my biggest fears.
Back to the actual subject, if you're looking for a grocery getter that will pull a pop up camper or your trailer with a couple ATV's, get a uni body. If you plan on working it beyond it's capacity (alot of us do), get something with a frame. A bent frame is cheaper & easier to fix, cheaper to fix than a buckled uni body structure.

[R.W.Dale]

A bent frame is cheaper & easier to fix, cheaper to fix than a buckled uni body structure.

 PFFFT! Who cares, that's why I buy insurance. My deductible is $500 either way.

[goodwrench6710]

 PFFFT! Who cares, that's why I buy insurance. My deductible is $500 either way.
[/quote]
& that's why everybody cries about high insurance premiums, because of stupidity!
Just like if you build your house under sea level next to the ocean & you get flooded out. Guess what, you deserve it!
If the insurance companies would investigate more, the prisons would be full of people who commit fraud.
I guess there are just some people who have no common sense & you can't make them see the light.
It's like taking a Daisy Redrider out to hunt white deer. 

[R.W.Dale]

 PFFFT! Who cares, that's why I buy insurance. My deductible is $500 either way.

& that's why everybody cries about high insurance premiums, because of stupidity!
Just like if you build your house under sea level next to the ocean & you get flooded out. Guess what, you deserve it!
If the insurance companies would investigate more, the prisons would be full of people who commit fraud.
I guess there are just some people who have no common sense & you can't make them see the light.
It's like taking a Daisy Redrider out to hunt white deer. 


[/quote]



 Do you really think an insurance company will get off any cheaper with an  big 3 truck with a bent frame vs a Ridgline NO they will not. Cause they'll total either one. I don't know bout you but I ain't gonna let an insurance company tell me that my truck that looked like a pretzel after the accident is OK nor will I be willing to take the tremendous hit in value that goes with a DAMAGED title.

 Not only is  unibody  construction STRONGER than ladder on frame construction but it's also SAFER.

 From an insurance standpoint they LOVE the Honda cause doctor bulls are exponentially more expensive than body shop bills.

TORRANCE, Calif. — Honda's 2006 Ridgeline truck became the first four-door pickup to earn the highest crash test rating from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA), getting top marks in both frontal and side crash tests.

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=105595

[goodwrench6710]

You have totally missed my point. I said that a unibody is fine for it's intended purpose. Not for heavy loads. The reason for a frame is to allow the twist & flex needed for towing heavy loads & hauling heavy loads. I'm just saying that if your buying for a light duty purpose, uni body is fine. I was just trying to get a point across that if you overwork a truck like I tend to, don't expect it to hold up! Yes I expect a 1/2 ton truck to haul 2 tons & have done it alot of times.
Oh, buy the way. If I were to pick a new truck to work, it would be a 2007 Toyota Tundra 4x4 with a 5.7L V8.

[R.W.Dale]

buying for a light duty purpose,

 Like what a 1/2 ton truck is used for.

[30-30man]

A real truck has the availability of 4wd low and a v-8.  The only option in the Honda is AWD/v6 which is not the same.  The 4low in any of the 1/2 tons will drag that Honda all over any parking lot in America. 

[goodwrench6710]

Like the Subaru Baha, what we call a F.A.T. (fat a$$ transport).

[rockbilly]

Krochus.  As the former General Manager of a West Texas Toyota dealership, let me say, Toyota introduced diesel trucks for North America in 1981. The 1981-1983 models were available with the 2.2L "L" (or "1L") normally aspirated engine. In 1984, this was replaced by the 2.4L "2L" engine. For 1985 and 1986, both the 2L and a turbo charged 2L-T engine were available. Toyota dropped all diesel options for USA after the 1986 model year, but they continued as options for Canadian trucks through 1988, and as I understand, are again available in Canada.  It is truly hard to understand why Toyota doesn't offer an American version of the diesel today, after all, most every other country in the world has them.

I never knew one to get 32 MPG, most peaked out at about 26 MPG, without a load, driving below 65 MPH.  Go over 65 MPH, or attach a load, and the mileage dropped drastically.   

[R.W.Dale]

 in the long lost past there was a very popular vehicle called an El Camino, They were popular cause they were "enough truck" for the people buying them. The Ridgline fills the same place in the market as the El Camino and Ranchero of old.


 "OH but the honda ain't a real truck" I can take one of those honda's and drag 80's and early 90's model 1/2 trucks around by the nose. Are those not real trucks? I find it funny how now days people have some kind of goofy over expectations about what a 1/2 ton truck should do. In the old days a truck with a 100HP 6cyl engine and drum brakes was considered more than adequate. Now days people think they need an F-450 to tow a 3600lb boat. Of course this is why $35,000 half ton trucks are not uncommon.

 Now you wanna gripe about something stupid and sissified in the world of trucks, Try buying a 1/2 ton 4x4 that doesn't have ^%$% carpet in the floors without special ordering one. In my book ANY truck with anything other than vinyl a bench seat up front is nothing more than a oversized grocery getter. Crapola there's trucks made today with floor mounted gearshifts ON AUTOMATICS.


 The ridgeline fits right in

[Ahab]

Thank you Krochus for some meaningful comments. Some people tend to be short sighted and I'm thankful they're not in my neighborhood .

[rockbilly]

Krocus.  You are so right about the towing capability of the 11/2 ton of today.  I never had any doubt that I could pull a 3600 lb bass boat with a Toyota pickup, but I can sure tell you about stopping a Toyota pickup with a bass boat and all the equipment weighing near the 3600 pound mark.  THE TRUCK JUST DOES NOT STOP. 

When towing any load, at or near, the weight of the truck, the first thing one should ensure is that there are trailer brakes of some type, the second thing, they must be fully aware that the PUSHING momentum will change the stopping distance severely, and if the towed vehicle get off to either side it will have a tendency to flip the smaller truck.

That is speaking from experience, on April 8, 1988 on my way to the lake to pre fish for a tournament I had a vehicle pull out in front of me.  To avoid hitting him broadside in the drivers door I moved to the left and tried to stop, as a result the truck rolled five times, and when it finally came to a stop the Skeeter 175 with a 200HP Merc, trolling motor, three batteries, 35 gallons of gasoline, and tandem axle trailer rammed the back of the truck.  The two hitch came through the window and we would have likely been decapitated had the spring shackle not hung on the tail gate of the pickup stopping the trailer from going any further.

Point, you can pull almost anything with the lighter trucks, the problem is stopping them.

[30-30man]

 The one I looked at had an asking price of over $30,000, that is what made me look at one of the 1/2 tons.  Toyota, Nissan, Ford, Chevy, and Dodge make trucks that are less than the Ridgeline and come with a v-8.  I don't think you need a f350 just to tow a bass boat but if the same money buys a better, heavier truck then I'm all for it.  I own a 1979 Dodge 4wd with a 360 that is stock less the emissions stuff and with 4wdlow, I bet my house any stock Honda would not stand a chance in a pulling contest.  I've pulled up 8-9 inch diameter pine trees with it by the roots using 4low.  I doubt any Honda could do that.  Buy what you want but the Ridgeline falls short when it comes to price vs product. 

[goodwrench6710]

The big problem here is we turned this mans question into our own big debate on what a truck really is & we're not helping him with his question. I saw that he was concerned about a towing package & my point is to be sure that the vehicle is capable of towing what he wants to tow. Just because it has a towing package doesn't mean it can tow huge loads & it's not worth risking your life to save a couple bucks! Don't push the limits to the max. Boats can be some of the worst things to tow, especially into & out of the water.

[Keith L]

"in the long lost past there was a very popular vehicle called an El Camino, They were popular cause they were "enough truck" for the people buying them. The Ridgline fills the same place in the market as the El Camino and Ranchero of old."

I had one in 1980.  I had always wanted one, so I got one and had it about a year.  It was a poor truck, but thats ok because it was an even poorer car.  You could only have three people in it, so it was no good really as a people hauler, and could only haul a few hundred pounds in the back so it fell far short of the mark as a truck.  When I went to sell it I found that they had a cult like following, and almost no one out of the crowd wanted one.  The guy who bought mine had four others.

The El Camino and Ranchero were only good for drinking and chasing women IMHO.  At this point I am not to interested in either so I am not likely to want to get anything that resembles one.  To each their own I guess.

[rockbilly]

I still own two Toyota's, but my current tow vehicle is a Ford, F-250, Crew cab, FX4 with the 6.0 turbo diesel.  I have a much more comfortable ride than the little trucks offer, and still get 22-24 miles to a gallon on the highway provided I keep the RPM below 2k.  I can run about 67-68 MPH by staying right below the 2k line, i get about 14 around town.  I also have a 1993 Toyota 4x4, extended cab, V-6, I have never got better than 18 MPG on the highway, and when I hook a bass boat behind it the mileage drops off to about 10 MPG.  Around town it gets about 15 MPG.

As I said earlier, at one point in my life I was the general manager of a Toyota dealership, the line of vehicles earned my respect as being a quality built product, and I think they continue to build a good product, but the American made vehicles are rapidly catching up, and often priced much less.  There are several American made products that will provide the same longevity the Toyota does provided you take care of them.