Reloading for 30 06

[Buckman]

I've got a Handy rifle in 30 06 and want to start reloading for it. I'm looking for a good load to start out with.  I'm mainly shooting Elk and deer and if I get a draw, possibly moose.  I'm thinking about using 165 grain bullets.  Any help would be appreciated.  I don't have my own reloading equipment yet (can reload at a friends place)  but am  looking at something like the Lee anniversary kit, any suggestions? Thanks.

[wcf3030]

I've used the Lee Anniversary kit for a good 10 years now with no problems.
As for a good bullet choice, there are alot.
I think you will find as your start to reload that you will play around with several different kinds.
I would load separate bullets for the deer. One that would expand more. A top end bullet would be this one http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=396963
I'm a fan of  the Rem cor-lok http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=931003.
For deer there really is a massive amount to choose from but that's what has worked for me.
Use a heavier and more solid bullet for the Elk, and Moose.
I've not hunted either one of these but if I did I'd go with a well constructed bullet with a round nose like http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpage.exe/showproduct?saleitemid=348088

[quickdtoo]

I've not hunted elk with the 30-06, but I've killed a bunch with the 308 Winchester 180gr Rem Core-lokt PSP, they died just as dead as all those I've killed with 180gr Failsafes and Partitions!! I've only worked up one load for my 30-06 Ultracomp using 200gr Partitions and Rl22, it's a very accurate load.

As far as beginning reloading, read the sticky for new handloaders at the top of the Handloading forum.

Tim

http://www.gboreloaded.com/forums/index.php/board,46.0.html

[Dillohide]

165 grain Hornady BT with 57 grains IMR 4350 puts one next to another out of my Winchester Bolt action at 100 yards but not my Handi for some reason. That is a pretty universal 30-06 165 grain load by the way. A lot of people also use 58 grains of IMR 4350 and swear by it. Best load I get for accuracy out of my Handi is 150 grain SP flat based with 57 grains of IMR 4350. That might be a little light for Elk, don't know. It works fine on white tail.

[lonewolf5348]

My 30-06 handi like IMR 3031 44.5 grains and 165 grain hornady SP interlock bullet,from the bench 3 shots just under 7/8" at the 100 yd target
My other load I tried was IMR 4350  54 grains same bullet shoots about 8" lower at the 100 yd target but then again 3 shots in or a tad under 7/8

[db22]

Buckman -- I have used a Lee Challenger press for many years with very good results. You will find that Lee products are made more cheaply than the more expensive brands, but will get the job done for a lot less money. I would advise investing in a really good scale though, the best you can afford,  and a powder trickler, to make your loads as uniform as possible. Stick to the book loads and you'll find that reloading is as much fun as shooting (only a slight overstatement!)

[bearfat]

I got a Lyman T-mag kit about 15 years ago. I'm very satisfied and like the ability to simply turn the turret and work with other dies without readjusting.

http://www.cabelas.com/spodw-1/0037524.shtml

I was concerned the turret would be sloppy and affect accuracy but I have been getting good results with rifle and pistol rounds.

Here's some Hornady 130 SP loads I worked up for coyote in my 30-06 ADL.



I also have a NEF in 30-06 and although I've used Nosler 200 grain Partition for many years in my 30-06's I'm in the process of trying Sierra 220 RN for giggles. The bear in my avatar was taken with the NEF using the Sierra round. After about 5 years of taking some more big game I might be able to tell you which round I prefer and why.

I do prefer heavy bullets...just have had more issues it seems with lighter rounds although sooner or later every round has a hiccup I can't explain.

Still looking for that magic bullet I guess. 

[GrampaMike]

I agree with Dillohide about the Powder IMR-4350. 
In my 30-06 Handi, I shoot Hornady 190gr BTSP (hunting bullet).
My load of 51.1 grains of IMR-4350 with C.O.L. of 3.260" gives me 2507 fps.
10 shot group at 100 makes 1 BIG ragged hole.
I haven't shot Elk with it, but I bet it would be great.
Mike

[safetysheriff]

the only Lee products i've used with success are the Factory Crimp Die and their Shooter program on the DVD.   i bought some Lee Loaders and put 'em in the drawer just in case; but i load with an RCBS RockChucker and either Hornady or RCBS dies and so on.    several years ago a 'tech' at Sierra told me over the phone that Lee products gave their 'callers' more complaints than all the other brands of reloading equipment combined.   i respect Sierra and their products, and would believe that i was told the truth about the complaints heard by their 'techs' over the phone.   i have looked at some of the Lee equipment, like their powder measure and their scale, and think it is cheaply priced because it is marginal equipment.    if it's anywhere near true that "you get what you pay for" then you can understand why some of us stay away from most of the Lee products.   

if i didn't value this hobby so much i'd settle for 'lesser' equipment.   but i don't feel like this hobby deserves second-rate workmanship.

i know others will disagree with this, and may respond in the negative.   but i've told the truth to the best of my knowledge.

best regards,

ss' 

[Buckman]

I'm now well on my way to getting my reloading gear.  I went to a garage sale and picked up a Lyman orange crusher press with primer feeder-$40.00.  A lyman reloading manual, RCBS 2 die set for 3006, funnel, deburring tool, primer tray, powder trickler, 1 full box of 3006 shells and a buch of other little things.  All told I spent a $100.00 even. I love a deal and getting blessed by God makes it all worth while.  All I need now is a good scale.  I'm looking at the RCBS  505 +502 and wonder is there much difference in them as far as quality goes?

[Mac11700]

Your Lyman press is a good one...and should give you many years of good service..Clean the ram rod and lightly lubricate it to ensure it travels freely Also clean & degrease where you snap in your shell holders..a lot of gunk can accumulate in there...Also make sure you have the latest reloading manuals...The current Lyman manual is #48 edition...Powders/primers/bullets change over the years...and you always should use the most current data available..I prefer the 505 over the 502..even though both will work for you...The 505 just has a 3 poise beam as compared to a 2 poise of the 502...and you can be a bit more precise. I suggest getting a good priming tool...like what RCBS makes or even a Lee Auto-prime...I've used them instead of the press actuated ones and like them much more...They are quicker to use and give you a much better feel over seating the primers..

Mac

[Sourdough]

I've killed probably 30 Moose, and with an 06 you want to shoot the minimum of a 180gr bullet.  Most people say you need the 200 or 220 gr ones, but in my openion the 180 is the optimum bullet for the 30-06.  Now if I was hunting Grizzlies or Brown Bears I'd opt for the 220gr Nosler Partition.  But the 180 is what I would carry for Moose. In fact I killed one Moose with a 125gr Varmit load last fall. 

As for powders I get good results with IMR-4350.  Using Winchester Brass, Winchester WLR Primer, and IMR 4350, From the Nosler Manual using any of the six 180gr Nosler bullets (Ballistic Tips, Partitions, and the CT Failsafe) Starting load is 52.5gr of powder.  Maximum load is 56.5.  I'm using 56gr myself, but that may be too much for your particuler gun, every gun is differant.  So start with the light load and work your way up.  Looking for pressure signs as you go up. 

My partner grabbed one of my loads one day and tried to shoot a Caribou with his Handi.  Shot over the Caribou, then could not open his gun.  We had to use a rubber mallet back at the truck to open the gun.  Yet that load works fine through my gun.  Every gun is differant.

 While RL22 gives higher velocities, the IMR powder gives better consistancy under the wider degree of tempatures I experience.   

[safetysheriff]

Your Lyman press is a good one...and should give you many years of good service..Clean the ram rod and lightly lubricate it to ensure it travels freely Also clean & degrease where you snap in your shell holders..a lot of gunk can accumulate in there...Also make sure you have the latest reloading manuals...The current Lyman manual is #48 edition...Powders/primers/bullets change over the years...and you always should use the most current data available..I prefer the 505 over the 502..even though both will work for you...The 505 just has a 3 poise beam as compared to a 2 poise of the 502...and you can be a bit more precise. I suggest getting a good priming tool...like what RCBS makes or even a Lee Auto-prime...I've used them instead of the press actuated ones and like them much more...They are quicker to use and give you a much better feel over seating the primers..

Mac

i work with the 3-poise scale like Mac spoke about, for the same reason.   i just feel it will be more precise.

i also use the RCBS handheld primer, which was a 'gift' for $20 at a gun show last year.   it is a great product.  i think, from experience, that the hand held unit is worth the price for the same reason Mac said.   it's easy to flatten some primers and possibly ruin them with a press.   with the RCBS unit i have good control over the process as when seating CCI small pistol primers recently with WC-820 BULK pistol powder for use in .357 mag' cases.   yes, with other spherical powders i usually use small rifle primers with the .357.   but with the somewhat faster WC-820 i want a better load density and i've achieved it with those milder primers.   i can get very little primer flattening using 13.2 gr's of that powder with 180 gr' Laser Cast bullets out of my Ruger.

incidentally, when seating primers, i do the old trick of seating them and then rotating the brass case a little bit a time or two while re-seating them.   i don't overdue the pressure i put on the primers, i just use the trick to help seat them squarely.

i like the part about how you feel "blessed by God".    that's how i bought my first reloading kit.   i prayed and found one 1/2 price at a show (hardlly used, and half price on each piece, with dies, and some extras then thrown in !)    i then put some money into the "poor box" to tell Him  thanks.

take care,

ss'

[quickdtoo]

incidentally, when seating primers, i do the old trick of seating them and then rotating the brass case a little bit a time or two while re-seating them.   i don't overdue the pressure i put on the primers, i just use the trick to help seat them squarely.

I do that too, dunno if it makes a big difference, but it makes me feel good about it, a little confidence builder if nothing else!! Sometimes I get a little movement on the second press, so not all of em are seated fully or squarely, so I don't think it hurts one bit.

Tim

[safetysheriff]

Quick'

i get a little movement on the 'second press' occasionally it seems.   that makes me think that the extra time is worth it.   i'd hate to lose a chance at harvesting something just because my priming operation was improper!    that would really hurt...........

great minds think alike, hey?

ss'

[MS Mule]

A second loading manual for cross reference is a good idea. My favorite two are the Lyman and the Sierra.

[bearfat]

the only Lee products i've used with success are the Factory Crimp Die

I purchased the Lee crimp die for 30-06 and 25-06 about 4 months ago on a whim. They're still sitting in the plastic case.

safetysheriff what made you get them and what diff if any have you seen with your loads using them?

In theory won't they tighten up variations in velocity which in turn will give better accuracy?

[Mac11700]

In theory won't they tighten up variations in velocity which in turn will give better accuracy?

In theory perhaps..but not always in real life in all cases..

Your loading for a single shot break action..so you really don't need any crimp applied as long as you have a proper bullet pull from resizing your cases.If using the bushing type dies..you can control this process as well... Crimping can at times physically distort the bullets which will induce a-lot of variations in your shot to shot strings and it can also lead to shaving off various amounts of the jacket material which will do the same and cause additional copper fouling in your barrel,not to mention shorten case life as well...If using any of the nickel plated brass..crimping alone will cause premature flaking of the nickel plating which can scratch your dies if your not careful..and best to use a different type expander ..for this I use the Lyman "M" die..it is more gentle on the cases than most standard factory expander's dies..and makes belling the case mouths very even.

There are times when crimping will improve the burn process of certain loads and give better results. I use a Lee careful with all of my 45-70 loads for this purpose..on straight wall cases such as the 45-70 it really will help..but I haven't found any instances of bottle neck cartridges with OTC canister powder where it does help....in the Handi..In guns like the AK's..Garands..and some other semi auto's it is really needed and of course for most bolt actions to keep the bullet in place while in the magazines...

You can always try it and see if it helps or makes things worse..just be aware that any crimp will increase the pressure of the round.

Mac

[quickdtoo]

I crimp all of my loads with the Lee FCD if they make one for it, for $9  it's worth it to me for the extra consistency in shot to shot velocities I think it provides.  I have a test results that you can read if you want, email me for it. 

Tim

[Casull]

the only Lee products i've used with success are the Factory Crimp Die and their Shooter program on the DVD.   i bought some Lee Loaders and put 'em in the drawer just in case; but i load with an RCBS RockChucker and either Hornady or RCBS dies and so on.    several years ago a 'tech' at Sierra told me over the phone that Lee products gave their 'callers' more complaints than all the other brands of reloading equipment combined.   i respect Sierra and their products, and would believe that i was told the truth about the complaints heard by their 'techs' over the phone.   i have looked at some of the Lee equipment, like their powder measure and their scale, and think it is cheaply priced because it is marginal equipment.    if it's anywhere near true that "you get what you pay for" then you can understand why some of us stay away from most of the Lee products.   

if i didn't value this hobby so much i'd settle for 'lesser' equipment.   but i don't feel like this hobby deserves second-rate workmanship.

SS, I'm guessing that when you say that the Crimp Die and DVD are the only Lee products that you've "used with success", you are really saying that they are the only Lee products that you have used.  I've been reloading for about 25 years and nearly all of my equipment is Lee (other than a Lyman scale).  I've been reloading for my 30-06 and .44 mag for those 25 years with the same sets of Lee dies.  The things simply do not seem to wear out.  In fact, I reload 30-06 for my uncle and cousin because they see what my loads have done deer hunting.  Between them, they've taken 8 deer over the last 3 years with my handloads (all one shot kills).  BTW, and to not get completely off the topic of the thread, that load is 56 grains of H414 with the 165 grain Sierra Gameking (its good for MOA or a little better).  I also have a Lee Perfect Powder Measure (you know, the one that costs about twenty bucks) that I have been using for about 15 years to load everything from .223 to .338 Win Mag.  I normally double check my powder throws about every ten rounds or so, and invariably they remain on the mark (not too bad for a $20 measure throwing powder charges anywhere from 4 or 5 grains for 9mm to 65 or 70 grains for .338).  In fact I've only broken one Lee product in those 25 years, and that was my first press (the O frame type) which I broke the handle on after a couple of years, by trying to swage bullets with it (I know, stupid mistake).  Even so, I jerry rigged the handle on it and continued to use it for another ten years after that.  All in all, I have been one very happy Lee customer.

[safetysheriff]

bearfat'

the Lee FCD' does not crimp like so many other crimpers.   it is not a roll crimp, nor a taper crimp.   it appears to combine both procedures without loosening the caseneck hold on the bullet just behind the crimp, like so many crimping dies can do.   those crimping procedures can actually impede accuracy!    

i do NOT crimp any bottleneck cartridges for a single-shot firearm.   that is needless, because there are no other rounds in a magazine, as Mac' pointed out, that could be battered and have their C.O.A.L. changed in the process.  

FWIW:  i crimp every straight-walled cartridge whether for a revolver or for my Marlini lever action.   i would also crimp all such rounds loaded for a Handi'.   i believe such cartridges, and those of a mild taper, require a firm crimp to achieve proper ignition.      i do not use the Lee FCD' for those rounds i'm loading right now, however (.44 and .357 mag's and specials).   they seem to be accurate enough!

Casull: 

i do not consider the Lee Loaders to be a 'successful' application in my experience.   i gave up on them after only one caliber because of the roughness of the die (the Sierras' tech's come back to my mind) and the poor service i received when it was replaced.   i also quit using them because of their neck-sizing-only capability; and their very mild loads....when using the supplied measures.... are not sufficient for what i want out of my choice of cartridges.    (Lee Loaders are a 'last-resort' to me)  i have taken a cue from others with more extensive experience to stay away from Lee, as well.   i admit you've achieved sufficient accuracy for your hunting needs.   my statement, however, is true as it was submitted.   that's why i said, " i have looked at....."    i greatly prefer RCBS, Hornady, and Lyman.   

good hunting and shooting to you,

ss'  

[aulrich]

I'd put the lee classic press toe to to with any other single stage press out there it is unlike and other of the lee presses it is built like a brick outhouse. never had a problem with there dies or trimmers or the auto-prime tool.  Maybe not the most robust tools in some cases (only got 20years out of my challenger) but plenty of gems in their product line.

[safetysheriff]

I'd put the lee classic press toe to to with any other single stage press out there it is unlike and other of the lee presses it is built like a brick outhouse. never had a problem with there dies or trimmers or the auto-prime tool.  Maybe not the most robust tools in some cases (only got 20years out of my challenger) but plenty of gems in their product line.

i apologize but i'm not sure what is meant by your first sentence.   however, i spent approx' $55 dollars buying a used RockChucker about 9 years ago and can't tell you how tough it is.   it is capable, i believe, of swaging bullets, unlike our friend Casull's Lee press.    i have sincerely looked at the scales and measures of the various vendors and don't care for the Lee units.    let's be honest:  how much precision and durability can inexpensively-made tooling and labor provide?   i am sorry, too, but their two-year guarantee does not compare with the service i've heard of/read about from other vendors like RCBS and Hornady. 

i hope the way i said in my earlier post, "....used with success...." does not appear dishonest or misleading.   it certainly was not meant to be.    that's why i also mentioned the phone call to the Sierra techs' and their 'take' on Lee products based upon complaints acknowledged to them.

i don't want to debate this any further, really.   i just think the extra price of Hornady and RCBS is money well spent......based upon my experience and that of others i've known and that i've read about.

ss' 

[quickdtoo]

SS, the Challenger press is an entry level aluminum "O" press, the Lee Classic cast press is an entirely different critter, it's built like a tank in comparison to the Challenger, or any other makes for that matter, it's made of cast iron and steel, capable of loading the 50BMG.

http://www.surplusrifle.com/reviews/leepress/index.asp

As for their 2yr warranty, that's like H&R's 1yr warranty, they honor repair/replacement for a lot longer than the paper says as we all very well know!

Tim

[safetysheriff]

quick'

i am going to acknowledge your greater experience with Lee's present lineup that includes a cast press i've only seen....and not used.   (the Rock Chucker Supreme is capable of bullet swaging, as were the earlier R C's i believe).    i do not care for Lee's verbage calling for 1/2 of a products current retail price to cover reconditioning beyond the 2-year warranty, however, for currently manufactured items.     the RCBS and Hornady websites offer a look at a much better warranty, in my opinion.

i'd compare Lee to a Ssssaaaavvvaaaaa      (one of those rifles!) and RCBS/Hornady to a RUGER!  including their warranty/customer service.

but i think i've already said enough......not wanting to really step on anybody's toes.

take care, tim,

ss' 

[Buckman]

You guys are way off the target here, now you are fighting over equipment instead of giving advice on loads for a 30 06.  I'm looking at cutting down the recoil by going to 165 and being comfortable to shoot my handi more than just occasionally with 180's.  What about loading 120's in it and getting comfortable with it with the lighter loads?  I'm a newbie so bear with me if I'm off the mark here with loads and such

[Mac11700]

You guys are way off the target here, now you are fighting over equipment instead of giving advice on loads for a 30 06.  I'm looking at cutting down the recoil by going to 165 and being comfortable to shoot my handi more than just occasionally with 180's.  What about loading 120's in it and getting comfortable with it with the lighter loads?  I'm a newbie so bear with me if I'm off the mark here with loads and such

Nobody is really fighting...just voicing their opinions on what equipment to use to load the 30-06...

Nothing wrong with going lighter for practice..I personally wouldn't go to the 125 grainers for hunting..even though a-lot of folks do..but I would say try a bunch of different 150 grainers and 165 grainers to see how it shoots and how it feels to ya...You could also grab a box of the 150 grain Federal Fusion factory ammo...and give it a try..I had real good luck with it as far as accuracy goes..

Mac

[Casull]

it is capable, i believe, of swaging bullets, unlike our friend Casull's Lee press.

I wouldn't count on that SS.  At the time I broke the handle on my Lee press (it was the very inexpensive aluminum Challenger press, and I should have known better than to try to swage bullets with it), I also bent the ram on my buddy's Rockchucker using the same swage dies.  Again, you seem to be basing your views on heresay and not on your own experience.  As I said above, my cheap little Perfect Powder Measure is extremely accurate and repeatable.  As to your comparison to the S rifle and the Ruger, I have outshot many Rugers with my 25 year old base model Savage.  Funny thing is, if you look at product reports in the gun mag's, the Savages almost always shoot tighter groups than the Rugers (I have 3 Ruger pistols, which I love, but no rifles).

[Mac11700]

OK...before this gets does into a fight over equipment preferences.....

Let's try to keep this on track for the newbie to reloading for the 30-06 Handi...If you use a particular type of press or dies..for the o6' that is fine....but..let's make our suggestions on the equipment issue and move on...We all have our reasons for using what we do..wither it is from 1st hand experience or from sources we trust..If you want to debate the equipment..let's start another thread and have one...which really wouldn't be a bad thing to do...Everybody has their reasons for what they use..cost..reliability..fit & finish..performance..past problems..& so on...

Thanks

Mac

[burntmuch]

Buckman . This advice is coming from another newbie reloader (me)  .  get 100 150s & 100 165s work up a bunch of different loads for each. See what shoots the best.  I started with IMR4064, 150 grn rem corelocts  Im getting 1 1/2 inch groups,  Gunna try some different powder. Im using the 15 dollar LEE LOADER. & a set of dippers. So the best thing U can do is load some up & go shoot.