Author Topic: Powderkeg's Treatise on Drilling (Read 6816 times)

Powder keg · « **on:** February 23, 2007, 06:48:13 PM »

I'm getting ready to start a new cannon project. As usual I don't have everything I need. In this case it is a long drill bit. While building one I've decided to post photos of what I am doing. This will not necessarily be the best way to proceed, but it is what works for me, with what I've got. I'll include here some info on my "State of Art" "No expense spared" coolant system. Did I mention that this bit will have coolant at the end of the bit, where you need it?

Here is what I'm starting with. it is a piece of 1.250 shaft that is 28" long. Notice the 5/16" drill at the top, It is 25" long. I will start buy drilling a coolant hole through the shaft. I'm going to drill half way through both ways, and meet in the middle.

The drill at the bottom is my prototype.

Later, Wes

GGaskill · « **Reply #1 on:** February 23, 2007, 07:02:32 PM »

What are you going to use for a coolant pump?

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #2 on:** February 24, 2007, 02:48:27 AM »

Quote from: GGaskill on February 23, 2007, 07:02:32 PM

What are you going to use for an coolant pump?

One could use an IV bag, but the pressure would be a bit low. Next step up would be one of the $5 garden fountain pumps. Of course it could be done right with a 3 phase coolant pump that comes with the lathe. But knowing the irrigation pumps that are available in Idaho, Wes may take after Tim the Tool man ....

Powder keg · « **Reply #3 on:** February 24, 2007, 04:15:42 AM »

I'm using a pond pump, like cat said. A friend gave it to me. The pressure could be better, but it has been working really good for me. I've heard of guys hooking a motor to a power steering pump. I might try that someday.

Later, Wes

Powder keg · « **Reply #4 on:** February 24, 2007, 03:51:40 PM »

Would someone be interested in drawing this drill bit up in autocad if I provided a sketch? I was thinking this could go in the plans section

Wes

accuratemike · « **Reply #5 on:** February 24, 2007, 04:44:42 PM »

Wes,
I'll give it a shot. What I have done in the past is to draw it in AutoCad and then screen capture the drawing as a .jpg for the web. I could e-mail you the .dxf or .dwg if you wanted them. MIKE

GGaskill · « **Reply #6 on:** February 24, 2007, 05:21:16 PM »

It's better (smaller file) to save the drawing as a .gif file than a .jpg. The jpg gets fuzzy lines besides being a lot larger. I actually have to save it as a .bmp, then convert the bmp to a gif using an image editor like Paint.

I was thinking about using a gear pump like an automotive oil pump so you could get some real pressure to flush the chips. Drain into a small pan instead of the lathe chip pan. Cascade a couple of pans to settle the fine chips out and then back to the tank with the pump. Keep the pump intake a few inches above the bottom of the tank.

accuratemike · « **Reply #7 on:** February 24, 2007, 05:53:17 PM »

A while back I bought a coolant system from Harbor Freight. It was # 45333. Last time I checked they didn't sell it on-line but had them in the stores. It was around $30 and had a storage bin reservoir with the pump mounted in the lid. If you have a store nearby you might look into it. If your coolant system is total-loss the pond pump works "OK". If you re-circulate, the metal will cause their early demise. The ones we tried had magnetic couplers that filled with filings in no time. real coolant pumps cost too much. We've used a bug sprayer too. Works pretty good. I'll bet you could make an air over water system with a regulator and a jerry-can.

I know what you mean about the .gif vs. .jpg. My screen capture free-ware saves as .jpg, that is usually how I go. I do have PhotoShop and can make .gifs out of them. .gifs scale better too, they don't get all "pixelized".

Tropico · « **Reply #8 on:** February 24, 2007, 06:08:52 PM »

If you like you can just use your windows software ? Simply push the button on your keyboard that says "Print Screen" then open up "Paint" at the top of the paint window will be the word EDIT click that.., scroll down and mouse click PASTE. Then FILE and then SAVE AS then at the bottom of the SAVE window you can choose Monochrome Bitmap .., 16 color Bitmap......, 256 color Bitmap ..,24 bit Bitmap ., .JPG .., GIF ...,TIF ......,. or a PNG.
As a side note any time you use the button Print Screen ., or copy or cut whatever text or image or? that item is temporarily copied onto your clipboard until you either paste it somewhere., re-boot or copy something else. Clipboard is a key file that actually makes windows work within its windows.

It is usually located at C:\WINDOWS\system32\clipbrd.exe and you can make a short cut of it on your desktop if you like ..., and anytime you copy something..., you can see it in there.
(Off to Mexico....,Yaaa-Reeba., Yaa -Reeba . Shrimp tacos and metal work back March 4th)

jeeper1 · « **Reply #9 on:** February 24, 2007, 06:19:29 PM »

As far as coolant goes you might consider a harbor freight solvent tank. $100 currently on sale for $80. They have one that pumps 50 gallons per hour and they should be able to handle less than clean coolant.
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=7340

Powder keg · « **Reply #10 on:** February 24, 2007, 06:46:00 PM »

I've been a bit worried about the pump eating chips. They get everywhere. I might be able to get an old gear pump to try.

I have some more pictures but they are stuck in my picture box. I left it in my shop. I'll try and post them in the morning.

Mike, I'll sketch it up and send you a scan. Thanks!!!

Wes

Double D · « **Reply #11 on:** February 24, 2007, 08:50:32 PM »

I like the cascading tank idea. You could even set it up like a long tom sluice box with oveflow going over a piece of carpeting to collect chips.

Rickk · « **Reply #12 on:** February 25, 2007, 02:09:18 AM »

Something I have not been able to figure out...Where does one buy water soluable oil (like what you will probably be using for this project)?

I havn't found any localy... is there an internet source for it?

Double D · « **Reply #13 on:** February 25, 2007, 02:36:46 AM »

Here's where I go t mine whne I lived in Virginia https://www.travers.com/Default.asp

I got it from Rutland when I lived in Texas http://www.shoprutlandtool.com/

When I lived in Oregon, I got it from a local Machine Shop Supply house.

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #14 on:** February 25, 2007, 02:55:46 AM »

I got my water soluable coolant from the local OIL Company. Then we switched at work and I inherited another 5 gallons. Glad to shae it - shipping is the only issue.

GGaskill · « **Reply #15 on:** February 25, 2007, 08:12:55 AM »

Rustlick soluble cutting oil from Enco. See the bottom right product.

Santa Dave · « **Reply #16 on:** February 26, 2007, 01:31:30 PM »

When our pump at work failed we rigged a volkwagon oil pump with a belt & motor . looked like homemade stuff but worked pretty good! And although we didn't call it cascading tanks that what it was.
Dave

GGaskill · « **Reply #17 on:** February 26, 2007, 02:06:04 PM »

Check out the Allied Machine website. They make spade drills and have lots of useful technical information.

Powder keg · « **Reply #18 on:** February 26, 2007, 05:14:38 PM »

Hey G,

Thanks for that link. Those are the spade drills that I've been using. Looks like I need a bigger lathe and coolant pump to be efficient. Where's that 9hp B&S engine thats lying around here. I could hook that up to my coolant pump

I've got a few more pictures, I'll try to get them up tomorrow. It takes time to clean them up and reduce their size. I have most of the lathe work done. I'll have it in the mill next.

Wes

Powder keg · « **Reply #19 on:** February 28, 2007, 01:36:51 PM »

Here are a couple more pictures. I started with 1.250 shaft, because thats what I had. The first step I do is to face off the end of the shaft. Notice that the shaft is being held in a steady rest. Next use a center drill to start the hole. this is an important step. if the hole doesn't start straight, there is no way it will end up in the center of the shaft.

Then I went in with a standard length, sharp 5/16" drill. If you don't know how to sharpen a drill, learn! It is an important skill to know if you are running a lathe. After I get to depth with the standard length drill I switched to one that was 24" long. I pecked in 14" from each end and met in the middle. "Pecking" is drilling a bit then pulling out to clear the chips out. I could get 2 turns on my tailstock hand wheel before the chips started catching.

It took me 2 hours to drill through the 28" shaft.

Later, Wes

Powder keg · « **Reply #20 on:** February 28, 2007, 01:51:22 PM »

After I had the coolant hole drilled. I started on the outside of the drill. I machined the head to diameter and then started in on the shank. I turned it to 3/4". it has to be pretty precise near where you chuck on it, because of the seals. Here is a picture of that.

I then drilled the head out a bit more for a depth of 1". This will let the coolant come around the clamp screw. Its easer to do this now before the slot for the spade bit is cut. After that it's off to the mill. I used a height gauge to find the center of the shaft. then I centered the milling cutter to the shaft. This way the spade bit will be in the center of the shaft.

Back to the shop, Wes

Powder keg · « **Reply #21 on:** February 28, 2007, 03:18:14 PM »

After I got the cutter centered, I could start cutting the slot for the spade. I took .125" deep cuts till I was .700 deep.

I then used an edge finder and located where the bolt hole wanted to live. I then centerdrilled, drilled, tapped, and counterbored the drill bit.

After I was done with that I de-burred the end and test fit everything. Looks good.

You can see where the coolant will come out now. Right on the cutting edge:O) Some holders have flutes milled on the head. My prototype worked good without them.

Later, Wes

seacoastartillery · « **Reply #22 on:** March 01, 2007, 07:29:43 PM »

Wes,

We are really interested in your progress here. Looks like a very capable tool. How big is the hole it will drill? What material will be drilled? How deep are you drilling? Mike and I are thinking of putting together a British Naval gun of around 2 or 2.25" this summer and we really think this method of metal removal looks good.

Nice photos, very clear.

Regards,

Mike and Tracy

Cannonmaker · « **Reply #23 on:** March 02, 2007, 06:35:47 AM »

Wes, I have been wanting to build a holder myself for deep drilling. What material did you use for the shaft?

It looks good.

Rick

Powder keg · « **Reply #24 on:** March 04, 2007, 06:42:36 AM »

Thanks for the interest in my drill. Sorry for the delay in getting back. I've been sick the last few days. Feeling a little better now though:O)

For this project, I'm drilling 1.5" about 22" deep. The material will be stainless and Bronze. I've drilled 2.5" holes with spade drills with good results. The holder is made out of 1018 steel. The first one I built didn't have coolant. After drilling about 6" deep the chips started causing problems. I knew that I needed coolant. The second prototype has coolant the fitting is welded to the shank. I've been worried about the drill breaking here? So on this drill I'm building a king of swivel coupling into the design. If I feel good enough today I'll post some more pictures as they become available.

One thing I've found is that spade drills don't like pilot holes. This makes my job faster:O)

Wes

seacoastartillery · « **Reply #25 on:** March 04, 2007, 07:57:48 AM »

Wes,

Hope you feel tip-top real soon. Thanks so much for that info. You already answered our fourth question about a pilot drill. I think we will hit it with a #5 center-drill to about .400" dia. and run the spade in slowly. We think that a 43% english 12 Pdr. will be our first exercize using this drilling method, a 2" gun. We have a 6.75" dia., 30" long round of 1026 gathering moss which should do just fine. We will continue to follow this thread. Very clear method. Thanks.

Mike and Tracy

Powder keg · « **Reply #26 on:** March 04, 2007, 10:47:07 AM »

I hope I feel better soon also. My wife wouldn't let me go out and play today:O( She dosen't want me to get sick again. She probably knows best though.

I always start with a centerdrill. Sometimes the drill wobbles till it's sides touch the hole. The first hole I did I used a pilot drill and the spade bit chattered clear to the bottom. As long as you have coolant to clear the chips you should be able to drill pretty deep with these. One neat thing to mention is that the chips break into little pieces letting them flow out with the coolant.

You'll have to re dimension the bit to match the bit you get. I think You'll be a size bigger.

Double D · « **Reply #27 on:** March 04, 2007, 04:05:36 PM »

So if I understand this correctly you do start the hole with a center drill. The dril is gonna make noise untiil it clears the center drill hole and then things will be fione...correct?

Terry C. · « **Reply #28 on:** March 05, 2007, 01:08:58 AM »

I've used spade drills in manufacuring logging equipment.

They chatter when they are starting, even with a pilot hole, it's just their nature.

Once the spade starts taking a full cut it will smooth out.

Of course 'smooth' is a relative term. I'm assuming Wes will be cleaning up the bore after the spade is run. Spades are great for stock removal, but don't leave a pretty hole.

We would use the spade to get the hole to rough size, then run a shell reamer through to cut the bore to finished diameter. Most of these were in the 3"-4" range.

Powder keg · « **Reply #29 on:** March 06, 2007, 04:57:06 PM »

I can't seem to shake this darn Cold

The seals for the swivel coupler arrived today. I'll get that part built tomorrow. I also got the shank end done tonight. I'll get pictures of that up then to.

I found the plans for a gun reamer. they were used during WW2 to ream out 16" gun barrels to take the liners that were used. I'm planing on building a scaled down version of that. Kap Pullen sent me some pictures of one that he had built ounce. I'll see if I can find those also.

Later, Wes