Author Topic: Brady's calling your bolt action gun a "Sniper Rifle" (Read 6372 times)

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #30 on:** February 21, 2007, 04:32:10 PM »

billy_56081, I would not waste my time , some people don't deserve the platform.

An idiot out in the open, is better then one in the closet.

MI VHNTR · « **Reply #31 on:** February 21, 2007, 04:52:03 PM »

Quote from: NONYA on February 21, 2007, 12:52:15 PM

There are already plenty of rifles RESTRICTED from big game hunting,like the 22lr,17 hmr,ect ect,I dont see this having any impact on ANYONES right to own them,you use the big BAN word to make a hunting reg sound evil,there is nothing wrong with having restrictions on the calibers hunted with when somthing like the 50 bmg enters the field.Trying to turn a hunting reg into a 2nd amendment issue will get you nowhere,by your thinking the 22lr has been "banned" for years now,everyone still owns one or more and it didnt fuel the antis attempts to take guns away,your theroy of a hunting reg helping the antis is a FARCE.How many of you are going to show up in Id or MT when the F&G holds thier public input meeting on this issue,none of you,and you know it.If you really want to make a difference do what you can to get republicans to vote,it has been proven that the anti/dem voting pool turns out a higher percentage every year.

Whether or not someone comes to Montana is not the issue here. The issue here is banning, oops "restricting", a cartridge and weapon because it's "not suitable" in the field, according to YOUR definition. In this case, the play on words still accomplishes the same thing. Restrict or ban, they both eliminate the cartridge and weapon for hunting use. There's not a thing about it that's makes it a farce either. It's the cold, hard truth. If you really think that bans, oops restrictions, are the answer, maybe you should invite zumBONE for a hunt with you. That's only if you both can come up with a suitable weapon, and caliber, which suits the both of your restrictions. Divide and conquer, it's the anti-gun way. NRA Endowment Member. MI VHNTR

Edited to add the following link: http://themartialist.com/0207/zumbo.htm

NONYA · « **Reply #32 on:** February 21, 2007, 05:22:23 PM »

Bla Bla Bla,same rant different day,I am not alone in my opinion and Im willing to bet that when the issue is up for the vote more hunters who dont want to see the 50bmg will voice thier opinion than those who do,I have recieved Pms from members who feel as I do but dont want to suffer your attacks,not every single hunter is EVER going to agree 100% on every issue on the off chance that thier opinion may inspire some anti group to twist the facts in thier favor.We live in a democracy and most hunting reg changes are passed on a majority vote,until recently this wasnt even an issue but a small group of hunters have made it an issue and now we need change.Maybe you should be more concerned about those who have made it an issue rather than those who dont agree with you on the issue.Thats one of the most valuable things we have as an American,the right to voice our opinions and vote our mind,i have voiced mine and if some of you are so upset about it that you feel the need to make personal attacks then I feel sorry for you,you really have lost touch with what America is all about.You guys have fun now I dont think there is any point in continuing this debate.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #33 on:** February 21, 2007, 05:30:58 PM »

MI VHNTR, Outstanding read. I think it was well written and to the point. That web-site said it all.

manofthe45 · « **Reply #34 on:** February 21, 2007, 05:58:08 PM »

Quote from: dukkillr on February 21, 2007, 02:24:28 PM

No .17 rimfire for elk? YOU MUST BE A CARD CARRYING LIBERAL LOVING ANTIGUNNING BRANDY BUNCH MEMBERING FAIRY!

Hey I am a member of the BRANDY bunch and the single malt bunch, sour mash bunch, almost forgot the grey goose bunch, but the BRADY bunch. NEVER.

[

Mikey · « **Reply #35 on:** February 22, 2007, 12:30:19 AM »

Folks, look - the anti's base their precedent on use. If there is no use for something (somewhere, like the 17hmr in Elk hunting) they can base their precedent (for banning it) on its use.

zumbo says there is no use for AKs or ARs in the hunting field, so the antis base their precedent for banning it on its lack of use in the hunting field.

Any rifle that can fire military ammunition (it is opined) can be used in subversive/insurgent warfare. Snipers can shoot military personnel and take their weapons and ammunition and use them, especially the ammunition in their sniper rifles, against other soldiers. Those rifles should be bannned.

Please understand that if they can establish 'usefulness' (thanks to people like zumbo) they can base their precedent for banning it on that use.

Since there is no hunting within city limits, they can establish the precedent to ban rifles of any caliber or hunting caliber handguns, on use. This precedent has already been established and it is just a matter of time before they come to confiscate those firearms. It is already here. Mikey.

nomosendero · « **Reply #36 on:** February 22, 2007, 04:10:50 AM »

Quote from: Mikey on February 22, 2007, 12:30:19 AM

Folks, look - the anti's base their precedent on use. If there is no use for something (somewhere, like the 17hmr in Elk hunting) they can base their precedent (for banning it) on its use.

zumbo says there is no use for AKs or ARs in the hunting field, so the antis base their precedent for banning it on its lack of use in the hunting field.

Any rifle that can fire military ammunition (it is opined) can be used in subversive/insurgent warfare. Snipers can shoot military personnel and take their weapons and ammunition and use them, especially the ammunition in their sniper rifles, against other soldiers. Those rifles should be bannned.

Please understand that if they can establish 'usefulness' (thanks to people like zumbo) they can base their precedent for banning it on that use.

Since there is no hunting within city limits, they can establish the precedent to ban rifles of any caliber or hunting caliber handguns, on use. This precedent has already been established and it is just a matter of time before they come to confiscate those firearms. It is already here. Mikey.

Well said!

The min. cartridge restriction has to do with humane kills only, & is brought up as a Liberal style diversion only. And their use is not threatened by
this as they have Varmit uses, this has absolutly NOTHING to do with this discussion & we all know it.

Yes Mikey, the anti's base their presedent on use, we ALL know that too. Unlike the illrelevant for the discussion min. cal. restriction, the max. cal. restriction damns the 50cal, wildcat's based on it, or any cartridge that some think are big, because when you ban them from Big Game,then you sure don't need them for Varmits & the anti's then will simply say that they have no sporting purpose, therefore they must be banned from private ownership. Yes, we ALL know that also, now don't we?
So, when JZ said that the AR has no place in the hunting field, then in the mind of an anti, the reason for ownership has been removed. It logically
follows that the same logic will be used on the 50 cal. when you say the same thing.

So, think about it, please. When JZ says the AR has no place in the hunting field & someone on GB or any other sporting web site says that the 50cal. has no place in the hunting World, the effect will be the same. If not, I would like to see the reason why it would not be!!

Mac11700 · « **Reply #37 on:** February 22, 2007, 07:00:15 AM »

Quote

JMO. everyone read that. MY OPINION. Min. cal are needed to ensure the clean kill of your target animal.

Yes...you are intitiled to your opinion on this...everyone is...but...the point most here have failed to take into account is that by saying your in favor of these type restrictions...the anti's will take it as a fact that every hunter does...This is how they do things to get legislation passed...This is why many of us come unglued when our own take their position on this issue...The majority of us who post on these forums are responsible hunters...we know when to take the long shot...and when not to as well...We also know what caliber to use...and when to use it ...What the anti's love is when a group of hunters start posting about their dislike for a way certain individuals hunt..what caliber they use..and the ranges they hunt at...It gives them a leg up to legitimize their twisted agenda...

No individual or group has the right to tell another man what rifle he should be allowed to use...or what yardage he is allowed to shoot If an individual wantonly wounds animals and leaves them lay..PROSECUTE THE INDIVIDUAL...not everyone...Why....The Second Amendment is about an INDIVIDUALS RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS....muddying the waters with rifle caliber restrictions does nothing but aid the states in a preempting the INDIVIDUALS RIGHT...Somehow folks have it in the head that the flood gates will be open a thousand of would be hunters will flock to the hills and start blasting away with rim fires on elk & deer..if caliber restrictions or fire arm restrictions aren't in place....PLEASE...give me a break

Hunter education classes are mandated for these new hunters...and should be required for everyone...Educate all the hunters...and prosecute those individuals who screw up...not everybody because of the few ignorant people in the world...

I don't want the states or the federal government telling what I can do...I am not a sheep person....and I don't need or want to hunt or shoot by some one else's leave

Mac

Skunk · « **Reply #38 on:** February 22, 2007, 09:47:07 AM »

Reading that blog was very disheartening. Those communist left-wingers should just stay in bed all day and hope the roof doesn't fall in on them. Pathetic.

NONYA · « **Reply #39 on:** February 22, 2007, 10:49:00 AM »

Do any of you honestly believe that 1 persons opinion posted on a thread at GBO is going to influence the Antis work?NEVER HAPPEN.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #40 on:** February 22, 2007, 11:20:46 AM »

Quote from: NONYA on February 22, 2007, 10:49:00 AM

Do any of you honestly believe that 1 persons opinion posted on a thread at GBO is going to influence the Antis work?NEVER HAPPEN.

You said it, and you defend your statement. Look at the power of the Internet. This is an open Forum open even to the Anti's.
Don't down play what you said, it was as big in my book as what Zumbo said.

NONYA · « **Reply #41 on:** February 22, 2007, 11:53:53 AM »

Redhawk Im now convinced you ARE living in a fantasy world,ill bet its fun there huh?

victorcharlie · « **Reply #42 on:** February 22, 2007, 12:17:40 PM »

L-I-B-E-R-T-Y

1 : the quality or state of being free: a : the power to do as one pleases b : freedom from physical restraint c : freedom from arbitrary or despotic control d : the positive enjoyment of various social, political, or economic rights and privileges e : the power of choice

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #43 on:** February 22, 2007, 01:57:35 PM »

I am done arguing this point. NONYA, lets just agree to disagree. My head hurts just thinking about this anymore.

NONYA · « **Reply #44 on:** February 22, 2007, 02:30:28 PM »

I was done Redhawk,UNTIL you and your minion AKA Billy brought my name up in FIVE threads about JZ and 2nd Amendment rights,I would be more than happy to have it done again.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #45 on:** February 22, 2007, 04:47:44 PM »

Well them we agree to disagree, I am done.

NONYA · « **Reply #46 on:** February 22, 2007, 05:13:45 PM »

agreed

manofthe45 · « **Reply #47 on:** February 22, 2007, 05:57:30 PM »

Mac,

You have me thinking. My min cal. comment was made more for the continued reference to rimfires, but you may be correct. I have modified my post till I have time to rethink my statements.

For the record even if I do not believe something is humane or ethical if it is LEGAL I will defend it.

Slamfire · « **Reply #48 on:** February 22, 2007, 06:55:06 PM »

Quote from: NONYA on February 21, 2007, 01:52:29 PM

There are plenty of hunters who do believe the .50 bmg isnt a hunting round,does that make them anti hunters or gun grabbers?They will twist facts and misrepresent any regulation there is to further thier cause.Having an anything goes attitude towards hunting regs because the antis might try to use the regs in thier propaganda isnt going to fly with me.They will find "experts" to back thier play regardless of what they want to "prove".Im not willing to cowtow to them by playing the anything goes ticket,we need regulation in hunting and its not going to take guns away from people,a senate and congress full of dems is.

What about my .50, .54, and .56 muzzleloaders will they be exempted from the ban, or just included through ignorance?

Mac11700 · « **Reply #49 on:** February 22, 2007, 07:23:08 PM »

Quote

we need regulation in hunting

Only on the amount of game taken perhaps..and the times and duration of the hunts...but not on what rifle I should use...or the distance I can shoot at.......Thank You NO...I don't need any state or branch of the federal government telling me what I should use......I will abide by their laws...but you can bet your last dollar I will continue fighting to keep out more assine regulations that encroach on my liberties...

What we do need is more hunter education...and more hunters practicing at the distances they elect to hunt at ...What we don't need is a bunch of self righteous morons trying to ram down out throats more regulations...and the people who feel the need to be regulated...well...I think most know how I feel about them...

manofthe45...It shows your a thinking man....who evaluates both sides...Good for you

Mac

NONYA · « **Reply #50 on:** February 22, 2007, 07:52:27 PM »

If you want to use a 50 bmg anti light vehicle round to shoot a deer at 1000 yards go ahead,but dont expect me to like it or agree that it is a sporting or safe way of hunting just because its legal,how far do you think that fmj round goes after it passes through a deer or elk,another mile?.It plays into the hands of the anti hunters and portrays hunting and hunters exactly as they would like people to see it.If this new trend hadnt been splashed across magazine covers and hunting shows it wouldnt be an issue,but now everyone is talking about it and the state F&G commisions are going to do thier best to squash it.It wasnt the guy like me that doesnt like it that brought it to thier attention it was the guys doing it and making sure everyone hears about it,THEY are thier own worst enemy,I dont propose reg changes or sit on the commision that votes,but I will share my opinion when the issue arises and I dont give a damn what anyone in an online forum thinks about it.

nomosendero · « **Reply #51 on:** February 23, 2007, 02:07:01 AM »

Apparantly, JZ didn't care what people thought either until he saw what it would do to his wallet. Not caring what people think explains why you keep talking about it even when you know that saying a 50 has no place in the hunting World has the same effect
as JZ saying that the AR has no place in hunting. Yes, we get it that you don't care & since it won't effect your wallet like it did with Zumbo, I am sure you will continue to flap your jaw about it. GBO has a large audience & the conversations spread to Predator Masters & the other forums. So, we go from a couple of hundred thousand that see it & those viewers going to other forums & talking to people on the street & the number easily changes to a couple of million. Not a biggie though, just the price we ALL
need to pay because some fat boys made a guy mad. And these boys are their own worst enemy, but we would have never heard of them at a National level if it weren't for this forum. I am glad they are their own worst enemy.

I am surprised that FMJ bullets are legal in MT. If they are, then they could be used in 30-06, 308, 7X57, etc. Just because someone uses a 50 BMG does not mean he is useing a FMJ.

Lawful Larry · « **Reply #52 on:** February 23, 2007, 03:03:54 AM »

Quote from: NONYA on February 22, 2007, 07:52:27 PM

I will share my opinion when the issue arises and I dont give a damn what anyone in an online forum thinks about it.

A bit of advise there pally, when you find yourself in a hole I suggest you stop digging.

Cement Man · « **Reply #53 on:** February 23, 2007, 04:15:40 AM »

LL,

This discussion IS the hole that you are talking about.

This issue isn't going anywhere here but sarcasm and nastiness.

No light at the end of this tunnel.

Everybody's said their piece.

The one's that haven't don't want to get caught up in the crap.

Why keep it up?

Lawful Larry · « **Reply #54 on:** February 23, 2007, 05:03:37 AM »

Your right Cement Man. Sometimes I get so caught up in the moment, I can't control myself.

I guess I will go out and make some more bullets.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #55 on:** February 23, 2007, 05:13:20 AM »

Cement Man, some times we find it hard to just sit back and say nothing. Sometimes we get caught up in the moment, and we say or post what is on our minds without regard to others.

It is apparent form the reaction to Zumbo's foot in mouth, that others need to see the ramification of what they say about guns and hunting issues. To some it is not a big deal to talk about gun or hunting related issues. But to some it is a big deal. I think we as gun owners and hunters, we need to challenge other that want to stand outside the normal thinking.

I just ask people to think long and hard before they post something that may look as if they are supporting any anti gun or anti hunting issues. It is a very fine line some people walk.

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #56 on:** February 23, 2007, 05:15:45 AM »

Quote from: Lawful Larry on February 23, 2007, 05:03:37 AM

Your right Cement Man. Sometimes I get so caught up in the moment, I can't control myself.

I guess I will go out and make some more bullets.

I think it is fine to get caught up in the moment. Some issues need to be addressed and not left unchallenged.

NONYA · « **Reply #57 on:** February 23, 2007, 10:15:56 AM »

Seems i am the only one here with first hand experience with these "hunters" so I will take that into consideration,none of you have to run into these guys in the woods,you have no contact with them and know nothing about them.They ARE using fmj bullets and its not illegal in MT,so hey its ok RIGHT?The reason it has been drug back out and spread to other threads is the guys that cant get over it keep bringing it up and MI HNTR even restarted it on another forum,if spreading it out for everyone to see is doing any damage thats YOUR fault,those of you that wont let it go.Never heard about them on a national level?there are magazine and online articles about similar "hunters" all over.The one article in one of the big hunting rags talked about a guy taking one to Africa and missing 20+ times before he finally hit somthing at 1000 yards,thats great publicity for the sport.You want to keep the issue quiet?Why?There are a lot of hunters in my area that feel the same way i do,most of the hunters in my family feel this way,I think you will find yourselves outnumbered if it did come to a vote and Im willing to bet that if they base thier vote on the public coment it will pass in any state its propossed in.If they do pass it people will still be able to own them,shoot them and hunt predators and varmits with them anywhere they want,its not a gun control issue its a hunting issue and it has nothing to do with 2nd amendment rights.If any of you hunt with one,know people who do or hunt in an area where there are peo-ple hunting BG with them id like to hear from ya.YOU MAY THINK iM IN A HOLE BUT YOU ARE SADLY MISTAKEN,I AM ONE OF MANY BUT ONE OF THE FEW THAT ARE WILLING TO WITHSTAND YOUR ATTITUDES AND SPEAK MY MIND,ITS EASY TO BE ONE OF THE GANG AND TAKE CHEAPSHOTS,IM MORE THAN WILLING TO TAKE YOUR BS IN ORDER TO HAVE BOTH SIDES OF THIS ISSUE REPRESENTED,YOU CANT RUN ME OFF.

MI VHNTR · « **Reply #58 on:** February 23, 2007, 11:06:38 AM »

Quote from: NONYA on February 23, 2007, 10:15:56 AM

The reason it has been drug back out and spread to other threads is the guys that cant get over it keep bringing it up and MI HNTR even restarted it on another forum,if spreading it out for everyone to see is doing any damage thats YOUR fault,those of you that wont let it go.Never heard about them on a national level?there are magazine and online articles about similar "hunters" all over.The one article in one of the big hunting rags talked about a guy taking one to Africa and missing 20+ times before he finally hit somthing at 1000 yards,thats great publicity for the sport.You want to keep the issue quiet?Why?There are a lot of hunters in my area that feel the same way i do,most of the hunters in my family feel this way,I think you will find yourselves outnumbered if it did come to a vote and Im willing to bet that if they base thier vote on the public coment it will pass in any state its propossed in.If they do pass it people will still be able to own them,shoot them and hunt predators and varmits with them anywhere they want,its not a gun control issue its a hunting issue and it has nothing to do with 2nd amendment rights.If any of you hunt with one,know people who do or hunt in an area where there are peo-ple hunting BG with them id like to hear from ya.YOU MAY THINK iM IN A HOLE BUT YOU ARE SADLY MISTAKEN,I AM ONE OF MANY BUT ONE OF THE FEW THAT ARE WILLING TO WITHSTAND YOUR ATTITUDES AND SPEAK MY MIND,ITS EASY TO BE ONE OF THE GANG AND TAKE CHEAPSHOTS,IM MORE THAN WILLING TO TAKE YOUR BS IN ORDER TO HAVE BOTH SIDES OF THIS ISSUE REPRESENTED,YOU CANT RUN ME OFF.

Who is attempting to "run you off?" You've had my posts here disagreeing with your stance pulled off of this site and have bragged about it. It appears that YOU want to run others off, unless they mindlessly follow your way of thinking. This is causing damage? Perhaps you might need to rethink the issue with a little more caution, and using a bit more wisdom.

However, you've said the following: "I will share my opinion when the issue arises and I dont give a damn what anyone in an online forum thinks about it." It's pretty apparent that you don't care to hear the other side of any issue concerning anything. If this doesn't work, you can always have the posts removed so that your side is the only version left for anyone to read. So, if I can't express my opinion here, sobeit. BTW, I know people that hunt with the 50 BMG and they're all great guys. MI VHNTR

The Second Amendment isn't about hunting. It's about Freedom.
NRA Endowment Member

NONYA · « **Reply #59 on:** February 23, 2007, 11:43:31 AM »

ITS NOT ILLEGAL HERE NOMO!So it ok right?"if its legal its ok with me"I have shot thier rifles,thier honcho lives right next door and his range parallels mine,they use milt surplus rounds they buy at a local gun shop.One of them reloads,the rest us the surplus stuff.Ive never gone into the field with them but they told me thats what they use.Read before you rant,i explained that it was legal in the last post.So shame on me?ROFL!Now you try to make me out to be unlawful?You are realy scraping the bottom of the bucket in your attempt to paint me in a bad light.I can only asume that by labeling me an anti and a treating me like the scum of the earth you dont want me around,or is this how you make people feel at home?MI after your little stunt over at PM you are on my ignore list...