My Accuracy with the 460 S&W

[reallybigfoot]

I’m sure all revolvers are more accurate than I am, but this 460 S&W gives me hope. 

I have the 8 3/8 barrel, an Elite 3200 2x6 scope, and Weigand mount and 4 rings.  I’m loading 49 gr of H110 behind 240 gr XTP/MAGs.  Sitting down using Steady Sticks, I put 5 shots in 2 inches at 50 yards and 10 shots in 5 inches at 100 yards.  6 of the 10 shots were in a 1 ½ inch group.  With practice I’m sure both groups will shrink.

I am working on a cast load for practice.  I have Lee molds for 340 gr, 405 gr hb, and 500 gr .458 bullets.  I pour them with Linotype, size them to .452, and load them with H4198.  They are not as accurate as the JHPs but they’re close.  Maybe with more work on the loads and practice, they will get better.  The 405 gr HB is the most accurate at 100 yards.

Jerry

[Redhawk1]

Glad to see you are having a ball with the 460 Mag.


I think you need to look at your load though. Hodgdon's lists the max load for the 240 gr. Hornady XTP MAG at 48.5 gr.  of H110.

http://www.hodgdon.com/data/pistol/460swmag.php

[waynemorgan]

i shot 47.5 of the h110 in my 5 inch and though it would brake my arm ,but that is just me .after a few rounds every thing hurts (this disabled stuf sucks)

[reallybigfoot]

An article in Handloader magazine has the maximum load of 49 gr of H110.  I did work up to this load and saw no signs of pressure.  

The interesting thing is my 454 load has more recoil.  I didn’t check the velocity.   I wonder if it is as high?

Jerry
 

[Redhawk1]

An article in Handloader magazine has the maximum load of 49 gr of H110.  I did work up to this load and saw no signs of pressure.  

The interesting thing is my 454 load has more recoil.  I didn’t check the velocity.   I wonder if it is as high?

Jerry
 

Let me see, who would I trust more with load data, the powder maker or gun rag writer?? I think I would stick with the powder maker. But to each his own.  JMHO

[reallybigfoot]

Why?  An anonymous person putting in hours at a job he may not even like.  Compared to a person who puts his name on his work.  How many times have you seen the load data by powder makers change from year to year?  Half a grain of powder, with the pressure about 25% below max.  I think I’ll live life on the edge and go with that extra half grain.

Jerry

[Graybeard]

An article in Handloader magazine has the maximum load of 49 gr of H110.  I did work up to this load and saw no signs of pressure.

Did the bullets exit the barrel? If so that's an excellent sign of pressure. There is NO WAY you can see or feel or hear the change from safe to unsafe. If you think you can you're fooling only yourself.

Now as to whether it's a safe load or not I'll not speculate as I think the entire concept of the round is ridiculous and will leave that to those of you who feel differently. But I do agree that 1/2 grain at that load level ain't likely gonna hurt anyone. Still relying on what you THINK are pressure signs and ignoring manufacturer load recommendations has gotten more folks in trouble than anything else other than pure carelessness. There are no magic things to look for, anyone who tells you otherwise is not to be trusted in other matters as well. 

[reallybigfoot]

I did leave out the word excessive didn’t I?

It is difficult to know what to believe.  I’ve read that you should reduce the max load by 10% and work up to the max while looking for signs of excessive pressure.  Then the next article I read states if I see signs of excessive pressure I am way over the safe load.  Then along comes a powder like H110, which is said to be unsafe if reduce by 10%, but different manuals have max loads that vary by more than 10%.  The more I read, the more I wonder about it all. 

If it was too predictable it probably wouldn’t be as interesting.

Jerry

[Redhawk1]

reallybigfoot, Hodgdon was the first real load data for the 460 Mag. They did a lot of research in load development and releasing there data to us hand loaders. There is a listed starting level and a max level. I started loading at the starting level and worked up until I found the load the performed the most accurate in my gun, it happened to be the max load that Hodgdon lists.

As far as only being 1/2 a gr. over the max load, where does a 1/2 gr. over become to much. Sometimes it may be the factor of the load max or over. I was just trying to help, but it's your gun, hand and face. Enjoy.

[Graybeard]

These days the folks who develop load data and publish loading manuals, the bullet makers and the powder makers all use good reliable pressure measuring equipment. But from there there is really no true similarity in what they do and how they do it.

Some use pressure barrels made to absolute minimum standards, some use off the shelf rifles. Some detail the brand of primers, cases, bullets and powder. Some don't. But even if they do our lots of those components are NOT gonna be the same as theirs. There is a big difference lot to lot at some times in all those components. Tolerances can stack up on you.

If your cases even if the same brand are a bit thicker than theirs, if your primers are a wee bit hotter than theirs, if your powder is just a tad faster than theirs, if your bullet is a bit differnt and causes more pressure....then the result can easily be a blown up gun using book data.

Sadly there is just no good reliable indicator that this is gonna happen even if you start low and work up. Flat primers really only tell you that the primer is flat, nothing more. It can happen well below safe pressures or it might not happen even at pressures that will in time take apart your gun. Same for measuring case head expansion, it's just not as simple or as reliable as folks want you to belive. Sticky extraction? Might be any one of dozens of reasons and pressure is but one of them and how much does it take anyway? Nope there is no way to KNOW or even make an educated guess. That's why the books say start low and work up. BUT work up how? With the use of a good chrono of course.

Velocity generally correlates reasonably well with pressure. More pressure means more velocity. So when you reach the velocity the books say to expect or you reach the amount of powder they used STOP rat now. Tread no further. That's the safest approach you can take to reloading. It's not 100% either but is better than any other approach to being safe.

The one thing too many have failed to learn yet is that another 100 or even 200 fps is of no real importance in the real world of hunting. It buys you nothing of value. Oh sure it might get you 1/2" flatter trajectory at 300 or 400 yards but who the heck can see or shoot under field conditions well enough to make use of it? Besides if it's that bit a deal to you use a more sleek bullet and gain an inch rather than 1/2" and do it at the lower pressures and velocity. Foot pounds of Kinetic engery? Don't get me started on that again. It's PAPER energy not real world work energy. You only need enough to cause the bullet to expand and penetrate. It's the biggest lie perpetuated by writers so far. Some of them are finally coming out of the closet and admitting it even.

[simplicity]

I will add this I aggree with both redhawk and graybeard, I will add this with loading data ( I know I'm gonna catch flak for saying this but I feel it's true) honestly you can go a bit more then what is posted due to liability clauses if you choose to it's your choice, with the new calibers you can't go as far beyond max as you could with older calibers in new firearms.  But due to liabilitys loading manuals are loaded down pretty much for people like you reallybigfoot and like myself. I like to push the envelope just as much as anyone. Is 1/2 grain gonna matter in a max load? maybe not in a 460 or a 500 but in a 32 hr yes it definetly does. I'll finish with this redhawk said it best it's your gun your hand your life.

[Keith L]

"it's your gun your hand your life"

While this is true enough, and aren't likely to affect anyone else when talking around the campfire, out here in cyber space that can be read by anyone.  I wonder about the affect of talking about going over max charges when read by someone who is already sloppy with their reloading, or may take liberties with the next load etc.  I think we need to be careful what behavior we encourage.  And we can't prevent all fools from blowing themselves up.  But we don't want to encourage them either.

[Redhawk1]

"it's your gun your hand your life"

While this is true enough, and aren't likely to affect anyone else when talking around the campfire, out here in cyber space that can be read by anyone.  I wonder about the affect of talking about going over max charges when read by someone who is already sloppy with their reloading, or may take liberties with the next load etc.  I think we need to be careful what behavior we encourage.  And we can't prevent all fools from blowing themselves up.  But we don't want to encourage them either.

I look at it like this, we all can tell someone to be careful and they should not do something. But telling them it is "it's your gun your hand your life" does not give anyone consent or encouragement to do it.

But in the same token, we can't stop someone form being foolish enough to try.