Author Topic: .454 or .480, that is the Question? (Read 5972 times)

crow_feather · « **Reply #30 on:** December 30, 2006, 05:34:32 AM »

The stuck cases in the SRH have to do with the cylinder material and the smothness of the cylinder walls so I have been told. Ruger does a great job of taking care of the problem without cost to the owner. My 454 is the limit of what I can shoot in a hand gun without porting and I do not want a ported handgun.

Also, when it is me and the critter commin at me with killin on it's mind, I would use a 105 Howitzer if i could hold it steady and carry it in a holster. What might be adequate isn't gonna get it.

dougk · « **Reply #31 on:** December 30, 2006, 02:58:28 PM »

Quote from: crow_feather on December 30, 2006, 05:34:32 AM

Also, when it is me and the critter commin at me with killin on it's mind, I would use a 105 Howitzer if i could hold it steady and carry it in a holster.

Would that 105 be single action or double action?

Lawful Larry · « **Reply #32 on:** December 31, 2006, 05:05:57 AM »

Quote from: crow_feather on December 30, 2006, 05:34:32 AM

Also, when it is me and the critter commin at me with killin on it's mind, I would use a 105 Howitzer if i could hold it steady and carry it in a holster. What might be adequate isn't gonna get it.

In the Air Force we had bigger toys to help with that critter problem:

Oh yeah, that's me in my younger days.

Ahab · « **Reply #33 on:** December 31, 2006, 05:54:17 AM »

Quote from: Swampman on December 29, 2006, 12:18:16 AM

The .454 is a problematic cartridge, esp. in the Ruger.
Hmmm, my SRH being fairly new, has the smoothest chambers and slickest trigger of any my older ones. Been shooting it a lot with no sticking problems with heavy loads. Must be a fluke, huh?

Swampman · « **Reply #34 on:** December 31, 2006, 08:03:35 AM »

Sounds like it.

crow_feather · « **Reply #35 on:** December 31, 2006, 10:58:08 AM »

dougk

Semi-auto - but I've only ever needed one shot

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #36 on:** January 01, 2007, 12:53:03 AM »

hell on my reloading buget and casting one would be a bitch!!

Quote from: Lawful Larry on December 31, 2006, 05:05:57 AM

Quote from: crow_feather on December 30, 2006, 05:34:32 AM
Also, when it is me and the critter commin at me with killin on it's mind, I would use a 105 Howitzer if i could hold it steady and carry it in a holster. What might be adequate isn't gonna get it.

In the Air Force we had bigger toys to help with that critter problem:

Oh yeah, that's me in my younger days.

Swampman · « **Reply #37 on:** January 01, 2007, 12:56:10 AM »

I was assigned to the 1st SOW. We had some of those planes at one point. What outfit were you with?

Lawful Larry · « **Reply #38 on:** January 01, 2007, 04:41:21 AM »

Quote from: Swampman on January 01, 2007, 12:56:10 AM

I was assigned to the 1st SOW. We had some of those planes at one point. What outfit were you with?

I was with the 604th ACS, which was changed to a Special Operations Squadron (SOS). I was stationed at Bien Hoa, RVN from July '68 to Aug. '69. We went to a SOS when we joined the 3rd TFW.

After I left in August, the wing turn all A-37B models. My squadron flew the "A" model. The wing had F-100 aircraft prior to that. I ended up working on them for four months. They were beasts to maintain and fly.

Swampman · « **Reply #39 on:** January 01, 2007, 04:48:15 AM »

I worked on AC-130As, C-130Bs, MC-130Es, AC-130Hs, UH1Ns, H-3s, HH-53s, and OV-10s. I helped return these aircraft to servicable condition when they came back from the war. Thank you for your service to our country.

HiPressure · « **Reply #40 on:** January 05, 2007, 06:01:02 PM »

I'll add my 2 cents and pardon the rant!

I'd make a case for not buying either for hunting. Let's face it, folks, anything in North America that can be humanely killed with a handgun can be be killed with a 44mag, 45 Colt (real loads, not wimpy "cowboy action"), 41mag, or the 357mag. This is based on, of course, proper bullets placed in the proper spot, by someone who knows when to pass up the marginal shots. Emergency bear attacks? If I'm in an area where this is likely, I'll have a rifle or shotgun with heavy slugs close at hand, the heck with a handgun! Long range? I've done my share of shooting handguns at things way out there, but to hunt I'll go with a long gun or work on my "hunting" skills to allow myself to sneak up closer to shoot with a handgun. I cringe every time I hear about someone trying a 100+yd shot at a deer using a handgun, knowing that the vast majority of people that I see "out at the range" or "hunting" are hard pressed to consistently make "kill zone" shots much farther than that with a scoped rifle. Don't get me wrong, I know there are folks out there who can truly make long shots (consistently!) with a proper handgun and they have my respect and admiration. I just makes me sick when I am hunting to run into some tyro who bought his Super-Blaster, then gut-shot a deer and is congratulating himself on his long range "skill" while the animal needlessly thrashes around in the bushes. No, I'm no bambi-hugging, anti-hunting, green-peacing freak and yes, I've made my share of less than perfect shots, but I refuse to condone the practice of going to the "biggest is best" for handgun hunting (or any type of hunting) as a substitute for proper stalking or controlling themselve to pass up a bad shot. Two words for anyone who thinks I'm out of line----"ethical hunter". Check into the meaning behind those two words and then ask yourself why so many idiots out there really and truly believe hunters are wrong, based on situations like I just described. I refuse to encourage acts which will make ALL hunters look bad.

WOW! I feel better now!
Back to our regular program.
HP

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #41 on:** January 06, 2007, 12:27:06 AM »

a little conversation started at camp this year. that morning i put down a 6 point buck that my young nephew shot with a 308 and wounded. I made a somewhat lucky shot at the deer bounding away from me at 60 yards with a .500 linebaugh and dropped it. When i got back to camp my best friend had stopped by. Now hes a better shot then me with a handgun. I told the guys at camp about the shot and that i consider a good portion of luck was involved. One of the guys at camp said we were nuts for hunting with handguns in the first place. This got a heated debate going. My old man told the guys at camp that theyd better check there bs as the two of us could shoot but they were bound and determaned to prove there point. So we set pie plates out at 100 yards. Everyone got 5 shots off hand no support witht he weapon of there choise. Care to guess who the only two guys were that hit the plate 5 times and it the buddys case it could have been half the size. Now this isnt the first time weve done this little shoot at camp and ive only seen one rifle hunter hit 5 for 5 yet. Truth of the matter is that 90percent of the people in the woods cant shoot for crap. Most handgunners put more time at the bench then rifle hunters do. Now whos the unethical hunters. No doubt theres poor hunters with bows handguns and rifles but in my experiences the worse are the rifle hunters. They on average probabaly dont shoot 10 rounds a year. I think that bow hunters and handgun hunters for the most part are people who mastered rifle hunting to the point it bored them and did it for a little more challange and are willing to put the time in to learn to shoot and know there limitations probably better then the avearge rifle hunter. As to the 44-45-454-480 arguement who cares. They all will easily kill a deer. But if you want to use a bigger gun so be it thats your choise. I dont see guys bashing men shooting 3006 rifles which in my opinion are way overpowered for whitetail deer. They dont even say much when guys show up at deer camp with 300 mags. There isnt a whitetail deer in the woods that a 3030 35 rem wont kill and if your worried about long shots a 243 250sav. or a 257 roberts is more then enough gun. In all reality a 454 with cast bullets will do less meat damage to a deer then a 3030 will. So what is ethical. Ethical has nothing to do with the weapon. It is the man pulling the trigger or releasing the string and if you think its unethical to take game at 100 yards with a handgun id like to invite you out to a linebaugh seminar and there you can watch guys pound on targets out at 5-800 yards with handguns. Would i take game out that far.NO!! my self impossed range is an unethical 100 yards with open sights.

HiPressure · « **Reply #42 on:** January 06, 2007, 04:14:22 PM »

As soon as I clicked "post" I knew this would blow up....

I do not and never have had a problem with handgun hunting, using a large caliber for hunting, or hunters capable of making long range shots. What wraps me around the axle are simply those who don't wish to practice enough to be capable and encouraging these folks' perception that simply going bigger (faster, louder, etc.) will make up for their lack of practice. My disgust is the same with rifle hunters who can't make that 100 yard shot 2 out of 3 times with, say, a .243, but nonetheless buy a .300 mag and take to the field, content in their minds that the "magnum" will make up for their lack of marksmanship, never mind mind they have a flinch like a horse sneezing. If you can shoot a handgun chambered for the .50BMG well enough to make consistent kill shots, more power to you. If you can't hit a barn with a 38SPL target load and decide to hunt with a 500S&W, you will earn my deepest scorn. Same for those who know their accuracy limit is 25yds with the handgun and try that 100yd shot at a live animal. My idea of ethical hunting is to know when to restrict myself to taking a shot that I am certain will result in as clean a kill as possible (follow-ups and finishing shots do not count) and to keep practicing so as to make that shot a good one.
HP

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #43 on:** January 07, 2007, 01:23:18 AM »

Lloyd Smale, it is amusing how quickly someone will judge a handgun hunter without knowing there back ground. I really enjoyed your reply and highly agree with everything you posted.

I always find myself in the same predicament when I show up with my handgun for hunting. Funny how guys shut up when you show them just how well you can shoot one. There are guys that can't shoot anything you give them. As far as ethics, it is not the weapon but the guy behind it as Lloyd said.

Lloyd Smale · « **Reply #44 on:** January 07, 2007, 05:34:17 AM »

redhawk you know how it is all it takes is a few strokes of the keyboard and anyone can be an expert on anything. Any strokeing i do is on a trigger

Redhawk1 · « **Reply #45 on:** January 08, 2007, 01:44:53 AM »

There are two kinds of handgun shooters out there. Those that can and those that wish they could.

Well it is handgun season for deer this week in Delaware, I went out Saturday all day and the deer were just not moving, 70 degrees and I was sweating in the deer stand. Sunday is no hunting in Delaware and the big buck we have been after was just sitting behind a big embankment with 3 doe's. He knows it was a no hunting day. He has avoided use for almost 5 months now, I think he has an underground bunker.

Lawful Larry · « **Reply #46 on:** January 08, 2007, 03:21:42 AM »

I too have experienced the same reaction from others in camp. But that those same guys shut up when I come back to the skinning shed with my deer. Practice, practice, and then more practice is what it takes to make a handgun hunter. Notice I didn't say good handgun hunter. For that it will take even more practice.

As to the lousey rifle hunters, I have seen them at the range a week or two just before hunting season. They are busy checking the zero on their hunting rifles. All using some sort of rest system and no one shooting off hand, unsupported. I never see them practicing with their rifles the rest of the year though. Just my own observations as a range officer.

Oh yeah, I almost forgot. I was sitting in my local gun shop shooting the breeze with the fellas and in comes a young fella. He talks to the owner and asks if he could get his BP gun bore scoped. He needed it done because he was on his way to the field to go deer hunting. We all stop talking and just looked at this guy and staired. If someone had told me this story, I would have said I didn't believe it. What was that comedian that had the stick about "Here's your sign."

Ahab · « **Reply #47 on:** January 08, 2007, 05:38:07 AM »

Had a big smile reading Lloyd Smale's pie plate story. Many years ago I bet my favorite uncle $100 I could hit the pie plate at least 3 out of 5 with my .357 and that he couldn't do better with his open sighted 30-06. He even let me use a rest! Used the $100 to help buy a S&W model 29 which I still have today. I couldn't duplicate that feat now, with the same gun, but my SRH .454 with a 2X scope sure can.

Tom W. · « **Reply #48 on:** January 08, 2007, 12:47:36 PM »

I have a .44, 45 Colt, and a .480. If I get another SRH it will be a 7 1/2 inch .454. I dunno why. I use the .45 for plinking, the .44 and .480 go out hunting quite often, and I have missed two deer with the .480. I don't hit everything that I shoot at, that's why it's called hunting and not killing. The time put in at the range is great, sometimes,no, most times I'm the only one out there, unless it's two weeks from the start of deer season.

I prefer to hunt with my handguns. I know where they shoot and how far I dare to shoot with each one. With a rest my scoped Encore is almost like a rifle. for me, shooting it offhand would be foolish, at best and I know this.

Who was it that said "A man's gotta know his limitations".....?

Golsovia · « **Reply #49 on:** January 16, 2007, 04:58:47 PM »

The only real advantage I can see for the 454 is for long distance shooting or hunting. Then a fellow better be pretty good to make use of the advantage. Judging from the numbers of folks who choose the 454 over the 480, there must either be a lot of real good long distance handgun shooters or there are a lot of folks who sure like the 45 Colt, but like the perception of shooting a much bigger gun. The 480 is a real deal, only slightly taking a backseat to the 475. Aside from the fact that one can't shoot 45 Colt ammo in it, it is a much better suited cartridge, in my opinion, than the higher pressure 454 is. Of course, if 45 Colt is what one prefers to shoot (and there's certainly nothing wrong with it) then there are even more and better choices in that chambering. Much ammo for the 454 isn't loaded all the way to spec anyway since reliability issues rear their head for a number of reasons then.

NavyLT · « **Reply #50 on:** January 23, 2007, 09:09:48 AM »

If it is not too late to jump in here...

What about the S&W .460? It shoots 45 Colt, 454 Casull and .460 and is extremely accurate.