Author Topic: OK, I know this is going to sound weird, but it works. (Read 2100 times)

Cat Whisperer · « **on:** January 02, 2003, 02:24:55 PM »

As I was thumbing through a loading book some years back I noticed that the diameter of the base of two shell cases (.223 and .380) was right at .375/.378 which just happened to be the groove diameter of the .375 Win and .375H&H !!!

So, taking an empty .380 case, I (don't try this at home comes to mind) loaded up the H&H with a few grains of Unique and launched one.

Instant success! The neatest .375 diameter hole CUT right through the 1-1/2 inches of a 2x4 !!! Next round was fired into it into the 2x4 the 3-1/2 inch way - going through most of it. Amazing to see an empty shell case with the striations from the barrel engraved in it.

Now to how this relates to swaging. I tried to pour an emtpy case with lead, by putting the empty in a mould. Not total success as there was was air trapped that could not be vented.

Now with a use for all those .380 cases that I pick up thinking they're 9mm's, I want to see if I can SWAGE a chunk of lead into the case and have a high-velocity-capable light-weight cheap-to-produce plinker.

By the bye, if you do try this at home:

a) all standard disclaimers apply - it's your responsibility (you've got to be tough if you're stupid), and
b) when the casing is loaded base forward the primer will come out.

FWIW

Steve P · « **Reply #1 on:** January 02, 2003, 03:08:13 PM »

Richard Corbin at RCE makes all kinds of dies to make bullets out of shell casings. You would be surprised at all the combinations he has sitting on the window sill in his shop.

Steve :wink:

talon · « **Reply #2 on:** January 02, 2003, 04:24:12 PM »

The grove diameter of the .375 Winchester is .376". A small matter; However, IF it were .374 you could have a mite overpresure. In a model '94 lever action that wouldn't be fun. Double check everything when you experiment with cartridges. Don't assume anything....
You will find that jacket cost is THE major incremental cost to each bullet... Making plinkers out of found casings is an excellent idea no matter where it came from. You just have to read those books and technical manuals that Mr Corbin produced. Will save you a lot of time, let alone sinking the 'swaging hook' into you, but good!

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #3 on:** January 03, 2003, 01:23:18 AM »

I did measure the bore/groove diameters, and since the empty .380 weighs in the vicinity of 45 grains, I figured even if it were .005 over (which it wasn't) it'd be no problem.

When casting them full, they weigh about 185gr.

I have thought about just putting in a cast bullet, but with the taper of the inside of the case, I don't want any extra force outward (from the bullet inside the case wedging in). Therefore to fill the case fully by swaging seems to be the answer.

I did check both Corbin's web sites - a few new ideas there. I think I'll start with a simple die made from a hole drilled and reamed in a plate (simple & cheap) to prove the concept and then go on to something press mounted.

Thanks,

Double D · « **Reply #4 on:** January 03, 2003, 01:43:23 AM »

How about seating a 158 gr cast lead bullet to the bottom of the 380 case then resize in if a full length sizer with the guts removed?

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #5 on:** January 03, 2003, 01:01:19 PM »

DD -
I've been looking at several .356-7-8 diameter cast bullets ranging from 120 to 150 grains as candidates.

The primary issue is the closeness in form to fit into the cavity of the empty casing.

I see also where someone is using .45acp cases in a .458WM - something that I'll have to try as well.

Thanks,

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #6 on:** January 07, 2003, 01:53:23 PM »

John - I like the idea. In thinking it over today, my first question was that of how to control the weight. So, I think if I tinned the inside first, then placed them into the mould, I might could get it to work. Again, the problem with putting them into the mould is that of air not being able to vent. The problem with heating with a tourch might be that of getting consistant weights (?). Tune in tomorrow....

Hud · « **Reply #7 on:** January 07, 2003, 02:11:25 PM »

The 45 ACP can be used in the 480Ruger. Just be sure to shoot them single shot if filled with lead as there is no crimping groove on them.

I woulda called the crimping groove a "canular" but I didn't know how to spell it.

Hud

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #8 on:** January 11, 2003, 03:39:08 PM »

Sometimes things move fast. This is the press I've scrounged (my cost $0.00, new cost $2,995):

http://image1ex.villagephotos.com/pubimage.asp?id_=1352503" width=150 height=300>

Next step is to build/purchase swaging dies and adapt them.

I may have to modify the linkage if the leaverage isn't enough, but I think it'll be close.

Donna · « **Reply #9 on:** January 12, 2003, 07:26:22 PM »

Cool press! What was it originally? Your a real tinckerer, that's for sure.
Donna

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #10 on:** January 13, 2003, 04:19:48 PM »

Donna -
The press was designed for production, hence the foot treddle and the compound linkage, I've found, has plenty of force to squash boolets. The press was designed for setting grommets - so the pressure is light at the start of the stroke and most powerfull at the cam point. The treddle has adjustable stops at the top and bottom to limit the length of stroke.

I'll have to make my dies 0.800" in diameter for the OD - which is absolutely non-standard, but the price was right.

I've revised my die design too. By having the punch at the top and the die below the design becomes simpler. I think that I'll also be able to build a sleeve to use standard H&I dies for a push-through sizing setup.

Ahhh planning and dreaming is easy. Now the hard part - building it.

carpediem · « **Reply #11 on:** April 18, 2003, 07:55:43 AM »

:-D Greetings from the Great White North:

I have a 375HH and am looking to make a jacketed plinking load.

A couple of questions for you: Any problems with barrel fouling using a brass 380 case?

What about substituting the 9mm case for the 380 case; can it be done?

What about filling the 9mm case with sand and capping it with a lead projectile?

What is the accuracy of a round using a pistol case for a jacket?

Kindest regards,

Cat Whisperer · « **Reply #12 on:** April 19, 2003, 01:56:26 AM »

carpediem -

(carpediem sounds like something I should have learned in Latin class)

We have similar objectives. Soon I will be able to give definitive answers. Today's project is to wire up the 3phase converter and hook up the milling machine and maybe a lathe to it. THEN I can make the parts for my recently acquired press to cast/swage lead cores for the .380/.375H&H loads and test them extensively.

.223 cases are the same diameter - so I will most likely use them (because they are so much more available and I'll just set up a collet with a stop and an ejector to make them quickly). 9x19 cases are bigger. It may well be possible to swage them down to the .375 diameter as others here are doing something similar with .45acp cases and (I think) .458's or 45-70's.

Tune in tomorrow.