Author Topic: New Winchester 1892 Trapper Take-Down in 45 Colt (with some leather work)  (Read 1551 times)

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Offline Lee Robinson

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Having several scoped guns, I decided I could use a faster action open sighted gun for closer ranges (less than 100 yards) to make a quick second shot if needed to help my kids when hunting. I use to own a fairly recent production Marlin Cowboy in 45 Colt and liked that I could mount a scope on it over the bore, but was very unsatisfied with the poor fit and finish it had, the drastically over sized chamber that lead to swollen cases, and the less than desirable accuracy I got from it.

While I still liked leverguns, I stopped messing with them in terms of a hunting rifle since I was not satisfied with what was being made today, although I still enjoy my older Marlin 39A which I like...but now that I wanted an unscoped gun, what better gun could one use than a levergun? I didn't want to try another 45 by Marlin. My research began and I understand Rossi is making some nice lever actions that can be reworked into very nice guns. Visiting our local shop, they had two of the new Winchesters 1892 (Miroku) in stock in 45 Colt. Both were take-downs. I worked the action of the Trapper (16" barrel) and the other one (a 24"er), and found both to be very nice, but the 16" Trapper was just perfect.  This dealer has both of these fine guns in a special gun room (not his normal display area), so very few people have seen or handled either of them. According to Winchester, this particular model has produced in 2010, so after some talking, we worked out an agreeable bargain and I brought the 16" Trapper home. While I may be mistaken, I figured the fast and light weight 16" version of this rifle would harness most of the ballistics the pistol cartridge could offer...so why go with 24". Plus, I wanted this gun for fast action shooting should either of my children have a less than perfect primary shot on game. I believe this large diameter bore and short barrel combo weighs less than 6 pounds, so hopefully I should be able to swing this rifle onto its target plenty quick when the need arises. At only 32" from tip to tip, it is certainly the lightest and smallest adult rifle I own.

Fit and finish is OUTSTANDING. In fact, that may be an understatement. This gun is assembled just as nice as ANY lever action I have ever seen. Yes, it does have the tang safety and rebound hammer, but as long as they work reliably I am ok with that. I would prefer the half cock safety design as that design was flawless, reliable, and safe...and only required full cocking and pulling the trigger to go into action instead of this more recent "safer" three step process (disengage safety, cock hammer, pull the trigger). As long as this "improved safety" seems to be free of major inconveniences proves to be functional, reliable, and safe...as they have been so far...I can accept these newly designed safety features just fine. If not, I will have a competent gunsmith replace them with the older half cock system. I would like to say I do however prefer the tang safety over the cross bolt safety that is now seen in the Marlin leverguns. The trigger pull on this 1892 is nice and breaks cleanly, although I would prefer it be a bit lighter in pull (as expected on a new rifle).

Shooting some full house Ruger loads (H110) I was very pleased to see the chamber in this gun is not over-sized like my Marlin was. I have more accuracy testing to do, but was very pleased with the grouping in terms of windage. From 30 yards, all my shots would have been able to touch a vertical line, as a string hanging below the bull-eye. The gun seems true and consistent. I made some adjustments to the elevation rear sight to bring my point of impact up, which brought the bullet's impact closer to the bullseye, although still a little low (again dead on in terms of windage). I still had room to raise the rear sight another two positions, but instead of doing so I modifying my sight picture some by altering where I placed the front bead in the rear semi-buckhorn sight when obtaining my sight window...but doing so brought the impact up to bull's eye. Backing up to 50 yards, the firearm still hit dead center in terms of windage, and I am learning how to use the buckhorn to control my elevation by placing the front bead at different levels relative to the little V in the bottom of the buckhorn rear sight. This guns is showing promise, and I am very pleased.

Recoil with this very light weight and fast action levergun with the crescent steel butt plate and full house loads can be stout after a few rounds if just wearing a T-shirt, so I made a leather shoulder pad and leather strap. Inside the leather is a 1/2" piece of soft rubber, which does not contact the firearm as there is a piece of leather in front of the rubber pad as well.

More shooting and pictures to come (including take down photos). This gun is VERY simple to take-down and clean.





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Offline Lee Robinson

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Re: New Winchester 1892 Trapper Take-Down in 45 Colt (with some leather work)
« Reply #1 on: December 26, 2012, 07:32:49 AM »
Some more pictures...












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Offline tacklebury

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Re: New Winchester 1892 Trapper Take-Down in 45 Colt (with some leather work)
« Reply #2 on: December 26, 2012, 03:59:55 PM »
Hey where'd you find my gun!?  jk, beautiful piece.  ;)
Tacklebury --}>>>>>    Multi-Barrel: .223 Superlite, 7mm-08 22", .30-40 Krag M158, .357 Maximum 16-1/4 HB, .45 Colt, .45-70 22" irons, 32" .45-70 Peeps, 12 Ga. 3-1/2 w/ Chokes, .410 Smooth slugger, .45 Cal Muzzy, .50 Cal Muzzy, .58 Cal Muzzy

also classics: M903 9-shot Target .22 Revolver, 1926 .410 Single, 1915 38 S&W Break top Revolver and 7-shot H&R Trapper .22 6" bbl.


Offline mechanic

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Re: New Winchester 1892 Trapper Take-Down in 45 Colt (with some leather work)
« Reply #3 on: December 26, 2012, 04:08:23 PM »
That doesn't look like it's set up quite right.....send it to me and I'll straighten it out for you....in a while! ;D    Beautiful setup, some nice wood.
 
Ben
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Offline Lee Robinson

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Re: New Winchester 1892 Trapper Take-Down in 45 Colt (with some leather work)
« Reply #4 on: December 26, 2012, 05:39:51 PM »
Na...but they do still have the 24" take-down version in stock which while wasn't as perfect in action as this 16"er in MY OPINION, it was nice...so that will have to do for you.  ;)

I did update/modify my post to include my test shots at 50 yards. I am getting familiar with the buckhorn and while at first I had considered other rear sights for this gun, now that I am learning how to use the buckhorn to modify my sight window for elevation, I am actually seeing some benefits from this type of sight that I wouldn't have first expected. This gun is dead on in terms of windage (didn't even had to adjust the dove-tails), which IMO is a reflection of the gun's consistency. I think with more practice I will be able to shrink my groups down to very respectable patterns. If this was a scoped gun, my goal would be to obtain close to 2" at 100 yards, but with iron sights I will accept 3-4" at 100 yards, and 2" at 50 yards.  We will see...but in terms of windage I am certainly less than an inch at 50. I don't think the gun would do that if there was consistency issues with chamber pressures.
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Offline Lee Robinson

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Re: New Winchester 1892 Trapper Take-Down in 45 Colt (with some leather work)
« Reply #5 on: December 30, 2012, 05:09:34 AM »
UPDATE on the review of this gun.

Only two "complaints," for lack of a better word. More of a negative observation really than a complaint though, as I can work around both. Just updating the post to provide more "review" of this gun for those that are interested in the additional information.

1. This short "trapper" lever gun doesn't cycle the 270 grain keith bullets 100% of the time (too long and blunt).  If I seat the bullets deeper (1.640" instead of 1.650") then they will cycle, but that puts the case mouth a hair over the crimp groove. One could crimp over the driving band with a modified load, but at the velocities obtained from a hot lead based 45 load down a rifle barrel one would have to constantly check for leading with a lead bullet anyway, so I would likely have to live without the Keith bullet anyway.  Using jacketed bullets with an OAL of 1.650" or less, the gun cycles very reliably.

2. The finish, when new and sitting in a display case, is very nice and if that is all one is going to have the gun for then the finish is totally suitable as is...but I don't like this finish for my intended use of this gun. I have the gun to use as a hunting gun. When hunting with it the other day, it got bumped a time or two (mild bumps) against my son's gun, and the finish is easily scratched or dented. No bumps or scratches were hard, and I can easily work them out when I strip this finish off and apply a more traditional boiled linseed oil (BLO) finish or perhaps a minwax antique oil finish. Both are IMO better suited for durable use and resistance to weather conditions. I am not concerned about a "loss of value" due to modifying the finish or gun. I have the gun to use it. My comments about the finish though are to be somewhat expected on a production gun during in this day and time...and this finish is comparable to what I see being used by most production manufactured guns today (similar to my Savage and what came on my CZ rifles as well). In fact, in ALL FAIRNESS, I don't know of any production gun today that offers a quality boiled linseed oil or other type of quality oil finish straight from the factory, so take this issue in perspective. It is to be expected. I refinished one of my CZ rifles some time ago with a customized epoxy (that is modified to penetrate the wood), and it came out nice, but I think I will refinish the stock on this gun with one of the more traditional oil based finishes that is more true to its day and very durable. I will likely do the Savage and this Winchester this summer with one of the oil finishes as is the case on my Marlin 39a. (I do a good bit of wood work and refinishing custom wood items is something I am pretty familiar with given my archery background... http://keepitsimplearchery.com).

These two issues are minor in my opinion. The gun really is very nice and I am extremely satisfied with it...and I would highly recommend this Miroku made Winchester 1892 to anyone interested in a quality levergun.
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Offline Mikey

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Re: New Winchester 1892 Trapper Take-Down in 45 Colt (with some leather work)
« Reply #6 on: December 30, 2012, 03:22:59 PM »
Lee:  the problem of overall cartridge length in cycling lever action rifles often either precludes the use of specific bullet profiles or creates the need to seat them deeper to maintain cycling reliability.  I have this problem in my M92 in 357 - what seats in the chambers of my S&W M28 is reeeeeeeeal tough to seat in the M92, so when I brew up a batch I just seat the bullets deeeply enough to chamber in both, and the bullet I use is a 200 gn Keith style semiwadcutter - does not seem to affect the accuracy at all from either.  This also happens in lots of other straight wall cartridges, the 44 magnum and 444 Marlin are other examples; when you try to load in conventional revolver bullets you often run into overall cartridge length problems that mandate seating the bullet more deeply, often over the forward leading band - does not seem to affect either accuracy or extraction problems for me. 

Offline Lee Robinson

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Understood. In fact, I considered doing just that, but with the keith bullet needing a good roll crimp I would most likely need to EITHER trim my brass 0.020" or so to still be able to crimp in the crimp groove OR leave the brass full length as it is, seat the bullet considerably deeper, and crimped over the driving band.

I am not going to worry myself with either given I would 1. have to adjust the load to experimental data (none published) and 2. still have to watch  :o for leading of the barrel since this bullet isn't gas checked.

I found an easier solution...just go with jacketed bullets...and all is good. ;)
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Offline Humbo

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Re: New Winchester 1892 Trapper Take-Down in 45 Colt (with some leather work)
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2013, 05:41:43 AM »
I just ordered the exact same rifle, just need to get the paperwork done and it's mine. Does anyone know the twist rate and bore diameter of this gun? I'm happy to read that the chamber is not oversize like on the Marlin rifles in the same caliber.