.445 Super Mag info

[dave29]

I did a search here, and it turned  up threads from 2004 and 2005.....

Has anyone here recently reamed a .44 mag to .445 Super Mag? Where did you get your reamer? Did you have a problem with an oversized bore like I read about back in 2004-2005?

I will most  likely be using it as a deer gun (along with my .357 Max).

I already have a .44 mag synthetic Handi, but I am thinking about buying a .44 mag Talo Trapper, will the shorter barrel work just as good?

I believe the SB1 frame is not strong enough though, so I will be swapping for and SB2 frame and putting it back in a Talo Trapper configuration. I will use the SB1 frame for a shotgun or another smaller Pistol Cartridge.

Any info is appreciated on the  .445 conversion. 

[quickdtoo]

I rechambered Pete's older overbore microgroove rifled .44mag barrel to 445SM for him, he's happy as a clam with how his shoots factory ammo, you can rent the reamer from 4D or Elk Ridge, just google reamer rentals. Top loads are likely a bit much for the SB1 at over 43kcup, I know someone has an SB1 445SM, but I don't recollect who right now or what loads they've shot.

Tim

http://www.accuratepowder.com/data/PerCaliber2Guide/Handgun/Standarddata/44Cal(10.97mm)/445%20Super%20Mag%20page%20136.pdf

http://www.sixguns.com/tests/tt445sm.htm

[petemi]

I am "happy as a clam".  Tim slugged my barrel at .433 at the grooves and recommended a .434 hard cast, gas checked bullet.  The best I could find were .433 at Montana Bullet Works.  They arrived yesterday along with some 160 gr. cast for the .357s.  I haven't loaded or shot any of them yet.  Perhaps today.  Lawn and garden time is in the way   The overbored .44 shot Hornady LEs very well.  You might want to try them if you don't reload.

.445 ammo is hard to come by.  I had gotten 100 rounds from either American Custom or Custom Cartridge, I forget which, and I have 100 more on backorder with Reeds.  Now that I've got the bullets and powder, I'll see if someone has some brass.

Pete

[dave29]

I just recently got into reloading, and that is the main reason I want to ream a .44 out to .445. If I didn't reload, I wouldn't even consider doing it.

I'll check those places out for a reamer rental.

Now, I just need some brass. 

[petemi]

Midway USA has brass .445 cases backordered until June 4th at 41.90 per hundred.  I don't think that's too bad, and June 4th isn't too far away.  Order now, pay next month......the American way!

Pete

[quickdtoo]

Starline is the only maker of 445 brass and they're backordered for now as stated on their website,  (Backordered expected availability: NEXT RUN WHEN SUFFICIENT BACKORDER ACHEIVED ) but cut down 444 Marlin brass may work.

Tim

http://www.starlinebrass.com/index.php?cPath=1

[petemi]

I checked Starline earlier and all they seemed to have in stock was nickle plated at 352.20 a thousand in 5000 lots........my great great great grandkids could shoot them up.  I would think that Midway's June guess is just that..a guess.

Perhaps we should all order to increase Starlines backorder.

Pete

[bajabill]

buffaloarms.com carries it, I think it is in stock, but I did not chase it thru to an order - give em a try

[quickdtoo]

BA doesn't list inventory, every time I've ordered something from them they haven't had it in stock, I'd be real surprised if they actually have it. Huntington lists it too and several others, but everyone that lists inventory currently lists it as out of stock. 

Tim

[petemi]

Fact One:  Starline's the only one that makes it.  Fact Two:  Everyone else is backordered 'til they do.

Pete

[dave29]

Midway USA has brass .445 cases backordered until June 4th at 41.90 per hundred.  I don't think that's too bad, and June 4th isn't too far away.  Order now, pay next month......the American way!

Pete

No backorder 

[wreckhog]

Or you could just pick up a .444. Uses .44 bullets, plenty of brass and factory loads, reloading data, SB2 frame, etc.

[dave29]

Or you could just pick up a .444. Uses .44 bullets, plenty of brass and factory loads, reloading data, SB2 frame, etc.

Can't deer hunt with a .444 in Indiana, but you can with a .445 SM. The .445 SM fits right in the State's cartridge guidlines.

[jbtazgrabber]

i have a 44 handi ok its the wifes/......ihave a 445...but its not a h and r barrel....use 4227 imr and 200 gr hornady xtp....best deer killing machine ever made........twice as good as the max.....the wifes handi was bought on this fourm...not a great tach driver was the story i got........put my imr with xtp and presto instant groups under a in at 50 yards.....it like the 300 and 200.both were real close.....i shoot the 200 grainers so she did too.....havent lost a deer with these usally d.r.t....both are sb1 frames.....jb

[dave29]

Your .445 is on an SB1 frame? How hot are the  loads that you  are making?

[gendoc]

if a super mag is on your menu... then go for it !!!
thats 1 handi-cal i have no need for....
too many before and after the fact.

can you believe i don't have that in my #1 collection either

if i ever need one.... then, thats anudder story

[NFG]

The 445 case has a 0.457" base and the 444 M has a 0.471" base. 

You might swage the 444M base down that far or at least far enough to work...it depends on the reamer dimensions, how strong your press and arm are...

Two choices...wait for the 445 brass or just rechamber to a 444 M...you will have the same size bullet, just a longer case.  Load it to 445 ballistics and you HAVE a 445...for all intents and purposes. 

You could also have a 444 M reamer ground with a 1.61" length and get the best of both the worlds...plenty of 444 brass and the recoil of the 445.

I would be sure of WHICH frame I had before doing EITHER...

In the pistol and in it's day, the 445 was a good thing, you do get much better ballistics...it still is a fine cartridge, but in a rifle today, not so much, as there are other (better I think) alternatives.

Indiana seems a bit weird with their deer hunting laws...the 444 is a much more powerful round than the 445 and uses the same bullet.  WHY the lesser cartridge over the stonger one.   Doesn't make sense!!!

Luck

[quickdtoo]

Lots of the older overbore 44mag barrels had oversize chambers as well as bores, 444 brass may fit in them, but it won't work in my 2007 44mag barrel, I tried a cut down Rem 444 Marlin in mine, won't fit, ran it thru a Lee deluxe 44mag die and broke the carbide insert, so don't try this at home....but you may find they break just sizing brass that it's meant for, just ask CW. 

Tim

[NFG]

That's always true...only way to know is to try a 444 M case..."slip-fit" or make a cast.  There are many ways around the flagpole and each rifle is unique to a certain extent.

I never came across an easy way to re-form the base of a case...solid brass just doesn't want to cooperate and other than turning off the excess...always just as big a pain...finding and going the easy way is much better.

The 444M is an excellent woods cartridge for deer/bear...for those that want a little more umph in a 35 cal or a 38-55, the 358 JDJ (35/444) or 375 JDJ (375/444) are both easy conversions.  You can even use '06 brass for each instead of 444M brass.

You could also try 30-40 Krag or 6.5 Mannlicher Schoenaur brass...those bases are pretty close to 445 specs...simple matter to fireform.

Luck

[dpe.ahoy]

I believe the OP needs a pistol case for state restrictions.  DP

[dave29]

I believe the OP needs a pistol case for state restrictions.  DP

Exactly

[NFG]

What the heck is an "OP"...sounds like something from the "Andy Griffith" show... and are you talking about using a pistol for hunting deer.

Still doesn't make sense to me...there are 444M pistols...I would definitely still want to use the bigger cartridge.

Luck

[quickdtoo]

Indiana rifle deer hunters must use a cartridge that is .357" or larger with a case no longer than 1.625" long.

OP = Original Poster or Original Post.

Tim

http://www.in.gov/dnr/fishwild/files/fw-Deer_Hunting_Equipment.pdf

[NFG]

Thanks...Hunting laws seem to have no basis in reality or common sense some times...ALL over.  Good place for a 500 S&W, 500 Linebaugh or a 500 Whisper...or a shorter 585 HE short. 

Luck

[bikerbeans]

Ohio has strange deer hunting laws also, you can use a pistol, says must be .357 or larger and straight wall.  I assume they mean no bottle neck as all brass has a tapper.  So a 500 S&W Revolver is okay but I can't use a center fire rifle of any caliber, but I can hunt deer with a 410 slug.  DNR, go figure.

BB

[ourway77]

Same law here in Delaware, straight wall cases. Stupid laws. I would much rather use a 7-30 waters or my 308 bullberry. lou

[NFG]

I think these strange laws were enacted in high population density states to keep hunters from using high powered rifle that could zap someone 3 counties over, whereas shotguns and pistols are much lower powered but work well in short range situations...

The only problem is technology continues at a rapid rapid rate while politicians only change laws when it's election time and they think it will get them votes...otherwise it's Status Quo and business as usual.

Once a law is on the books, people will die defending it...WITHOUT QUESTION.

Plus ANY government is always way behind the ball and playing catchup...that aspect will never change.

Luck

[1greg]

Does the SB1 Talo Trappers have small firing pins or the shotgun size firing pins ?

God Bless ya'll
Greg

...I am thinking about buying a .44 mag Talo Trapper, will the shorter barrel work just as good?

I believe the SB1 frame is not strong enough though, so I will be swapping for and SB2 frame and putting it back in a Talo Trapper configuration. I will use the SB1 frame for a shotgun or another smaller Pistol Cartridge.

Any info is appreciated on the  .445 conversion. 

[Mac11700]

I did a search here, and it turned  up threads from 2004 and 2005.....

Has anyone here recently reamed a .44 mag to .445 Super Mag? Where did you get your reamer? Did you have a problem with an oversized bore like I read about back in 2004-2005?

I will most  likely be using it as a deer gun (along with my .357 Max).

I already have a .44 mag synthetic Handi, but I am thinking about buying a .44 mag Talo Trapper, will the shorter barrel work just as good?

I believe the SB1 frame is not strong enough though, so I will be swapping for and SB2 frame and putting it back in a Talo Trapper configuration. I will use the SB1 frame for a shotgun or another smaller Pistol Cartridge.

Any info is appreciated on the  .445 conversion. 

Don't know if you found these links or not,but they does have some good info and related pressures,not to mention a little of the history of the Super Mags.

http://www.sixguns.com/tests/tt445sm.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_magnum

http://www.accuratepowder.com/data/PerCaliber2Guide/Handgun/Standarddata/44Cal(10.97mm)/445%20Super%20Mag%20page%20136.pdf



Mac

[quickdtoo]

I hope Dave read em, I posted the AA and sixguns links right after he asked if he hadn't found them yet. 

Tim

I rechambered Pete's older overbore microgroove rifled .44mag barrel to 445SM for him, he's happy as a clam with how his shoots factory ammo, you can rent the reamer from 4D or Elk Ridge, just google reamer rentals. Top loads are likely a bit much for the SB1 at over 43kcup, I know someone has an SB1 445SM, but I don't recollect who right now or what loads they've shot.

Tim

http://www.accuratepowder.com/data/PerCaliber2Guide/Handgun/Standarddata/44Cal(10.97mm)/445%20Super%20Mag%20page%20136.pdf

http://www.sixguns.com/tests/tt445sm.htm