Author Topic: 338 Federal should be about dead by now (Read 19920 times)

Swampman · « **Reply #30 on:** August 07, 2009, 01:42:03 PM »

The Sakos in .338 Federal are selling real cheap right now.

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #31 on:** August 07, 2009, 01:51:13 PM »

Is there such a thing a a real cheap Sako?

And if so where?

nomosendero · « **Reply #32 on:** August 07, 2009, 02:22:13 PM »

Quote from: mcwoodduck on August 07, 2009, 01:51:13 PM

Is there such a thing a a real cheap Sako?
And if so where?

Me too!!

nomosendero · « **Reply #33 on:** August 07, 2009, 02:30:06 PM »

Quote from: Drilling Man on August 07, 2009, 12:23:41 PM

Quote from: Sourdough on August 07, 2009, 10:35:13 AM
I would be interested in any .338 short cartridge that could match the .338-06. It would fit in an AR action and I could use one here in Alaska. I'm not at home now to check the ballistics on the short cartridges, so i cannot say if any of them meet my criteria.

Drilling man: I don't speak for other Alaskans, just myself and the people I know who feel the same way I do. We have sen a lot of Moose and Caribou lost by hunters using the .308 cartridge. Animals that would have gone down with the identical shot from a 30-06.

I hunted all over the state "extensively", and i didn't see the folks i hunted with having the problems i see you write about all the time.

What i saw was, with good bullets, on nondangerous game, (including moose) the 308 will do anything the 06 will do, except it will have about a 50 yard or so shorter max range... I just don't believe in those 400 yard shots anyway, and i could always get a bit closer.

DM

Gotta go with DM on that one. DM said 50 yard or so diff & I know he mentioned that & went on, actually that was pretty close as an estimate. Out of curiouosity I ran some numbers on 165-180 bullets & respective velocities. You are looking at 75-80 in many cases. To say a 30-06 will kill a Caribou or Moose at 400 yds. but a 308 won't kill at
325 yds. just isn't logical, period.

I'll go with BS meter on that one!!

Swampman · « **Reply #34 on:** August 07, 2009, 02:46:45 PM »

There are Sako 85's so chambered on Gunbroker for $750.

Pinkerton · « **Reply #35 on:** August 07, 2009, 03:30:36 PM »

I had a hawkeye in 338 federal and just traded it for a #1 RSI, I like the round but would prefer it in a different rifle, I still have the dies and I think I'd like it in a DPMS. In fact, I would like it in the RSI I just traded it for.

Win 1917 · « **Reply #36 on:** August 07, 2009, 04:23:43 PM »

Quote

I would be interested in any .338 short cartridge that could match the .338-06.

Both wildcats but the 338-284 Win and 338-350 Rem mag should have very similar case capacities to the 338-06. Edit...reread your post, I have no idea if those wildcats would fit in AR

coyotejoe · « **Reply #37 on:** August 08, 2009, 04:13:06 AM »

I think the .338 Fed is a great idea, if I didn't already own a .358 Winchester I'd jump on it. There is a lot of personal prejudice involved in the choice of a rifle and the .308 vs 30/06 debate is a perfect example. If one shoots factory loads the difference is about nil and to say the 30/06 is a sure killer while the .308 is a loser is just plain silly. There is a much greater difference between the .338 Fed and the .358 Win and that difference is still not great enough to make me choose one over the other, I'd take which ever is available in the rifle I like or can get the best deal on. If you prefer levers then I'd also throw the .356 Winchester and the .338 Marlin into that same "no difference" category and I wouldn't entirely exclude the .375 Winchester either. We gun buffs are fond of splitting hairs but practically speaking any one of the above will do as well as any other.

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #38 on:** August 11, 2009, 12:37:10 PM »

Win 1917,
The new ruger rounds the 300 and the 338 that are equal to 300 and 338 Win Mags are short action rounds and may fit in an AR 10 frame.
Coyote Joe,
I agree with you. we all have our favorites and reasons for those due to location, what dad had, or it is the flattest fastest most powerfull or what have you.
I was having a similar arguement with a friend last night about the 338 Fed Vs the 30-06 for his kid as an Elk rifle.
At the end my final words were if you are going to buy him a rifle I guess it's your money and you can spend it how you want.

Win 1917 · « **Reply #39 on:** August 11, 2009, 04:31:22 PM »

You're right. I forgot all about the 338 RCM...I've been reading a lot about the 284/350 and their wildcats so they were the first that popped into my mind.

yooper77 · « **Reply #40 on:** August 11, 2009, 05:53:29 PM »

I just bought a used Weatherby Ultra Lightweight in 338-06 A-Square.

The sale included RCBS dies and 60 pieces of Weathrby brass, 18 of them are still loaded Weatherby factory ammo with Nosler 210 grain Partitions and 20 hand loads of with Nosler 210 grain Accubonds that leaves 22 empties.

yooper77

Happy · « **Reply #41 on:** August 12, 2009, 08:35:18 AM »

Well I think the 338 Federal will have a following just as the 358 W . There seems to be no rush from every one and there uncle to buy a rifle so chambered , but there will be a cult as with the 358W.It would be better if loaded Ammo would not cost as much, and be in line with the 308 and 3006 .Why buy a gun so chambered when you can shoot the 308 / 3006 for almost half the price ? I have a 338 F and I tend to reload my own instead of buying from federal @ almost 50 Bucks a box for nolsers . If Federal would pour out the ammo cheap , I am sure sales for rifles would increase . The two could work together on this .One does not need to have high school to figure that out !!
Chambered in the AR ,it might appeal to some who like the black rifles .Otherwise if your in to something where the round might serve you well, then you might get a good deal on a rifle, and roll your own as with the 358W crowd .

quickdtoo · « **Reply #42 on:** August 12, 2009, 09:39:23 AM »

Fusion ammo isn't so expensive.

Tim

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=00129F338FFS2

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=00129F3006FS3

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=00129F308FS3

Drilling Man · « **Reply #43 on:** August 12, 2009, 01:20:49 PM »

All this .338 Federal talk, makes me want to break out my .338-06. Then light load it, to make it into a Federal... lol I haven't fired it in years, as i haven't seen any brown bears around here to track down, and i sure don't need "that much" gun to kill a deer...

DM

crash87 · « **Reply #44 on:** September 04, 2009, 04:09:21 AM »

Quote from: billy_56081 on July 21, 2009, 11:58:26 AM

The idea being stupid is not that it won't be a decent performer on game. The stupid in the idea comes from it aint gonna sell worth a darn. Commercial cartridges need a market, the 338 fed has almost no market. Most who would be in the market for this would be just as happy wildcatting it.

The 338 federal deserves no chance at success. The writers of today can't even keep it going as the only thing they can compare it to is the 358 Win, a cartridge they help doom, but will live on far longer than the 338 Fed. All the excuses for having a 338 over a 358 have been, pretty much beat to death. The animals that have fallen to my own 35 calibers have not known that the 358 has;
inferior sectional density / inferior B.C. / a lesser bullet selection / inferior ballistical advantages / etc. to the 338 anything. Even if I can't find one so chambered and need to spend more on a rebarrel, give me a 35 REM, 348 WCF(I know, I know) 358WCF, 350 REM MAG, 35 WHELEN, 358 NORMA, 358 STA, any day, 338 Fed

YAWN!
CRASH87

Happy · « **Reply #45 on:** September 04, 2009, 10:27:18 AM »

Well if the loading of the 338 Federal does not impress you , you can get something with a bigger case for a bigger animal or with less if looking at small game .
Look at the american loading for the german 8 MM. Not much more than the 30/ 30 .There are better rounds but it still has its place . The 308 ME has it's following and do not think it has much going for it over the 300 savage.
The 338 F does not come close to the 338/06 nor the weatherby cases using the 338 bullet but then it was never meant to be.
If you think we have no use now for the 3006 since we now have the 300 WM your wrong . There is a place for both in our gun safe along with the 30/30 and the 338Federal they all have a niche.
Then too some people prefer a chev- having never tryed a ford.

yooper77 · « **Reply #46 on:** September 04, 2009, 11:24:18 AM »

Quote from: Happy on September 04, 2009, 10:27:18 AM

Look at the american loading for the german 8 MM. Not much more than the 30/ 30 .

Not even close, the 8mm Mauser vs the 30-30 Winchester or am I missing something here?

yooper77

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #47 on:** September 10, 2009, 11:28:27 AM »

The Remington load for 8X57 is a 170 grain round nose at about 100 FPS faster than 30-30. Not much more if I remember right.
the reason for this is the original 8X57 was a .318 bullet and when the germans went ot the S bullet they changedd it to the .323 that it is today.
For lawsuits and safety Remington loads the 323 bullet at slower speeds so you don't over pressure one of the early military or commercial rifles that are .318 bore. While not a big problem with the Mauser 98 actions,
The older Mauser 88 that has a weak action and the ones that were not converted for WWI service to take the stripper clip and the S bullet could over pressure with the 323 ammo and hurt someone.
The 88 looks like an Italian Manlicher crossed with a Remington model 8. The action is Manlicher open reciever and the barrel has a shroud over it like the Rem Model 8 or 81 (semi auto) loaded from an emboc clip that fell out the bottom of the mag when empty.
Now the Europeans know about the 318 and know what to and what not to use in those guns and the European ammo is loaded hot and the 8X57 will do what ever 30-06 will do with a little wider and heavier bullet.

yooper77 · « **Reply #48 on:** September 10, 2009, 11:36:48 AM »

Quote from: mcwoodduck on September 10, 2009, 11:28:27 AM

The Remington load for 8X57 is a 170 grain round nose at about 100 FPS faster than 30-30. Not much more if I remember right.
the reason for this is the original 8X57 was a .318 bullet and when the germans went ot the S bullet they changedd it to the .323 that it is today.
For lawsuits and safety Remington loads the 323 bullet at slower speeds so you don't over pressure one of the early military or commercial rifles that are .318 bore. While not a big problem with the Mauser 98 actions,
The older Mauser 88 that has a weak action and the ones that were not converted for WWI service to take the stripper clip and the S bullet could over pressure with the 323 ammo and hurt someone.
The 88 looks like an Italian Manlicher crossed with a Remington model 8. The action is Manlicher open reciever and the barrel has a shroud over it like the Rem Model 8 or 81 (semi auto) loaded from an emboc clip that fell out the bottom of the mag when empty.
Now the Europeans know about the 318 and know what to and what not to use in those guns and the European ammo is loaded hot and the 8X57 will do what ever 30-06 will do with a little wider and heavier bullet.

Yes I know, just as I said not even close.

yooper77

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #49 on:** September 10, 2009, 12:13:52 PM »

Ok I'm lost.
The Remington load is just a hair faster than 30-30 with the same 170 grain bullet.
the European load is hot. So yes european 8X57 Vs 30-30 is a big win for the 8mm
american 8X57 Vs 30-30 is about equal. and would be a fair comparison.

yooper77 · « **Reply #50 on:** September 10, 2009, 12:30:59 PM »

Maybe.

yooper77

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #51 on:** September 10, 2009, 02:06:48 PM »

What do you mean Maybe.
Ok.
quick test.
If a 30-06 win round pushes a 150 grain bullet 2850 FPS and a 7.62X 54R throws a slightly larger 150 grain bullet 2700 FPS are they in the same class?

yooper77 · « **Reply #52 on:** September 10, 2009, 02:46:52 PM »

Close, but not the same.

Would the game notice anything no, but it’s not exact.

yooper77

mcwoodduck · « **Reply #53 on:** September 11, 2009, 09:13:50 AM »

Just wanted to see what kind of a number cruncher you are and now I see that 75-150 FPS mean something to you.
Hope you have a good weekend.
McDuck.

454Puma · « **Reply #54 on:** September 11, 2009, 05:20:58 PM »

Drilling Man
I'm liking you more!!!

I grow up on reading the old out doors Mags when I was young and then the '06 was king in AK! I used to poor over the balistic charts dreaming of the day I'd own my first center fire rifle. I was torn between the 308/30-06. But after looking at the numbers and talking to many who shot both it was a no brainer '06 all the way. It was my first center fire, still the best and I know loaded with a tuff bullet it will do any animal I'd want to shoot. I've never had nor do I think I will ever own a Magnum anything cause the '06 just does the job everytime.

Thebear_78 · « **Reply #55 on:** September 11, 2009, 07:09:40 PM »

i have a buddy that made an ultra light 338 federal based off a worked over model 7. Total weight of less than 5lbs including scope. 180gr TSX make a dandy sheep/carabou/moose round and will definately do for brown bear also. Shoots pretty good with 200gr bullet weights too. 225 and heavier seem to be insufficient powder capacity. Still a great niche round for an ultra light big game rifle.

Drilling Man · « **Reply #56 on:** September 12, 2009, 03:01:41 AM »

Quote from: 454Puma on September 11, 2009, 05:20:58 PM

Drilling Man
I'm liking you more!!! I grow up on reading the old out doors Mags when I was young and then the '06 was king in AK! I used to poor over the balistic charts dreaming of the day I'd own my first center fire rifle. I was torn between the 308/30-06. But after looking at the numbers and talking to many who shot both it was a no brainer '06 all the way. It was my first center fire, still the best and I know loaded with a tuff bullet it will do any animal I'd want to shoot. I've never had nor do I think I will ever own a Magnum anything cause the '06 just does the job everytime.

A properly loaded 30-06 is enough gun for any animal in NA, and i'd MUCH rather have that 30-06 in my hands, than a 338 Federal loaded with 180 TSX's, when hunting brown bears. At least with the 06 it's a proven combo, that i KNOW how it will work...

DM

nomosendero · « **Reply #57 on:** September 12, 2009, 05:16:58 AM »

Quote from: Drilling Man on September 12, 2009, 03:01:41 AM

Quote from: 454Puma on September 11, 2009, 05:20:58 PM
Drilling Man
I'm liking you more!!! I grow up on reading the old out doors Mags when I was young and then the '06 was king in AK! I used to poor over the balistic charts dreaming of the day I'd own my first center fire rifle. I was torn between the 308/30-06. But after looking at the numbers and talking to many who shot both it was a no brainer '06 all the way. It was my first center fire, still the best and I know loaded with a tuff bullet it will do any animal I'd want to shoot. I've never had nor do I think I will ever own a Magnum anything cause the '06 just does the job everytime.

A properly loaded 30-06 is enough gun for any animal in NA, and i'd MUCH rather have that 30-06 in my hands, than a 338 Federal loaded with 180 TSX's, when hunting brown bears. At least with the 06 it's a proven combo, that i KNOW how it will work...

DM

I agree!! Take a look at the JJHACK sticky in bolt actions, hard to argue with results & that was with the 165TSX, you still have the 180 TSX/TTSX & high SD choices like the 180 & 200gr. Accubond/Partition & many others, higher SD's at higher vel. than compariable weights in the Fed.

Thebear_78 · « **Reply #58 on:** September 12, 2009, 10:13:17 PM »

My buddies kid absolutely crushed a bull moose with his 338 Fed today. One shot 75 yards with a 185gr TSX, bang/stumble/flop. Would that have been the same with an 06, probably, would it have been any more dead with a 338/06 or 338 Win mag, or even a 458 Lott, NO. All cartridges have a place and this ones nich for me is in ultra light compact big game rifles.

jro45 · « **Reply #59 on:** September 13, 2009, 01:50:14 AM »

I own the 338 RUM and I have a brake on it for sighting in certain bullets. But out in the field I take it off and put on a thread protector. That works for me.