Stevens 87A

[shootrj2003]

 any and all info anybody has on this or it's kin?

[jh45gun]

Well your not going to like this, they have a complicated spring system that when it goes out of wack leads to jamming or full auto fire and jamming as the gun cannot keep up to the full auto fire. Of course a full auto gun will get you in trouble and the sad part is many gunsmiths shun these because they are a PITA to work on. I had one and it went full auto so I dumped it at a gun show yet it shot shorts fine. They have several springs and they all have to work together to work right. When they do work its a nice gun, but those springs are known to  fail or get out of adjustment. Noted Gunsmith who has written lots of gunsmithing   books has commented on these problems. If your looking at one I would pass and if you have one pray it does not get out of wack and works. Now some will teill you their gun never has done this and some have not. Others have enough that it is a known problem about these guns. My gunsmith will not even look at them. He has a list in his shop of guns he considers not worth working on and these guns and their kin are some of them on that list. If you do have one good luck with it I hope it does not malunction on you.  Jim   

[Charles/NM]

Lets see.   How can I say this and not be considered nasty? 
jh45gun doesn't like them. Everyone else does.  I have the Savage 6A version as do many of my friends. We shoot them alot and have NEVER had any problems. I used to repair .22 rimfire rifles for a local gun shop. I only got one 87 in for repair. The cartridge guide had somehow gotten spread out allowing the cartridge to pop up in front of the bolt before it was supposed to breaking off the firing tip. I squezzed the guide back to it's normal shape and bought a generic firing pin from Gun Parts Corp and fitted it to the bolt. That was many years ago and the rifle is still functioning perfect. I have shot my 6A in many NRA metallic silhouette matches over the years. Other shooters are always surprised at how accurate it is.  I will never part with my 6A.  Love it.
There are lots of threads on this fine rifle over at Rimfire Central.

[jh45gun]

Chuck I am going on my past expirience with one going full auto and an article by Noted Gunsmith J.B. Wood who had article on this issue in the book Trouble Shooting Your Rifle and Shotgun" Author J. B. Wood.
[DBI Books , INC Northfield Illinois. 

I quote: when all of the attendent springs have the proper tension, and the disconector and its step on the bolt are sharp, the system works perfectly. The balance of the spring tension, though, is critical, and any variation in the strengh of the bolt, striker, or disconector springs can cause several problems not in the least or which is full automatic firing. There is no easy cure for this. Straightening out this rather weird system is a job for a compenent gun smith.  he also states other problems are the cartridge lifter and the breakage of the cartridge guide spring on models that have that. In later versions this spring was eliminated. His last words in the article was: " For reasons that will be obvious, most gunsmiths are thoughly familular with this rifle.  Pages 154-155.

It is not that I personally dislike them I just think folks should know they may encounter problems as I did. Not only do I have to go on by what Wood says My own gunsmith who is very good and at one time worked for Kimber agrees with what Wood says. Now that is not saying every gun will do this I am sure some may never give you problems. I know anygun can break or give problems at one time or an other. This gun is noted for these problems so I pointed them out as he asked. I have no personal agenda against these guns heck I wish they did not have the problems as I would buy them as I have seen them cheap on the used market. Enfield 303 found out after he bought his he had to take it to the shop. Glad to hear you and others have not had problems I am sure many have not. The possibility is there though so it should be addressed when folks ask about these guns.

Since I did have a gun that would go full auto I know what he says above can happen. Also seeing the spring system compared to other semi auto 22's I can see how they could get out of wack.

[Charles/NM]

I do agree that if those two strange sears or their notches were to wear significantly full auto could occur.  The rifles I've been aware of have been kept pretty clean and well lubed. The sears and notches on these guns show no obvious wear.  BTW, I use Sta-Lube antisieze, antigalling, coloidal graphite and moly  Engine Assembly grease on any area where I suspect abnormal metal to metal wear might occur. So far, so good. I can imagine a gunked up model 87 or 6 doing strange things. Actually they are pretty strange even when they function correctly.  Being a retired mechanical engineer, machinist and outhouse gunsmith I can make or remachine any gun part that looks suspicious so broken or worn gun parts don't concern me as much as they might some other gun owners. I love the goofy operating cycle of these rifles. I also strongly suggest owners of these rifle resist the urge to 'adjust' the trigger system springs to improve trigger pull. etc.

[jh45gun]

Chuck, Your lucky that you have the knowledge and the apptitude to do this work. I know I like to tinker with guns mostly muzzle loaders because they are less complex. You can see that these guns could be complicated if the average guy tried to fix them or went to far taking them apart for cleaning ect. They are accurate guns from what I could see of the one I had too bad it had problems. What I stated was not to run down anyones gun or anyone on their opinion. I could see if a person never had a problem with their gun they would think I am nuts. Fortunately I have documentation with the article stateing the same problem I had. The only brand I have ever really bashed was Ruger for their single actions as they have had issues from the factory not all of them but enough to make you wonder about their customer service. I also feel that other 22 models out of the box are more accurate than the 10/22 even though it is a well made very nice rifle. I state that as if they were as accurate as some of the others there would not be millions of dollars made with the after market trade making them into tack drivers. For the record on that I had 5 10/22s over the years and most did not impress me with the accuracy they had. Now the Target model was different that one was a tack driver as it should be. The thing is I have found other brands just as accurate with out the bull barrel and the weight for all around use. For the record if a person has a gun and likes it good enough for me or it should be for anyone else. However if they ask about a particular gun they should be made aware there could be problems if that gun is prone to those issues. Myself I have a Henry 22 mag I love and I think they are a good gun even though the sides are a alloy that is not a stress area. Just as Rugers and Marlins have alloy receivers and they have no issues as the bolts are steel as is in the Henry. In Wood's book he claims the Ithica 72 is a good gun which is a Henry forrunner. Still that is his and my opinion others may differ. So if your happy with a gun or I or some one else that should be the bottom line.  I guess some times I may sound brash and that is not my intention as I do not mean to bash any ones gun or bow.xbow or what ever. IF I post something negative it is in the hope I can help some one avoid a potential problem.  Jim

[shootrj2003]

 Gentlemen,
 I am more than happy with the function and quality of my rifle,I have delved into its mechanics and really,it is no more formidable than any number of Semi-auto .22's .I personally have never had go to a gunsmith to fix any weapon,I just fix them myself.
  You'll find that if a gun is not presently made or at least fairly recent production or a popular model many gunsmiths will refuse to work on it or at least not be enthused about doing so. This I feel is due to the fact that if they have to search sources for parts,or spend time figuring out a gun unfamiliar to them ,this takes time and money and effects thier bottom line,I don't blame them it is a business ,as opposed to having someone walk in with a Ruger 10-22 for them to "accurize" at which point they ask him how much money  he wants to spend and they pull down the Volquartzen catalog and tell the guy come back in two weeks,they get the parts ,do a couple of hours work swapping parts   get thier cut and it's great business,The guy walks away happy because he's too mechanically challenged to change a light bulb.oh well! That is one reason why there are gunsmith's ,the other reason for them is to do machine work and blue or parkerize or apply finish of some type other than paint to metal this because the average guy don't want to buy the equiptment [he's cheap like me!]also oh well!
 What I'm interested in is history,years of production, how many different models there were?How many were made how many different types of stocks there were what kind of wood or plastic were used as stock material.
                                                                                                                          Thanks , Shootrj2003
P.S. As far as full auto fireing any semi auto is capable of it due to wear  or being modified to do this and if it does you fix it

[jh45gun]

Fixing these can be complicated due to the spring issues they have to be just right. As far as my gunsmith goes he is a true gunsmith he makes stocks from scratch does his own metal work and makes parts from scratch if need be.  He has a impressive resume and he is not just a parts re-placer. He has a complete shop and knows how to use it.  You are right though about time and money and the bottom line. Some guns a gunsmith may not want to work on because the gun is not worth the time or the money to fix it.   The main thing is if your gun works and your happy with it that is all that counts does not matter what others think.