45-90 vs 45-110

[mam40k]

Another newbie question. I recently got a great deal on a Shiloh Sharps. I almost feel bad about it but I paid what the guy wanted. The rifle is in 45-70 which is a great caliber which I do intend on using, but I want something with a bit more guts at range as well. I've been reading through the forum and quite a bit seems to be mentioned about the 45-90 but very little about the 45-110. For long range, 800 yards +, would the 45-90 be the cartridge to go with or would the 45-110 be better? I realize the 45-110 would have a bit more recoil but I don't think it would make a huge difference. Also at the longer ranges what bullets would be best?

[dodd3]

mam the 45/110 is a grate cartridge so is the 45/90 depends wot you wont it for. if you are going to shoot black powder only then go for the 45/110 if you wont to shoot smokeless as well the go for the 45/90 its a better case  for smokeless hope this is sum help  
bernie :grin:

[Timberlake]

mam40K,

Having rifles in 45-70 and (2) 45-90's I would tell you to go to a 45-90.  As pointed out, it's more versatile for use with both smokelss and bp.  Besides, if you find it's not to your liking you can always open it up to 45-110.  But once you master the 2.4 you may not wish to go farther.

TL

[mam40k]

Thanks for the advise. I will probably be sticking with Black Powder only. It does seem that the 45-90 is the more popular of the two though. It may be a good idea to start there then move to the 110 if I get the urge to have something bigger.

Thx

Mark

[Ray Newman]

Besides a .45-2.1" (AKA .45-70), I also shoot, load, & cast for a .45-2.4" (AKA .45-90) & a .45- 2 7/8 (AKA .45-110).

Don't feel that a .45-2.1" will not carry out to an extended range. It will, but you need to work around its limitations. For shooting paper/plinkin'/huntin',  it will do the job.

If you are just going to reload w/ White/Nitro Powder (AKA Smokeless), it will be hard to beat a .45-2.1".

& if you are going to limit yourself to only BP, it is a most forgiving round to learn the 'how to' of reloading & casting for a BPCR.

Now for loading w/ Black powder & for extended range shooting &  hunting, the .45-2.4" will have the edge. But this edge will come @ a price: more trigger time to develop an accurate load & conscientious & meticulous load development to deal w/ BP fouling & bullet alloy & lube selection.  

The .45- 2 7/8 is a very fussy round to get to shoot. But once the Shooter has The Load, it will perform & perform very well indeed. Hard to beat it for long range work or a powerful hunting round, esp. w/ heavy bullet. But it will foul excessively unless the load is carefully developed.

Both the .45-2.4" 7 the .45- 2 7/8" are a step up in terms of  reloading costs. The dies & brass are much more expensive & of course a pound of powder doesn't last as long when loading heavier charges.

If the Shooter is not careful w/ the selection of stock design & type of butt plate as well as a heavier barrel, the .45- 2.4" & the One-Ten will take a toll in terms of recoil. A lightweight rifle in these calibers or one w/ too much drop in the stock isn't fun to shoot. My One-Ten, a rebuilt Borchardt, weights in @ just 'bout 14 pounds & it will get tiring, esp. when shooting a 545grn bullet & a 100 grain + load.

But the crux to the weight issue is the requirements of the shooting disciplines. NRA sanctioned silhouette has a weight limit of 10 pounds, 2 oz, inc. sights; NRA BPCR Long Range, 15 pounds, inc. sights. If the Shooter wants to compete in NRA sanctioned events,  the weight limits must be considered.

While it can be done, it is not wise to load White Powder in the larger cases, as the am't of space occupied by the powder is very little & it is very easy to over/double charge a hull & a wad to ensure bettrer powder ignition can lead to chamber ringing.

However, to control the fouling, increase velocity, lower the trajectory, etc. a Shooter could develop a Duplex Load ( a small White powder  placed 1st in the hull, then filled w/ BP). However, a Shooter must be very careful doing so. Unless a Shooter has his/her wits 'bout him/her & has experience reloading a BPCR, I generally don't recommend such a load.

You said that you are 'newbie' to BPCR. below is a link to a thread that has links to on-line casting & reloading primers. Reloading & casting for a BPCR is not like reloading w/ White powder.

http://www.graybeardoutdoors.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=72361&sid=e712b227f8f7c1be4d47d5f0ee5eef37

I also strongly urge you to visit the Shiloh-Sharps web site & do a search on the various calibers that you are interested in. There is a  treasure-trove of information on that site. Esp. do a search for Kenny Wasserburger & rdnck. Both of these Shooters are very successful LR & One-Ten shooters.

http://www.shilohrifle.com/forums/index.php

The rdnck is also the moderator of the GOEX BPCR site.
http://goexpowder.com/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=15

[TexasMac]

Concerning the NRA BPCR Silhouette weight limit, I believe Ray made an error.  The official limit is 12 lbs. 2 oz.  I just double-checked the Official NRA Rule Book.

Wayne

[mam40k]

Thanks for all the information. It's becoming quite clear to me there's only one solution. One of each  Then after the wife finds out it's over :lol:

Mark

[sharps4590]

Ray's info is difficult if not impossible to improve upon.  

I've owned several 45-70 and all were relatively easy to make shoot and shoot accurately.  I currenly have a 45-2.4 and a 45-2.6.  Ray's info regarding time to develop a satisfactory load for the larger cases should be well considered.  My 2.4 took a while but came without much blood, sweat and tears but the 2.6......there was much wailing and gnashing of teeth before I came up with a suitable load.  As Ray said, fouling is the culprit.  

I've not  tried any Swiss or the other couple newer powders on our market so they may make life more simple.  

I agree with you that owning a rifle in each caliber is the proper solution.  While there is not a thing wrong with re-chambering, I've had it done, I'd sure hate to change a rifle I have shooting to my satisfaction.  Good luck!

Vic

[Dana C]

While this is an old thread, I thought I would add my $.02.  I have a C Sharps that was originally chambered in 45-70.  I had it reamed out to 45-90 which as you suggest, gives it additional range and power.  
What is even better about the 45-90, you can shoot 45-70's in it as well.
In fact my Sharps shoots to just about the same point of impact at 100 yards with either round.  At 200 yards the difference is greater and so on.
the 45-100 or 110 are both hard to get a load worked up for and are more expensive to shoot.  In fact, BP is not real efficient in large amounts and a good portion of the powder goes unburned in some of the larger rounds.  
Having said that, I have a Meachum in 45-3.25 or as some call it 45-120.
It is a hoot to shoot.....makes a lot of smoke, bruises your shoulder and looks really impressive.  However, it really doesn't shoot any better or kill any better than a 45-90.

[MontanaTrailboss]

I was just wondering how you shoot a 45-70 in a 45-90  and what it cost to ream it out to a 45-90 ,   would this be a better way to go.   On my IAB 45-70 with a 28in barrel.   I was just looking into options.    Is a 45-90 better for longer ranges then a 45-70.

thanks

[Ray Newman]

"I was just wondering how you shoot a 45-70 in a 45-90...."

It works the same way as shooting a .38 Spcl. in a .357.

When you say "long range", what are you talking about?

Traditionally LR is 800, 900, 1000 yds+.

I've seen some cowboy type & informal matches claim that 200 yds is "LR".

The .45-2.1", AKA .45-70, while it will reach to 1000 yds, starts to labor @ 'bout 800 yds, whereas the .45-2.4" (erroneously AKA .45-90) keeps right on moving along.

Depending upon the weight of the rifle & the stock/butt plate design, a .45-2.4" can be uncomfortable to shoot, esp. when shooting the heavier Creedmoor type bullets , shooting prone, &/or for long shooting strings.

I have no idea what it would cost to ream out the chamber. If you need to ship the rifle, inc. that in the total cost. I would speculate that John King or Lee Shaver have the requisite experience, knowledge, & the tooling to do the work. besides costs, ask about the timeframe to get the work done.

From what I've been told, the gunsmith must take care to line up & fit the reamer pilot to the throat, otherwise, the chamber maybe canted in relationship to the bore.

[BigBossMan]

Hi.  How would I get in touch with the gunsmiths that are good at changing the 45-70 to a 45-90?  I appreciate your time to reply.  Thanks