.22mag vs .17HM2

[williamlayton]

help me in my thinking---considering the followin criteria.
Shooting at 100 yards
Paper punching and plinking
Ammo cost
Ammo availibility
Now I am concerned, on one level, about the HM2 because no one makes it in a semi and it seems that it might be just a passing fad.
I like it for velocity and accuracy proclaimed at 100 yds---but I have "0" experience with the mag.
It is just a toy to plink with and I can't see me hunting with either.
Blessings

[Defoe]

the .22 magnum is more versatile in my mind.  squirrels to yotes.  and the guns and ammo are easier to find.

[Keith L]

The 17HM2 is more accurate IMO than a 22 mag.  For paper punching it would be my choice.  I have a couple of each and for the most part the 22 mags sit in the safe.

[mechanic]

22 mag has more down range energy due to heavier bullet.  17 HMR makes mush out of squirrils, but is supremely accurate.  I can repeatedly hit dimes at 150yds. 
 
Ben

[Victor3]

I can repeatedly hit dimes at 150yds. 
 
Ben

 Wow... <1/2 MOA @ 150? You might have the most accurate 17 HMR rifle ever produced. Or does "repeatedly" mean once a month? 

[Ladobe]

William - per your criteria the 17HM2 (or 17HMR) is the ticket if bug holes is your goal... no 22LR is going to shoot more accurate than the M2.    The ammo cost is less than half to a third with the M2 verses the 17HMR, but the Hummer easily buys you 2-3 or more times the range on the other end.   The M2 a fad?   Not to me, but unfortunately they didn't catch on as well as the 17HMR did, so many makers stopped making firearms for them.  Too bad, they are an easy choice over a 22LR for anything.  The 17HMR might be overkill for your uses (besides costing more to shoot) because you start shooting them at 100 yards and go way out from there.  At the first Digger Wars I set 150 yards as the minimum range for a shots, rifle and handgun centerfires, and when the 17HMR came along they too had to start at 150 yards.   In 2003 I subtitled that 10 days shoot "The Year of the 17's", and even though everybody showed up with all their 17 wildcats, they also brought their 17HMR's (most had at least 2 of them), and it was the 17HMR's that got shot the most. 
 
RE all the comments so far... comparing the 22MAG to the 17HM2 is about like comparing it to the 22LR, a comparison not on the same page.   The comparisons that make sense are 22LR/17HM2 and the 22MAG/17HMR.
 
comrade -  The 22MAG does not outshine the 17HM2 for tree squirrels, in fact the M2 is the optimum choice for tree rats over any 22RF.    Fine if you want to blow them up, or for ground squirrels, but not if a squirrel you want to eat.   As for coyotes, as above not a valid comparison to the M2, but add the 17HMR to the mix and the 22MAG takes the back seat again.  Shot placement and hydrostatic shock with the 17HMR more than make up for the difference in bullet weight of the 22MAG.   
 
mechanic - keep in mind that naysayers obviously have no experience with the 17 rimfires pard.     I actually have pictures of dimes shot with one of my 17HMR's, the 1/4 MOA one.  Only at 100 yards, but one with a three shot group in it makes it obvious at 150 would also be doable.
 
I base my opinions on long expereince (longer than anyone else with the 17HMR), the 17HM2 from having owned 3 of them (still have 2), and the 17HMR's from also owning 3 of them (still have 1), including the first privately owned AND that was the most accurate of any of the others it ever shot beside - lots of them.  I wasn't a paper puncher, I was a hunter, but it did 5-shot 100 yard groups in the high 1's to very low 2's the day I sighted it in at 100 and then out to my chosen PBR; and my #2 Hummer did the same in the mid 2's, so a dime would be child's play consistently with either of them.   I took small game well past 300 yards with them.  I lost track of how many 1000's of rounds I shot in them, probably between 15K-20K.   And after sight in all of that for longer range ground squirrels, jackrabbits and quite a few predators, including several coyotes past 200.   So I think I have a pretty good idea from experience what the 17HM2 and 17HMR are capable of on paper and flesh.   They worked so well for me that they retired all of my 22RF's in turn soon after each of the carts came out.

[Victor3]

 
 
mechanic - keep in mind that naysayers obviously have no experience with the 17 rimfires pard.     I actually have pictures of dimes shot with one of my 17HMR's, the 1/4 MOA one. Only at 100 yards, but one with a three shot group in it makes it obvious at 150 would also be doable.
 
I base my opinions on long expereince (longer than anyone else with the 17HMR)

 Interesting Ladobe -  You say that dimes @ 150 "would also be doable." But even with your superior experience concerning the HMR, you've never actually seen it, just note that it's "doable." That's a far cry from the claimed "repeatedly" pard.

My CZ 452 Varmint HMR with Leupold V-X III 6.5 -20 x 50 is my most accurate rimfire past 100 yds. However, with just a 5 mph crosswind, a 17 gr V-Max drifts ~4" (~6 dimes, lol) @ 150. Couple that with the fact there is no "match" ammo available in 17 HMR (meaning  there is usually enough velocity deviation @ 150 to put you off of a dime-sized target shot-to-shot).

The fine duplex on my Leupold at 20x completely covers a dime at 150 yds. I imagine you must use a much higher power scope, and have a lot better vision than I do. And be a much better shot. And a better wind doper. And have a superior rifle.

But even with all the above at your disposal, you've admitted that you can't hit a dime repeatedly past 100 yds. Thanks for your honesty...

[Redhawk1]

For me it would be the 22MAG. I have a Savage  with the accu-trigger. It is a tack driver. Been shooting it at 100 yards, and the gun is a MOA shooter. I can put 10 out of 10 shots in a one inch square at 100 yards. I have to move out to 150, and see what it will do there. For me the heavier bullet, and bigger hole  is what I want. Sold my Savage 17HMR, it shot very good, but the bullet weight is what sold me on the 22MAG.

[Ladobe]

 
 
mechanic - keep in mind that naysayers obviously have no experience with the 17 rimfires pard.     I actually have pictures of dimes shot with one of my 17HMR's, the 1/4 MOA one. Only at 100 yards, but one with a three shot group in it makes it obvious at 150 would also be doable.
 
I base my opinions on long expereince (longer than anyone else with the 17HMR)

 Interesting Ladobe -  You say that dimes @ 150 "would also be doable." But even with your superior experience concerning the HMR, you've never actually seen it, just note that it's "doable." That's a far cry from the claimed "repeatedly" pard.

But even with all the above at your disposal, you've admitted that you can't hit a dime repeatedly past 100 yds. Thanks for your honesty...

Never tried to shoot at a dime at 150 yards with any of my 17HMR's... that is very true.   I said I believe it to be doable - no more, no less, but also true because of my long experience with the 17HMR and repeatedly doing similar at 150  yards with them.   I never said I couldn't do it.    Your reference to that is just your sarcastic words, not mine and a misquote.
 

[Keith L]

Victor3, you have made your point.  lets get back on topic.  You have posted here enough to know that we don't get into flaming on GBO. 

[Victor3]

 Yep, you're right Keith.


 My apologies to all. Shoulda kicked the dog instead...

[cwlongshot]

Well then....

My first choice is the 22Maggie..... BUT my use is mostly hunting.

I have to admit that the 17's are usually more accurate, Many times MUCH more accurate. For target use only IMHO hands down one of the 17s will have you grinning at its accuracy.

Easilly under 1/2 moa with the couple I have shot. I just lent one of my H&R 17HMRs to a good friend. He sat at the bench with some of those 3/8"-1/2'' black repair pasters that come with Shoot n See targets on paper at 100 yards. He shot them MORE than he missed and when he missed it was NEVER more than a 1/8-1/4''.
My group pf hunters/shooters we all have at least one 17 and every one will do at least this good.

CW

[tuck2]

I have two Anschultz 22 LR RF rifles and a Kimber of Oregon Mdl 82 22WMR rifle.  My  Cooper 57 M LVT 17 HM2 and 17 HMR rifles are well made  and accurate like the 22 RF rifles.  My rifles are only shot off a  bench rest to check ammo accuracy  and set the scope site at a 1.5 inch PBR point blank range.  When comparing the 40 Gr bullet from a 22 WMR, it will have more terminal energy at any range than the 17 Gr bullet from a 17 HM2.  There are a number of bullet weights available for the 22 WMR while only one a 17 Gr bullet for the 17 HM2 rifle. While the trajectory curve are much the same for the 40  Gr and 17 Gr bullets..but I have not compared the lighter 22 bullets to the 17 bullet. Which rifle I use depends upon the size of the game , varmint, or preditor hunted.  My experince is  somewhat limited to shooting cotten tail rabbits, jack rabbits, but most shots are at prairie dogs. Because of the  40 Gr bullet drop I could use the 22 WMR and 17 HM2 for the closer shots at p dogs .  But if a coyote came within 125 yards when shooting p dogs  with the 17 I would be wishing that I had the 22 WMR rifle.  For eating cottentail rabbits any shot  with the 17 or 22 ,other than a head shot will bloody a lot of meat. Most often the  22 WMR is compared to the 17 HMR.  Since getting the 17 HM2, and 17 HMR rifles the 22 rifles stays at home  when going after prairie dogs.