Author Topic: Under-appreciated cars?  (Read 791 times)

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Offline Conan The Librarian

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Under-appreciated cars?
« on: October 29, 2012, 07:25:46 AM »
My kid needs a car and like a lot of people he gravitates toward model names that are well known. I'm recommending that he research cars that are common, not well appreciated, but pretty good. You can save some real money that way. Buick Century, Chevy Cavalier. You can find em cheap and they are OK for a first car.  They built a bunch of them and every mechanic knows how to work on them.
 
Got any ideas for other models that are good but relatively under appreciated, and good values.

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #1 on: October 29, 2012, 07:36:02 AM »
I don't know how under-appreciated, but most of the kids that we know get a used honda for a first car.
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Offline Conan The Librarian

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #2 on: October 29, 2012, 07:40:08 AM »
The hondas and toyotas are the popular cars, and they command a high price. You can get a cavalier in pretty good shape for under a grand.

Offline lakota

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #3 on: October 29, 2012, 07:46:49 AM »
I think the pre 2000 Jeep Cherokee is under appreciated. That 4.0 straight 6 will still be running after the body is reduced to dust


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Offline yellowtail3

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #4 on: October 29, 2012, 07:47:37 AM »
Look for a mid/late 90s Ford Escort/Mercury Tracer WAGON. I've had two of them, and they're excellent. Reliability is very good. They're cheap to buy, easy to work on, parts are plentiful and cheap. Best bang for the buck, BY FAR, is the wagon with a five-speed. I regularly get 35-38mpg in mine (2nd one I've owned) and can crack 40mpg if I try really really really hard (but 35-38 is very attainable, daily). Lots of space inside. I can carry my Summit climber and a nice eight-pointer in it, along with plenty of gear.

check 'em out...
About six years ago... little cowhorn, girls littler, both Escorts in view... I've still got the green on in the background.

I think the pre 2000 Jeep Cherokee is under appreciated. That 4.0 straight 6 will still be running after the body is reduced to dust
He's right... I used to have one of those, too!
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Offline Empty Quiver

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #5 on: October 29, 2012, 10:03:03 AM »
Ford Taurus
 
 A jillion of them out there, when is the last time someone told you their Taurus was a wonderful chick magnet? Ever hear  a kid say they want one to turn into a tuner? Have you even seen one street racing?
 
Mid to late 90's Explorer
 
Lot's of them were well maintained and easily driven by soccer moms. Probably gonna be second or even third owner by now, so do your homework. I own a used '97 one 205k on the clock, body has started getting rough here and there. It runs like a top though. It still pulls hard, is quiet, rides... ok it rides choppy as hell (new shocks and good tires), has all options short of a V-8. 70,000 miles and 5 years ago I gave $4000 for it. I would take that deal again in a New York minute. I've had the door latches and lock mechanism rebuilt, a new alternator, a u-joint, and a tie rod end replaced. I put shocks, brakes and tires on it shortly after buying it, now a second set of tires.
 
Get the Explorer, in my experience anyway.
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Offline yellowtail3

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #6 on: October 29, 2012, 10:06:48 AM »
if a taurus, go for the wagon. huge space. AVOID THE 3.8L ENGINE - terrible. It will break.
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Offline Ranger99

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #7 on: October 29, 2012, 11:14:54 AM »
3.8's have head gasket issues.
in the escort avoid the 1.8 engine.


any model of any make check the radiator
for rust. if the water looks like a rust milkshake
pass on the vehicle.


stick with the 3.0 on the taurus
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Offline Conan The Librarian

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #8 on: October 29, 2012, 11:40:17 AM »
I do profile sellers of used cars, and don't like the soccer moms. They are hard on machines. I like cars owned by 40-60 year old men with homes that look like they are reasonably well maintained. I want to see service records. People who take care of their stuff keep them.
 
 
 
 

Offline Conan The Librarian

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #9 on: October 29, 2012, 11:47:28 AM »
Oh yeah, the Escort. Super car, and a great value too. I forgot about those. Got 'em on the radar screen now.
 
I can say a few things about over-appreciated cars. My wife has had two Dodge Caravans. Garbage. The comfort of a midieval torture chamber, the reliability of a house of cards in a windstorm, the durability of a match flame, the repair costs of the space shuttle, and the handling of a pogo stick.

Offline Empty Quiver

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #10 on: October 29, 2012, 11:56:30 AM »
I do profile sellers of used cars, and don't like the soccer moms. They are hard on machines. I like cars owned by 40-60 year old men with homes that look like they are reasonably well maintained. I want to see service records. People who take care of their stuff keep them.
Yes they can be, but in the grand scheme of things not so bad.
 
Now a teenage kid in the house or apartment dwellers, and not to disparage appt. dwellers, as I fit that description for a few years. They don't tend to have the place or means to keep up on the routine repairs and tend to let stuff go that isn't mission critical. Fluid changes for instance, cheap at home but not at a shop, good brake jobs same story. Keepin the car clean and a coat of wax applied a couple times a year. I would not buy anything from a single mother not even on a bet, and a single man ain't really high on the list either  ;)  too much in common with a teenage kid. ;D
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Offline Doublebass73

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #11 on: October 29, 2012, 12:00:29 PM »
1st place for the most under appreciated cars goes to the Ford Crown Victoria/Mercury Grand Marquis. For the money you can't beat these. They hold their value worse than most other cars so you can get a used one very cheap with low miles since most are owned by elderly people. I've owned many of these and they've all been good and go for many miles with few problems. They also get respectable gas mileage for their size - low 20's in the city and high 20's on the highway so they usually average mid 20's combined.

Another good suggestion is the Jeep Cherokee. I own a '99 with the 4.0 straight six. I bought it back in '07 with 148K on it for $3950. It now has 251K on it and still runs great. It's a 5 speed standard and averages 23-25 mpg. The repair costs have been very minimal, it's one of the best buys on a used vehicle I've ever made. I wish they hadn't discontinued the engine in '06  :'(

I also agree with your profile of soccer moms, they beat the crap out of minivans and SUV's and tend to either not care or be very reluctant about routine maintenance.
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Offline hillbill

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2012, 01:11:14 PM »
you mite look at the nissan sentra or altima in the 95 to 2000 year model range. ive seen several nice ones around here go for 2 to 3000 bucks. the sentra gets awesum mileage. my 97 got 38.5 mpg on my last fill up. fairly simple mechanically and cheap to buy parts for. ive had 3 and i would definitely buy another.

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2012, 02:06:19 PM »
stick with the 3.0 on the taurus
my has the sable 3.0 with around 150,000 miles.  that engine is pretty bullet-proof.
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Offline hunt-m-up

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #14 on: October 29, 2012, 02:19:58 PM »
The Buick Century was a good suggestion,we bought a 2000 from my Dad's estate this past summer for my daughter's first car. I still like to drive it myself, man does it ride nice. Had a Taurus with the 3.8 bad head gasket/s, last Ford car I owned, their F150/F250 only for me from now on. If you find a GM with a 3.8, that was a very good motor.
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Offline Sourdough

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #15 on: October 29, 2012, 06:56:03 PM »
I agree with the Ford Taurus, but my Attorney friend recommends every kid should drive an old F-250.  In a crash they are safer than a car, and gas mileage is so bad the kids don't do a lot of driving.

I had a little different outlook for my son's first vehicle.  A car just would not cut it.  Since we live in North Pole, Alaska.  And our son would be driving into Fairbanks everyday to school, a 45 mile round trip.  He needed 4 Wheel drive, and studded snow tires.  Here is what happened, and a side affect of the vehicle I got for him.  Some food for thought.   

We looked at a KIA Sportage for him.  He was OK with it, his mother liked it because it had 4 wheel drive.  We bought it with the understanding I would pay half he would pay the other half.  We had promised that if he maintained A's and B's in school we would help him with his first car.  We bought it 6 months before he got his license.  His Mom drove it back and forth to work during that time.  She had been driving an F-150 4X4 extended cab/ long bed.  She had hit every curb she got near, several trees, mailboxes, and had gone into the ditch so many times she had Mike's towing on speed dial.  Don't know how many mirrors I had replaced on the passengers side.

Sky got his license, and drove the KIA to school one day.  All the girls heard Sky was driving and went out at lunch time for a ride to Sam's Club.  (Nearest place for Pizza, only two blocks from the school)  The girls only had one thing to say, "It's cute".  Last time Sky drove the KIA.  He went back to riding the school bus.  Plus the wife was happy, she had not hit anything like curbs, trees, mailboxes, or gone into the ditch with the little SUV.  She could park it without running over the bumper blocks and getting stuck in parking lots.  She wanted to keep the KIA.  So I decided a young boy living in Alaska needed a 4X4 pickup truck.  Now here is where it got interesting.

I had looked at a 4X4 Chevy S-10 with the ZR-2 package.  Larger wheels and tires from the factory, and lifted to fit the bigger wheels and tires.  Black fender flairs, and a bright Electric Yellow color.  Sky was so thrilled with that truck, because it looked so sharp.  All the girls thought it was sharp as well.  For two weeks every thing was cool as far as I knew.  Then Sky came to me one night and said, "Dad the worst thing you ever did was get me that yellow truck".  "Every North Pole police officer, Fairbanks police officer, MP on Ft Wainwright, and every Alaska State Trooper in the Fairbanks area, feels that truck needs to be pulled over".  I don't dare speed, run a stop sign, drive erratic, or park anywhere near a bar".  "They pull me over two to three times a night after a hockey game as I drive home".  "I don't have to do anything to get pulled over, it's that yellow truck".  He drove it for his last two years to high school, and transfered from the Catholic school in Fairbanks to North Pole so he would not have to face the Fairbanks police and the State Troopers on the highway from town.  Then he started driving it to UAF, back on the highway to town and through Fairbanks.  Same thing as for being stopped by the police and troopers.  Only now he was driving at night due to late classes and labs at the University, and the fact it gets dark here at 4 PM during the winter.  Everytime he got stopped now the first thing they asked is "What you been drinking"?  They never let him get away without blowing into the little device to check his breath.  Sky does not drink. 

I bought a Mitsubishi Eclipse for myself, I like high performance cars.  When I went on vacation that year, Sky had trouble with the transfer case on the Chevy and had to put it in the shop.  His Mother told him to drive my car to school.  When I returned Sky came to me saying, " Mom said if I pay you the difference between your Eclipse and my Chevy I can keep the Eclipse".   I became the owner of a yellow Chevy S-10.

The first week I drove it I was stopped five times.  Every time the cop was shocked when they saw an old fat man with a gray beard in the drivers seat.  One cop even said, "This truck belongs to a teenager, what are you doing driving it"?  I had a talk with Jerry Cleworth, the Mayor of Fairbanks over that one.  Jerry and I are old friends.

A side note, the wife drove the KIA for nine years.  She went into the ditch a few times but she was able to lock it into 4 wheel drive and drive out.  She no longer hit trees, curbs, or bumper blocks.  She could park it since it was so small, it fit her well.  But alas the little SUV needed to go away, 160K and it had developed issues.  I bought her a Jeep Wrangler, made a mistake, did not have her drive it first.  When snow hit and she parked her sports car for the winter, she got into the Jeep and discovered she can not reach the peddles.  She can not push the clutch far enough to start the engine.  The clutch has to be pushed to the floor before the engine will start, and her legs are too short, she is only 4'11".  She is the new driver of the S-10, I now drive the Jeep.  She is OK with it, she likes looking down on all the cars.
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Offline Victor3

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #16 on: October 29, 2012, 10:46:54 PM »

I can say a few things about over-appreciated cars. My wife has had two Dodge Caravans. Garbage. The comfort of a midieval torture chamber, the reliability of a house of cards in a windstorm, the durability of a match flame, the repair costs of the space shuttle, and the handling of a pogo stick.

 Agreed. I bought a new Plymouth Voyager in 1995 and had it for 9 years. The Mitsubishi V6 it had never gave me any trouble but the body, suspension and interior was falling apart after 5 years.
 
 I have friends who swear by diesel cars/trucks because the engines generally last longer than gas. But who cares about a good engine if it's in a piece of rolling trash where you have to pay $120 to replace a door handle?  ???
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Offline Victor3

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #17 on: October 29, 2012, 11:26:11 PM »
The hondas and toyotas arethe popular cars, and they command a high price.

 There may be a reason for that.  :)
 
 Just traded my 2000 Accord V6 in on a 2012 Civic last month. The Accord was in the shop twice in 12 years; once for a water leak I couldn't locate and once for a seatbelt sensor (replaced for free even though it was out of warantee). Only time it ever actually 'broke down' was for an alternator, which I replaced myself. Every interior and body part was original and in good shape when I traded it. Only had to replace tires, battery, brake pads and other normal wear parts in the time I owned it.
 
 I have a 2008 Toyota Tacoma 4x4 (my 2nd Tacoma) that hasn't been in the shop or needed repairs of any kind yet.
 
 I've had  Hondas and Toyotas here and there since the early 80's. Most reliable and lowest overall cost to own vehicles I've ever had. I'm happy to lay out more initial cash for them over other brands.
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Offline magooch

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #18 on: October 30, 2012, 03:49:41 AM »
Get the 2005 and newer Toyota Tacoma with the four banger and a stick and your set for ever.
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Offline Conan The Librarian

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #19 on: October 30, 2012, 05:59:58 AM »
Our criteria are it's gotta be under $1000 and probably OK to last for up to two years. He just needs something to get him to work while he's in school.
 
A high miles commuter car is what we're looking for because it's got so many miles on it, it's not worth much, and it's a model that is not automatically popular like honda civic, but will still get the job done.
 
My first one like that was an old chevette that I paid $100 for. I put a few hundred into it, then drove it for two years until it literally fell apart, starting with the side windows. I drove that car on a couple of long road trips and it served me well. And then it hit the end of its service life rather abruply, but I knew I needed a new car and had a replacement lined up.
 
To change the topic slightly, I live well outside the city and a lot of people that used pickups and SUVs have gone to using smaller cars. I see a lot of nice looking pickups and SUVs for the $2000 to $2500 range. Pretty nice opportunity for somebody needing a truck or SUV.

Offline Dixie Dude

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #20 on: October 30, 2012, 06:14:46 AM »
My son is 20, got a 1992 Buick for about $1,000 and about 80,000 miles (owned by elderly lady) when he was 16.  Still drives it.  He has about 120,000 on it now.  AC went out, so he is going to wait until spring to fix it.  He is in the national guard.  He has been called up to go to Afganistan next August.  He said with his pay he would be getting, he wants a 4wd Toyota Tacoma truck when he gets back, a good used one.  You guys be in prayer for him and his safety.  He is under the Army Corp of Engineers, so don't know what he will be doing.  They are supposed to pull out by 2014, so he may be helping pack up the regulars stuff.  Hope they don't get him to help build schools.  They don't like schools over there, especially for girls. 
 
My daughter had a Cherokee, good engine, but bad electrical stuff.  Wiring kept shorting out and draining her battery.  It was and 80's model.  Know someone who had a Calvalier, but chrome trim started falling off.  It was just snapped in and the snaps started breaking.  Crown Vics were/are very good cars, good mileage for a large car. 
 
VW diesels get as good or better mileage than hybrids, but may be hard to find in a used one. 
 

Offline rkeltner

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #21 on: October 30, 2012, 07:51:28 AM »
i'll; speak up for any gm product with a 3.8. like some others here, i tend to buy older cars with high milage on them, and gms, particularly buicks, with the 3.8 v6 are hands down the most reliable used car i've found.   one that we bought, an olds 98 of 92 vintage for my son. had 320,000 mi's when we bought it, and something well south of 400,000 when he sold it. in his 5 yrs driving it, we did maintenance/wear repairs..suspension, brake work, struts, fluid changes, the most major repair was the water pump, which is a bit of a pain on those engines because of the motor mount design. lost track of it after the sale, but would not be even a little suprised if it was still on the road! have half a dozen other stories almost as impressive. the 3.8 is am good one to look for in gms

Offline BUGEYE

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #22 on: October 30, 2012, 08:21:20 AM »
+1 on the toyota tacoma.   mine is a 4cyl automatic bought new in 99.  it just turned up 65000 miles.
still has the original brakes and front tires.  at the last oil-change my mechanic told me the front tires are dry-rotted, so it's getting front tires and brakes thursday.
when you look under the hood, it looks brand-new.
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Offline Doublebass73

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #23 on: October 30, 2012, 01:27:53 PM »
Our criteria are it's gotta be under $1000 and probably OK to last for up to two years. He just needs something to get him to work while he's in school.
 
A high miles commuter car is what we're looking for because it's got so many miles on it, it's not worth much, and it's a model that is not automatically popular like honda civic, but will still get the job done.
 
My first one like that was an old chevette that I paid $100 for. I put a few hundred into it, then drove it for two years until it literally fell apart, starting with the side windows. I drove that car on a couple of long road trips and it served me well. And then it hit the end of its service life rather abruply, but I knew I needed a new car and had a replacement lined up.
 
To change the topic slightly, I live well outside the city and a lot of people that used pickups and SUVs have gone to using smaller cars. I see a lot of nice looking pickups and SUVs for the $2000 to $2500 range. Pretty nice opportunity for somebody needing a truck or SUV.

Conan,

That makes for an easy decision if your budget is under $1000. Grand Marquis/Crown Vic or (even though I don't like Government Motors) a Buick LeSabre with the 3.8 that's been mentioned. Think about how bad a police Crown Vic gets abused while in police service for 75K to 100K miles. After that they get auctioned off to cab companies who then proceed to run them 24/7 in hard city environments for another 300K - 400K miles. You can easily find these cars for under $1000.

 
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Offline mrcooper

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #24 on: October 31, 2012, 03:37:28 AM »
It's been great reading about auto, I have eliminated a lot of auto problems by NOT buying American junk, my last one was and I sill have it a 1995 Dodge 3/4 ton PU. its sitting in my drive way that I bought new, with great hunks of paint falling off it and the head liner has fallen down has 35k original miles. have a 99 Honda Accord that has been great and i also have a 94 Toyota PU with 129K on it a great auto.

Offline Doublebass73

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #25 on: October 31, 2012, 05:57:06 AM »
It's been great reading about auto, I have eliminated a lot of auto problems by NOT buying American junk, my last one was and I sill have it a 1995 Dodge 3/4 ton PU. its sitting in my drive way that I bought new, with great hunks of paint falling off it and the head liner has fallen down has 35k original miles. have a 99 Honda Accord that has been great and i also have a 94 Toyota PU with 129K on it a great auto.

Aren't Hondas and Toyotas made in America?
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Offline lakota

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #26 on: October 31, 2012, 09:17:57 AM »
Dont know about Toyota but there is a giant Honda factory about 3 hours from me.
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Offline Victor3

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #27 on: October 31, 2012, 11:16:39 PM »
 My 2008 Tacoma was built in CA at Toyota's plant (shared with GM) in Fremont. It was the last auto plant in CA, shut down in 2010.
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Offline FPH

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Re: Under-appreciated cars?
« Reply #28 on: October 31, 2012, 11:30:34 PM »
I had a Buick Regal with the 3.8 L engine......good car.  My 04 Dodge P/U with a Cummins has 345,000 miles on it.