Author Topic: .22 Hornet, .22 K-Hornet, which route to take? (Read 2812 times)

Dalgo · « **on:** December 12, 2011, 04:23:39 AM »

Hi, all. I have an SS Encore (pre-Pro Hunter) that I picked up NIB from a friend. It's in 7mm-08, w/24" factory barrel. I put a Leupy VX-3 1.5-5X on it, and is a well-balanced package. Shoots well. Now, I am thinking about getting an MGM barrel in .22 Hornet for it. Question to you knowledgeable folks is, go w/a .22 Hornet, or a .22 K-Hornet? What twist? Should I get another 24" barrel and put a 3-9X compact scope (or a lightweight scope, like a Swaro Z3), or go w/a 26" barrel? What contour - sporter or tapered heavy? Fluted or not? I want it as a walkabout rifle for chucks, yotes, rabbits, squirrels, and other targets of opportunity. Your valued opinions would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance,

Pierre

LaOtto222 · « **Reply #1 on:** December 12, 2011, 12:29:03 PM »

I have both the 22 Hornet in a Savage Model 40 and the 22K Hornet in a stubbed Handi. There is no question I would go with the 22K Hornet, unless you do not reload; then go with the 22 Hornet. Barrel length and configuration is a matter of personal choice. My 22K Hornet is 20" long and very thick with a 1 - 14" twist. The Model 40 is a 1 - 14" twist also and I highly recommend it for both Hornets. I wish the Handi barrel was smaller in diameter. I like the 20" length, but if I was to do it over, I would get a tapered barrel, but that is me.

I like the 22K Hornet because the cases last longer and it is generally easier to find accurate loads for...not because it has more case capacity. If you decide to go that way 12.8 grains of W296 (or H 110) in a Remington case sparked by a CCI 500 primer with a MidSouth 34 grain varmint nightmare is a very good load. It is easy on cases, gets 3150 fps and is about as cheap as it gets.

Here are some pictures of 5 shot groups at 100 yards from my Handi 22K Hornet

You can see it shoots pretty well no mater which load I use. There is no reason to think that an MGM barrel would do no less. The 1 - 14" twist will handle bullets up to 55 grains or so, which I think a 50 grain bullet is plenty for a 22 Hornet or 22K Hornet. You get more than that and you will have some trouble getting them to expand, that is my opinion on the twist rate.

As far as dies are concerned I use Redding dies. For neck sizing I use 221 FB die with bushings and for bullet seating, I use a 221 Fireball die that has a micro adjustable head. I use these because I have 221 Fire Ball rifles (one is a T/C 23" Bull) and had the dies already for them. They work because the cases are the same length. I use different bushings, because the neck thickness is different. I use a Redding FL die for the 22K Hornet if needed.

BTW I used 9.0 grains of Hodgdon Lil'Gun, 55 grain FMJ bullets, WW SR primers for fire forming the R-P cases. They did a good job of forming the cases and the bullets stabilized.

Good Luck and Good Shooting

Dalgo · « **Reply #2 on:** December 12, 2011, 06:52:17 PM »

LaOtto222, thanks for your reply and the valuable input. Man, those are some groups. Really good groups! I do believe I will go the "K" route, and definitely lean towards Redding dies. I'm liking the idea of a shorter contoured barrel. As long as I can get the balance somewhat over the hinge pin with a reasonable short and light (around 12 oz) scope, it will be very handy to carry. Being that the .22 hole is small, there is no need for a heavier barrel. I agree that a 45 gr bullet , or there abouts, would be ideal for that caliber (I am shooting 55-60 w/my .223). I read an article by Ross Seyfried in Handloader Mag many years ago, that "Lil' Gun" gave excellent results in the Hornet (and K-Hornet). Your efforts, via your groups seem to bear that out. Really like the results you're getting. I don't think that an MGM barrel will disappoint. I am liking your thoughts. Thanks again, LaOtto.

Pierre

Dalgo · « **Reply #3 on:** December 12, 2011, 06:53:26 PM »

LaOtto222, thanks for your reply and the valuable input. Man, those are some groups. Really good groups! I do believe I will go the "K" route, and definitely lean towards Redding dies. I'm liking the idea of a shorter contoured barrel. As long as I can get the balance somewhat over the hinge pin with a reasonable short and light (around 12 oz) scope, it will be very handy to carry. Being that the .22 hole is small, there is no need for a heavier barrel. I agree that a 45 gr bullet , or there abouts, would be ideal for that caliber (I am shooting 55-60 w/my .223). I read an article by Ross Seyfried in Handloader Mag many years ago, that "Lil' Gun" gave excellent results in the Hornet (and K-Hornet). Your efforts, via your groups seem to bear that out. Really like the results you're getting. I don't think that an MGM barrel will disappoint. I am liking your thoughts. Thanks again, LaOtto.

Pierre

Ladobe · « **Reply #4 on:** December 12, 2011, 09:36:04 PM »

I'd go with a 17 Ackley Hornet instead. Flatter, faster, !00 yard one hole groups are common place and it will handle your list of targets. A 20" bull barrel in 9 or 10 twist is more than good for them and will stabilize 17-30gr bullets. I'd go more than 9X on the scope if longer ranges are your norm - the cartridge is capable of them. Four 17AH's retired all of my 22 Hornets many years ago, and I never looked back. FWIW

LaOtto222 · « **Reply #5 on:** December 13, 2011, 02:05:05 PM »

Quote from: Ladobe on December 12, 2011, 09:36:04 PM

I'd go with a 17 Ackley Hornet instead. Flatter, faster, !00 yard one hole groups are common place and it will handle your list of targets. A 20" bull barrel in 9 or 10 twist is more than good for them and will stabilize 17-30gr bullets. I'd go more than 9X on the scope if longer ranges are your norm - the cartridge is capable of them. Four 17AH's retired all of my 22 Hornets many years ago, and I never looked back. FWIW

No doubt the small 17 is a good cartridge. Why not go with the new 17 Hornady Hornet, if you were to go that way. My first center fire rifle was an H&R 22 Hornet, my second was a 222 Remington 700 VS. I have been very partial to the .224 caliber guns especially the smaller .224's since, but that is a personal thing. I do have 1 22 BR rifle set up to run 75 - 80 grain bullets down it's 26" tube (the only fast twist .224 I own), the rest are .223 and under and most are 1 - 14" twist.

Good Luck and Good Shooting

Dalgo · « **Reply #6 on:** December 14, 2011, 06:43:32 PM »

Thanks, guys, but I'd like to stay with the .22 Hornet / K-Hornet idea. I already have a brand-new Anschutz 1770 .223 Rem. w/a 3-12X scope on it. Took my fall turkey with it. Verry accurate. Just want a walkabout middleweight balanced gun that will take small to mid sized (whatever mid-sized means) game, relatively low noise, easy to carry, etc., etc. For that kind of work, I don't need a big, heavy scope, nor a long barrelled gun. Not married to the Hornet, but not looking necessarily for a high-speed super light-bullet zipper either. Maybe .17 is too un-romantic a caliber? Don't have any experience with it. This time of year, with deer in remission till the day after CHRISTmas, when Flintlocks and bows become legal, a walk may turn up a coyote, fox, squirrel, rabbit, or assorted varmit animals, anywhere between 25-150 yds. After carrying my Encore in 7mm-08 during the deer season and loving how it balances and shoots, I just thought the same in a .22-sized package might do it for me. Hence, the idea of a .22 Hornet or K-Hornet.

tatonka · « **Reply #7 on:** December 22, 2011, 06:24:06 AM »

I vote for the K Hornet shooting Lil Gun with 40 gr Hornady Vmax. I have a couple K Hornets and they both love this powder and bullet. I'm loading to 2950 FPS with no signs of pressure problems. This is a sub MOA proposition with it being used mainly on stray dogs getting my chickens and coyote out to 200 yards. I download the Hornet to around 1500 FPS using 45 gr bullets for squirrel and rabbit. Good shooting!

Dalgo · « **Reply #8 on:** December 23, 2011, 03:44:19 AM »

I'm 'likin' your thoughts, Tatonka. Kinda thinkin along those lines. I think K-Hornet it is going to be. I do plan to reload for it. Now, what barrel length and contour? I'm thinkin because of the small hole maybe a standard contour of about 22 to 24 inches should do it. Or... do I go with a medium heavy of around 20 inches? Decisions, decisions. What do you all think?

Catfish · « **Reply #9 on:** December 23, 2011, 04:57:29 AM »

I like the K Hornet better for the reasons LaOtto stated. Longer case life and a little more knock down. I would go with a short lite barrel for a carry gun. With the small case capasity you don`t need a long barrel to burn all of the powder, or the extra weight to carry. A 14 twist will handle the 52 and 53 gr. Match bullets and there is no reason you would ever want to shoot any heaver bullets.

Drilling Man · « **Reply #10 on:** December 23, 2011, 11:54:52 AM »

Hornet or "K" hornet???

Over the years i've had quite a few hornets, and based on those experiences, i'd grab the "K" hornet and run!

DM

Dalgo · « **Reply #11 on:** December 24, 2011, 04:46:19 AM »

LaOtto, Tatonka, Cat Fish and DM, K-Hornet it will be! Now, given a tapered barrel, what length, and what scope to put on it do you all feel would be best, that will result in a balanced outfit (say over the hinge pin or slightly foreward)? This is a bit of a tough question, because wood and composite stocks balance differently. The Encore came with a beautiful thumb-hole grey and tan laminated set, whcih I took off because I felt they were too heavy. Put on a camo Flex butt and matching camo tapered forend (for the 24" barrel). That, with a Leupy 1.5-5X VX-3 balances beautifully on my 7mm-08 barrel. Originally I had put a Zeiss Conquest 3-9X, which I took off to put on my Valmet/Savage 2400 (12ga./.308), as DM suggested in another post, which gave me a longer eye-relief for that gun. The balance definitely changed with the lighter composite (plastic?) stock, and the scope change. The Leupy weighs 9 oz. and the Zeiss is 15 oz. Also much shorter. I would like to maintain the feel the Encore has now, so maybe a 2.5-8 Leupy Vx-3 on the K-Hornet barrel. But what length? What thinks ye all? Thanks for your valued opinions.

Pierre

OK hunter · « **Reply #12 on:** December 25, 2011, 06:17:21 AM »

Don't know what length to recommend but keep in mind longer barrels can always be shortened...
I like 20-21" bbls on my G2, for whatever that is worth...

Dalgo · « **Reply #13 on:** December 27, 2011, 03:28:53 AM »

OK H, 20-21" would probably be about right. As you state, it can always be shortened. Don't think any shorter than 20," though. Paired with a reasonably short scope, such as a Leupy 2.5-8 (11 oz) or a Swaro 3-9 (12 oz), it should make for a very balanced outfit. I realize the Encore is about a pound heavier than a G-2, but it's what I have, and the weight is reasonable enough. Thanks all for your inputs.

Pierre

martrage · « **Reply #14 on:** December 27, 2011, 02:35:50 PM »

Dalgo, Hello &welcome to the " TC Addiction Clinical Group" ! Now don't try 'nd tell me you're not like the rest of us 'cause you are ! Already asking for help w/ the next barrel/ caliber/length/bullet/ powder/twist/color/UUUMMMM. Sorry , started to lose it there! Anyway, I have said .22 Hornet(s) in several configurations. K-Hornet in 21" carbine Contender. Great cartridge. Use it in handgun mode w/ Burris 3x12 scope or long-gun w/ 4x12 Bushnell. Yes the 17 K-Hornet will be coming to stay with me someday soon also, but that Hornet w/ a good compact glass like a Burris on any 20 -23in. barrel will probably be close to ideal. I have popped of groundhogs&crows here in Central Pa. up to 300 yd's. Quiet, easy to feed, & w/ a V-max ,Blitzking,or Barnes Varmint Grenade, just awesome! Accuracy has never been a problem w/ anyone of 'em . All good suggestions from everyone, but you will really be well served w/K-Hornet for case life, as all "improved" type cases are. Dies cost a few dollars more up front but will pay off later with more loading life to cases. Have fun trying to figure it out.( The right caliber/weight/length/color/etc), I haven't yet, but it's been a heck of a ride!!

Dalgo · « **Reply #15 on:** December 30, 2011, 04:37:51 AM »

Thanks for the welcome, Martrage, here in NE PA there is an abundance of groundhogs and crows, and am dying to try my Encore on them. I don't know what it is about the Encore? I have some really neat bolt actions, including a new .223 Anschutz that is really accurate (used it to get a turkey with in Nov.), but I just love the feel of my Encore. It is quickly becoming my go-to gun. Would love to use it in a K-Hornet for turkeys this coming year, not to mention other critters. Yeah, it looks like I've been hit with the Encore virus. Didn't realize it attacked the brain like that, though. Now, for the question of whose barrel? In a very recent post I see there are issues with MGM. Don't need those problems. I guess that leaves SSK and/or Bulberry, and I'm leaning towards SSK, mainly because JD Jones seems to have an excellent reputation, and I had several conversations with him years ago that left me feeling that this was a man that I would like to do business with. Anybody have any experiences with SSK? The comments that you all post about Bulberry, the issues I should say, center around his delivery times, but other than that quality seems pretty high. What thinks ye?

pastorp · « **Reply #16 on:** December 31, 2011, 04:12:37 AM »

Why not buy a contender frame in 22Khornet with the 20" heavy barrel and have a much liter package than your encore..

SSK seems to be the only one you don't hear of bad customer service stories about. I'd buy from him I believe..

I just like the contender package better than the encore.....

Regards,

Dalgo · « **Reply #17 on:** December 31, 2011, 04:45:51 AM »

Pastorp, good point! I take it you mean a G-2? I have had that in the back of my mind, but I don't hear to much about G-2s, nor have I ever seen one around here in NE PA. I imagine someone has them in stock somewhere nearby. Would love to have one in my hands to find out what it feels like. I understand they are about a pound lighter. That may be the ticket. Have to make a concerted effort to find one. Thanks for the suggestion. "SSK seems to be the only one you don't hear of bad customer service stories about." Another good point! I understand his barrels are extremely accurate, also.

Pierre

Drilling Man · « **Reply #18 on:** December 31, 2011, 10:37:57 AM »

Quote from: pastorp on December 31, 2011, 04:12:37 AM

Why not buy a contender frame in 22Khornet with the 20" heavy barrel and have a much liter package than your encore.. SSK seems to be the only one you don't hear of bad customer service stories about. I'd buy from him I believe..

I just like the contender package better than the encore.....

Regards,

My brother has a G2 with a shorter .223 bbl. on it, and it shoots very good. He has made some long shots with it across the lake he lives on.

I'm thinking of buying a G2 and get a bbl. chambered for the NEW .17 Hornady Mag...

DM

LHitchcox · « **Reply #19 on:** December 31, 2011, 11:19:31 AM »

I have a Contender with both 23 inch .223 heavy and 20 inch K Hornet heavy barrels. I plan to sell the .223 barrel as I have just put together an AR 15 in 5.56. The 20 inch K Hornet is really handy. I love the K Hornet for the extra velocity and the fact that trimming is reduced almost to zero, not to mention that I enjoy having oddball calibers.

OK hunter · « **Reply #20 on:** January 02, 2012, 02:12:02 AM »

Dialgo,
Don't dismiss MGM because of one less than stellar report. I have done business with both MGM and Bullberry for years and have not experiences any issues. I have a barrel on order with MGM now and may well place another soon.
Good luck in your journey with custom shop barrels. I believe it's one of the true enjoyments that comes with single shot shooting.