Author Topic: What caliber (Read 1720 times)

Jkat · « **on:** November 24, 2003, 03:23:37 PM »

Ok, I have a confession. I don't own a rifle which would allow me to hunt for anything larger than coyotes. It's time I change this and don't know which all purpose caliber to start with. This spring I might be going on a black bear hunt in the north east and someday wish to try an elk hunt. Other than that and the occasional ground hog it will not get much use unless they change the law and allow NY residents to use rifles for deer season.

Leaning heavily towards the 30-06 and possibly the .270 or .308. Any thoughts or suggestions?

dbuz · « **Reply #1 on:** November 24, 2003, 03:42:28 PM »

7 mm rem. mag. I have a browning a bolt and it is awsome. A 139 gr. hornady will smoke in it and go half way around the world.

Zachary · « **Reply #2 on:** November 25, 2003, 04:16:58 AM »

Quote from: Jkat

Leaning heavily towards the 30-06 and possibly the .270 or .308. Any thoughts or suggestions?

You really can't go wrong with either.

The .30-06 and .308 are similar in performance, with the 30-06 having a bit more power, but at the sacrifice of a longer action. In addition, the .30-06 also has a bit more recoil, but nothing to be worried about. The 30-06 also has a wider range of available factory ammo, and can handle bullets larger than 180 grains better than a .308.

The .270 is, of course, an excellent cartridge in its own right. Only problem here is that bullet weights generally range from 130 to 150, whereas the .30 calibers are 150 to 220.

Hunting black bear, especially at closer distances, does not require a cannon. Same is true for elk. As such, the .270, with premium bullets can work just fine. However, the .30 calibers are, in my opinion, a better choice for black bear and elk.

If I had to chose between the three that you mentioned, then I would select the .30-06.

Zachary

Mikey · « **Reply #3 on:** November 25, 2003, 05:32:01 AM »

Jkat: Go with the 30-06, I feel it is a better all-around caliber. It shoots the heavier stuff better than the 308 and, from my perspective, outshoots the 270, which is a good cartridge in its own right but has a limited selection of bullet weights available. I don't follow the 7mm mag - you can do just as well if not better with the 06.

Now-if you want to hunt with a rifle, go up into the Northern Zones. If you are in Penfield you are probably so close to Rochester that it may be considered Southern Zone. If you foller the shore of Lake Ontario to the north and east you will run into rifle huntin' areas in the Northern Zones and your 06 will take anything you can find there, including big northern buck and bear. My favorite bullet weight for the 06 for anything short of large hungry bear is the 180 grain. HTH. Mikey.

Lawdog · « **Reply #4 on:** November 25, 2003, 11:42:19 AM »

Jkat,

Lets see, .30-06, .308, .270? All are good choices but heck everyone needs an '06' in their gun safe. Get the .30-06 and don't look back. Ammo is available everywhere factory loaded bullet weights from 110 grains up to 220 grains. Lawdog

jdt48653 · « **Reply #5 on:** November 25, 2003, 03:00:07 PM »

lawdog tells it like it is!

kc5rkg · « **Reply #6 on:** November 26, 2003, 11:40:29 AM »

Another vote for 30-06. The only rifle I currently own, and really dont need another :?:

longwinters · « **Reply #7 on:** November 26, 2003, 02:01:55 PM »

The only rifle I wished I did not get rid of . . . my Weatherby 06. Now I have a 7mm and a 308. I want my 06 back.

long

ingwenya · « **Reply #8 on:** November 26, 2003, 08:52:41 PM »

My honest opinion would eb to w/the .30-06. Some people might tell you "the 270 is really flat shooting" (i didnt see any posts to that affect). After careful scrutinization of ballisitics charts, it not much flatter at all. I think the .30-06 is just the best all-around common cartridge.

Dave in WV · « **Reply #9 on:** November 28, 2003, 02:31:49 PM »

Another 30-06 vote. You can vary performance with bullet design and weight.

old06 · « **Reply #10 on:** November 29, 2003, 02:25:01 AM »

We'll it's not time to change the vote now " ought six" is the winner over the years I've owned more rifles than I could sit down and count and there is no getting around the facts 06 by far out number the rest not because of numbers of them out there but by sheer preformance the gun writers compare every new round to it Hmmm...... every new modle comes out in 06 just about Hmmm........ every company has 06 in single shot, bolt , semi auto, and pump Hmmm..... every ammo company sells more 06 than most others Hmmm.... the handloading side sells more 06 dies every year for the last 20 years on average than any other along with brass 30 cal bullets Hmmm...... sounds like its a EZ one :agree:

340wby · « **Reply #11 on:** November 29, 2003, 02:39:24 AM »

THE CORRECT ANSWER WILL DEPEND ON BOTH THE GAME HUNTED and THE RANGES COMONLY INVOLVED
you really can,t go wrong with one of these three depending on the answers to the first two (north america)

30/06 springfield

300weatherby

338 winchester

THINK about the GAME YOUR LIKELY TO HUNT AND THE RANGES INVOLVED, the 30/06 will work on everthing but its not the first logical choice if game larger than deer is comon

jeeper123_2000 · « **Reply #12 on:** December 03, 2003, 11:41:48 AM »

Quote

THINK about the GAME YOUR LIKELY TO HUNT AND THE RANGES INVOLVED, the 30/06 will work on everthing but its not the first logical choice if game larger than deer is comon

I wish I had a dollar for every moose killed with a 6.5x55! :blaster:

old06 · « **Reply #13 on:** December 03, 2003, 12:18:58 PM »

Well jeeper when I was a kid thay said that about the 30 30 now the ought six is next well I've taken black bear , moose , two friends have shot six or seven elk and the list goes on. The ought six just for deer not . In twenty five years we'll have the 300 win mag just enought for under weight does .

jeeper123_2000 · « **Reply #14 on:** December 03, 2003, 01:19:18 PM »

The 30 30 is like the 6.5x55, it can't do squat, gotta have a magnum (grin). In ten years my 7mm STW won't be good enough for 'yotes at 100 yards. I keep saying I'm gonna get a stainless marlin 30 30 or a lefty 6.5x55. My real interest is in a 338-06AI or 338 Scovill, rem 700 action, shilen(or?) barrel, McMillan stock,bushnell elite 3200. I do have a rem 742 woodsmaster 30 06, won't group at all. It needs about 1 1/2 inches taken off the barrel due to excessive cleaning by preveious owner/owners and rust. I really like the gun it just won't shoot!?

Van/TX · « **Reply #15 on:** December 03, 2003, 01:36:17 PM »

Jkat, you could probably get by with the lowly .30-30

I've used a .30-30, .30-06 and .243 for many years for deer. Each have their advantages and would all work for bear. Can't think of a single instance though that a .308 would not have done the job just as well.

Good luck.....Van

jeeper123_2000 · « **Reply #16 on:** December 03, 2003, 01:43:59 PM »

Im sorry, I got sidetracked. My vote goes to the 30 06. :oops:

Eagle Eye · « **Reply #17 on:** December 09, 2003, 03:25:09 PM »

All of your choices (270, 30-06 and 308) are valid for an all purpose rifle. The only one I would add to your list is the 7mm REM MAG. Recoil is about the same as a 30-06 and they shoot a bit flatter. Have a look at the BC's shown for the various bullets and then checkout the velocity you can get....you'll see why I lean toward the big 7. This caliber covers all the bases from long range proghorn hunting on up to and including moose with the right bullet.

One of the nicest 7 MAG's I have seen is the Remington LSS. This is a laminated stainles steel rifle that weighs 7.5# so that would weigh in at around 8.75# loaded, scoped and slung. That is about right for a general purpose rifle and a good weight to keep recoil under control. These are attractive rifles as well as very functional and very accurate. All you'll need to do to it is have the trigger set to 3# pull weight and have any trigger creap or trigger overtravel removed by a competent gunsmith. You'll be set for life with one of these. :wink:

Power · « **Reply #18 on:** December 10, 2003, 09:11:07 AM »

I agree with Eagle Eye. If you are planning on most shots under 200 yards go with the '06. If you ever plan to hunt out west where you could get a 300+ yard shot go with the 7mm Rem. Mag. Or, even better, might look into the 300 WSM. Probably a good comprimise plus you can get it in a shorter action=shorter rifle.

I have a 7mm Rem. Mag. and live in E. Washington. Lots of sage brush and long shots at big Mule deer and Elk. Some of my family (and wife) use a 270 Win but I think it is a little small for Elk. I would say the 7mm is my personal minimum for Elk and bigger game. For black bears I think 270 and up would be fine, depends on the distance of the shot and how big the bears are. Here they only get up to around 300 pounds or so. For that size most rifles will work but bears and elk are tough creatures so don't go too light and use a premium bullet (I personally like the Partitions and I'm thinking of switching to the Accubonds from Nosler for next year).

Best thing you can do is find some friends/family that have a few rifles and take you shooting. Offer to buy a box of ammo for each caliber and go to the range. Take some gallon milk jugs full of water to make it fun and just shoot the rifles and see what happens to the jugs. The 30 cal bullets really make a difference on impact. Recoil really depends a lot on weight of gun and load being shot so keep that in mind.

I just upgraded from a Browning 7mm to a Tikka 7mm and would have switched to the 300 WSM if not for my investment in brass, dies, etc. for reloading. Trajectory is similar with similar weights between the two but your choices for bullet weight are greater in the 30 cal as mentioned.

helobill · « **Reply #19 on:** December 10, 2003, 10:14:30 AM »

Alright, I'm going to go against the grain and say the 308. Because of the short action mostly and proven accuracy a close second. Nothing against the '06, love the round and the gun in general, but if I "gotta put the first one on target every time" I'm going with the most proven accuracy round. Remington Factory ammo, 180 grain Nosler Partition in the 308 leave the barrel at 2620fps, same round leaves the 30-06 at 2700fps. Both sighted in at 200 yards results in a 400 yard drop of 26.0" for the 308 (1485ft-lbs retained energy) and 24.3" for the 30.06 (1590ft-lbs of retained energy). Both have factory loaded ammo from 150 to 180 grains, (there is a Remington Factory load in 125 grain for the '06). But in my experience with both rifles, I have more confidence in the .308 being able to put that first shot exactly where I expect it to go, and in my opinion, that's the one that counts. A well placed shot wins over 80fps. But maybe I'm predjudices 'cause I'm in the military.
Helicopter Bill

targshooter · « **Reply #20 on:** December 10, 2003, 02:25:54 PM »

Jkat,
I lived in Penfield for 14 years and hunted with a rifle in the Northern zone of upstate NY for almost 20 years. Just get a little north of Oswego and you are in rifle country. I shot several deer with a Sako AIII Carbine in .30-06 and a Winchester Model 70 in .375 H&H. As it seems you are a casual shooter who so far has a limited interest in rifle shooting, I would recommend the .30-06, especially as you may go elk hunting some time. If you think you would like to reload and spend some practice time, the larger calibers offer advangages for elk and large bear, but they require a lot of training, or at least I have found this to be so. I would also suggest purchasing a reloading manual with ballistics tables and looking this over before you decide on the caliber you want. The data therein will give you insight into what a cartridge can deliver at the game under the ranges you consider likely or limiting. Couple this with your tolerance for recoil and then use of one of the on-line recoil calculators to determine which cartridge suits you best.

old06 · « **Reply #21 on:** December 10, 2003, 02:44:05 PM »

Well jeeper that kind of stuff makes me want to run out and sell a bunch of fine gun's it sounds like your like me just waiting for all those fine gun's in 7x 57, 8x57 ect this summer I picked up a ought six in a rem 742 in great shape just because it was not enought gun he has to have 338 rem ultra for black bear hunt by the way 160.00 for it I shot around 30 or 40 handloads throught it not one hang up bring them on Ps if you run across any good deals snap them up I think in a few seasons most of those hunters will want them back that 's when the price goes up

:-D :-D

Mikey · « **Reply #22 on:** December 11, 2003, 04:01:50 AM »

You say your 742 won't group for schmidt??? Is the 742 the predecessor to the 7400 semi-auto? If so, there are a couple of accurizing techniques you can apply to get it to group better. Strangely enough, a buddy with a 7400 found the end of his bbl rusted. Not badly but it made us curious as to why. Anywho, after a good cleaning and a trip to the range we found that did not hurt the accuracy we had tuned the rifle to.

Before you go having that bbl cropped let's see if we can't improve the groups on that rifle with a few tricks. I think if you go on down to the Gunsmithing Forum or the Semi-auto and pump forum you may see some posts there that might help. And I HTH. Mikey.

High Brass · « **Reply #23 on:** December 11, 2003, 08:56:28 AM »

I'm personally biased to the 30-06 for reasons already mentioned, plus I own two. However, that aside I'd say that my close second choice would be a .308. Due to its short overall length, it doesn't look like much but it has a heckuva track record for killing critters. For no practical reason other than to be different, I've never given the 270 much thought but its one of the best deer-sized cartridges in existance. With any of the three you mentioned, you'd be well served with factory or handloaded ammunition. Good luck.

Dave in WV · « **Reply #24 on:** December 11, 2003, 09:06:42 AM »

While I usually agree with Eagle Eye I feel it needed to be pointed out the 06 is not factory loaded to it's potential for the reason of so many old rifles around. Load it to it's potential or get the light mag/high energy loads and the difference is nil AND the 06 does it with a barrel at least 2" shorter.

thecowboyace · « **Reply #25 on:** December 16, 2003, 11:24:18 AM »

Quote from: jeeper123_2000

Quote
THINK about the GAME YOUR LIKELY TO HUNT AND THE RANGES INVOLVED, the 30/06 will work on everthing but its not the first logical choice if game larger than deer is comon

I wish I had a dollar for every moose killed with a 6.5x55! :blaster:
You don't want to get rich, do you?Ha. Many has been done in by that small dastardly cartridge.

I will say that you will nearly always be able to find these cartridges in a small town, just in case, you know! .243, .270, 30-30, 30-06 and maybe .308 but not near as likely as the others tho.

Big Tom · « **Reply #26 on:** December 16, 2003, 02:44:51 PM »

I have em all but If I had to have just one it would be the 06 for the versatility an infinite types/models/price ranges available. :grin:

Desertrat · « **Reply #27 on:** December 22, 2003, 02:45:54 PM »

I have taken all available 4-legged game in the lower 48 with the exception of moose, with my .243 Winchester. Why shoot anything bigger?