Author Topic: new ultra varmint "locked up" (Read 1317 times)

davey · « **on:** December 23, 2006, 09:23:01 AM »

ultra varmint 243 first shots- very difficult to break and not ejecting - before shooting broke and ejected ok, used bore paste to break-in, but was ok (before shooting) - any ideas?

quickdtoo · « **Reply #1 on:** December 23, 2006, 09:35:51 AM »

Factoy ammo or handloads? Check the headspace of an unfired round, it should be flush with the chamber mouth/barrel face. There should also be no visible gap tween barrel and standing breech. See barrel fitting in the FAQs for checking barrel fit.

Tim

quickdtoo · « **Reply #2 on:** December 23, 2006, 09:53:48 AM »

Also, is it an ejector barrel or extractor? I know you said ejected, but that's a generic term.

Ejectors toss the shell out, extractors just lift a little and it must be picked out by hand. If you have the old style extractor and sticking brass, the chamber needs to be polished and the extractor repaired by H&R, the old style has been problematic. If it's an ejector and it's hard to open, that's a different problem related to headspace most likely. Also, if it's an ejector, polishing the chamber will solve the sticking problem. In any case, the brass and chamber must be clean and dry, or either will stick and it will be hard to open in the case of the extractor if dirt/oil/solvent is the problem.

Tim

davey · « **Reply #3 on:** December 23, 2006, 10:09:27 AM »

rifle is new ejector , shooting winchester factory, spacing seemed to be ok - could a "sloppy" bore clean left paste to jam ejector , etc - again , rifle ejected , broke, and closed ok with unfired round before bore clean and first rounds ?

Mac11700 · « **Reply #4 on:** December 23, 2006, 10:24:07 AM »

Quote from: davey on December 23, 2006, 10:09:27 AM

rifle is new ejector , shooting winchester factory, spacing seemed to be ok - could a "sloppy" bore clean left paste to jam ejector , etc - again , rifle ejected , broke, and closed ok with unfired round before bore clean and first rounds ?

OK...Could we please type full sentences here...This isn't the chat room..

Yes..leaving bore polishing paste all over the ejector will cause it not to eject..and also so would a out of spec'd chamber as well...As recommended in the FAQ's...a total cleaning is usually needed before shooting it to get all of the factory gunk out of them..let alone any you've put in..Also..you should verify your ammo isn't setting below flush with the chamber..There's been a bunch of undersized factory ammo of late..from just about all of the manufactures excepting Federal.

Mac

MSP Ret · « **Reply #5 on:** December 23, 2006, 10:37:24 AM »

I also had a bit of a tough time trying to understand what was meant by the cryptic sentences, however:

check the headspace and polish the bore

CLEAN IT - CLEAN IT - CLEAN IT!!!

If that does not solve the problem check the factory ammo and try another brand

if that does not work, call customer service and send it back....<><....

quickdtoo · « **Reply #6 on:** December 23, 2006, 11:24:47 AM »

Davey, there's an issue with the older style extractor that causes it to not remove the spent round just like the old spring driven ejector, but for different a reason. You need to understand there is no new ejector, only the old ejector that was spring driven and throws the case out of the chamber. Then they went to extractors that don't throw the case out. Then they changed the extractor style to a more reliable mechanism probably because they had trouble like you mention. If you have the early style extractor, it probably needs to be fixed by the factory. You didn't say which yours does with the empty. throw it out or you have to pick it out?

If your underlug looks like the one on top in the pic below with the staked screwhead, that's the one that is the problem child, the other one is an old ejector type that most everyone loves.

As everyone has stated, it must be clean to begin with, that includes before shooting and also after using the polish.

Besides the dirty chamber or extractor/ejector, there also may be a problem with the chamber itself that is causing the problem, if you get it cleaned good and it's still a problem, you need to contact H&R after New Years at their toll free number in the FAQs and ask them to fix it, also ask that they pay for shipping while you're at it.

Also, if the trigger is too heavy, have em do a 3-4lb trigger job on it. If you're interested in an extra barrel or 3, that would be a good time too!! Just some things to consider now instead of after the fact.

Tim

Mac11700 · « **Reply #7 on:** December 23, 2006, 01:48:53 PM »

Yup...check and see what you have...There are still a bunch of ejector barrels on dealers shelves..and you could have easily bought a new in box ejector...instead of the newest offering which is the extractor barrels..

Mac

MSP Ret · « **Reply #8 on:** December 23, 2006, 01:59:17 PM »

And lucky you would be!!! The ejector barrels are getting harder and harder to find, at some time thats all there might be unless the great minds here figure out how to convert the extractor to an ejector, as I have read several here are looking into that right now.. the other way was easy, this way may be more difficult. The extractors are OK for bench rest shooters or target shooters but hunters are better served by an ejector fitted barrel, especially in the cold areas of the country or with a rimless case. If you are interested do a search when the search feature comes up again, there has been quite a bit of discussion about the matter here....<><....

davey · « **Reply #9 on:** December 27, 2006, 04:19:14 AM »

thanks for info fyi rifle is an ejector(throws it out) new, thru walmart - breaks and ejects ok before firing , but after cannot break; only after great force on release lever . shell sometimes does not eject ,but tap with ramrod; it will throw it out. any more ideas, want to avoid 4-5weeks with cust serv

MSP Ret · « **Reply #10 on:** December 27, 2006, 05:07:57 AM »

More problems with a .243, this has me concerned about getting one....<><.... $:-\$

quickdtoo · « **Reply #11 on:** December 27, 2006, 05:25:57 AM »

An ejector barrel that is hard to open after the shot with factory ammo isn't a good sign, since you bought it new at WM, I'd say it was a problem that H&R will have to deal with, unfortunately. You can try polishing the chamber, that info is in the FAQs. How's the primer of the spent case look in comparison to an unfired round, is it flattened and filing the primer pocket? It's always possible that you have some defective ammo that's loaded too hot, you might try a different brand of ammo after you polish the chamber, or just send it in and have H&R look at it. Give Mary a call and ask about getting it fixed, their toll free number is (866)776-9292, ask that they pay for shipping and do a free trigger job while they're at it.

Tim

bigjeepman · « **Reply #12 on:** December 27, 2006, 06:13:08 AM »

You guys are certainly the experts. I am not 1/100 as knowledgeable as you guys but I am thinking maybe he should at least try a different factory ammo in it first. It is a long shot but maybe these loads are "hotter" than the norm for whatever reason. Just another idea ....

quickdtoo · « **Reply #13 on:** December 27, 2006, 06:30:46 AM »

You're thinkin the same thing I did, great minds think a like!!!

I was thinkin maybe I was stickin my neck out on that one, but it's always possible, seems to me someone recently mentioned some Hornady ammo that was loaded too hot.

Tim

Fred M · « **Reply #14 on:** December 27, 2006, 10:25:44 AM »

All factory ammo lots are tested for pressure and velocity. The standard is 60.1kpsi.
Loads are usually not rejected unless the the go beyoned powder burning rates plus or minus 10%.

The 243 is a high tensity round and anything up to 65kpsi is considered ok. Alas the Handi rifle is not too happy with this pressure. So an ammo relating to the minus scale is much prefered.

Which as far as velocty is concerened is not very noticable. So try as suggested above, a different brand. Or best still load your own ammo and keep it to about 56kpsi. Just about any ammo in this pressure range will keep your Handi burring.

MSP Ret · « **Reply #15 on:** December 27, 2006, 10:50:00 AM »

Thanks for your input Fred, we have missed you while you were recuperating. How are you my Northern buddy and how is everything going for you? I hope you don't have to go out and shovel any snow for a while....<><....

quickdtoo · « **Reply #16 on:** December 27, 2006, 11:01:11 AM »

Glad ta see ya here Fred, hope you're healing up good!!! Thanks for your advice, it's very welcome!!

Tim

Rustyinfla · « **Reply #17 on:** December 27, 2006, 11:21:10 AM »

Years ago I had a T/C Contender Super 14 in .30-30 Win. It shot Remington factory stuff just fine. It shot my handloads just fine, but when I tried Federal factory stuff the action stuck similar to what you describe. Brass had to be knocked out with a cleaning rod. Closer examination revealed that the primers had flattened, cratered, and were starting to flow into the firing pin hole. I sent 3 rounds of spent brass back to Federal. I really didn't want anything from them I just wanted to let them know so someone didn't get hurt and give the shooting industry another black eye. they sent a letter back that said my chamber was to blame.
I don't know how a problem with the chamber would cause the primer problems but that's what they said.

Happy Trails and God Bless,
Rusty <><

davey · « **Reply #18 on:** January 02, 2007, 05:54:02 AM »

fyi you all i
scheduled to return rifle to nef for also trigger job and muzzle barrel (4 to 6 weeks), but
tried federal fusion-- - shot ok --- include eject

will post exact winchester 100gr bullet that caused rifle not to break and eject

10ga. · « **Reply #19 on:** January 02, 2007, 06:13:55 PM »

Quote from: davey on January 02, 2007, 05:54:02 AM

fyi you all i
scheduled to return rifle to nef for also trigger job and muzzle barrel (4 to 6 weeks), but
tried federal fusion-- - shot ok --- include eject

will post exact winchester 100gr bullet that caused rifle not to break and eject

quickdtoo · « **Reply #20 on:** January 02, 2007, 06:19:47 PM »

Quote from: davey on January 02, 2007, 05:54:02 AM

fyi you all i
scheduled to return rifle to nef for also trigger job and muzzle barrel (4 to 6 weeks), but
tried federal fusion-- - shot ok --- include eject
will post exact winchester 100gr bullet that caused rifle not to break and eject

Translation: he's sending the rifle to NEF for trigger job and fitting of a Huntsman barrel, Fusion ammo shot and ejected Ok, will post 100gr Winchester load that caused problems.

I think!!

Tim

Fred M · « **Reply #21 on:** January 02, 2007, 06:48:20 PM »

Tim and Andy.
I have a hard time sitting very long in front of the computer. There are not very many comfortable resting places in the house, with the exception of the bed.

Thanks for the good wishes. I am getting a lot better in the last week.

Davie.
I am glad the fusion ammo from Federal shoots well and ejects. The 243 is a bit touchy and since you have found a good factory load just stay with it.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #22 on:** January 02, 2007, 07:05:32 PM »

Take care Fred, you'll be good as new sooner than you think!!!

Tim

davey · « **Reply #23 on:** January 09, 2007, 06:36:05 AM »

fyi - did not ship to NEF - winchester super X power point 100 gr locked up rifle, fusion shoots ok
still needs trigger job