Author Topic: New Offerings from Freedom Arms  (Read 7747 times)

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Offline Graybeard

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New Offerings from Freedom Arms
« on: July 17, 2008, 11:06:04 AM »
Bob stopped by my house this morning and we visited for perhaps a couple hours. I had the opportunity to shoot the new offerings from Freedom Arms and to take some photos. My photography isn't the best especially with the digital camera hand held but at least it's quick to get on the forums afterward.

I shot the new single shot dubbed the Model 2008 in both .357 magnum and in 6.5 JDJ and also the new version of the FA97 chambered to the .327 Federal necked to .224" using 40 grain bullets from both Sierra and Hornady.

The .357 Magnum barrel was set up for IHMSA competition with iron sights and the other two were both scoped. I shot the .357 at 25 yards only as I just could not see the targets at 100 well enough to even try. I shot both the 6.5 JDJ and the .22-327 at both 25 and 100 yards. I didn't use up too much of Bob's ammo as he is heading out to a shoot from here and lots of folks will want to try them there so I limited my shooting to a few three shot groups. I didn't measure them but they did shoot very well and I'm sure that my shooting skills not the guns limited the groups.

I'm pretty sure the 25 yard iron sight .357 magnum groups would measure really close to an inch and perhaps later I will measure as I didn't take the targets off the frame yet. I'm guessing 100 yard groups at about 1.5".

The ammo for the .222-327 has not yet been finalized and really both projects are still in the development stage. The load with the Sierra bullets were loaded after the ones with Hornady bullets and from a different lot number of powder. They were a bit sticky and we had to remove the cylinder to remove the cases. The Hornady bullet loads had no such problems and ejected nicely. At 25 yards the Sierra load shot a big higher but at 100 yards they were all in the same group.

The .357 magnum was pushing 180s about 1400 fps I think Bob said and while I didn't ask I suspect the 123s in the 6.5 JDJ were likely moving about 2300 fps or so. Recoil was very mild from both. The recoil of the 6.5 JDJ should be about equal to the 7-30 but perceived recoil in the Model 2008 was clearly less in my hands than from a TC Contender in 7-30 as that is a combination I have much experience with.

I really like that you do not break the gun using an extention of the trigger guard ala TC as that extention always seems to find my fingers on heavy recoiling rounds. That is not a consideration with Bob's new single shot and even with heavy recoiling loads it's not gonna bite like the TCs do. It opens very easily with the little lever you can see in the photos on the side of the frame. Nice.

Barrel changing took perhaps a moment longer than on a TC but not enough so that it is that measureable. On production guns Bob said he hopes to have the fore end removable like shotgun fore ends via a push button deal but such things are not as of yet firmed up. For rimfires you buy a shroud that the barrels then fit into. It's kinda like changing out a barrel on a Ruger 10-22 in effect as it has the same sort of attachment as a 10-22 barrel where you remove the screw and the clamp and just pull out a barrel and slide in another. They fit in the shroud slightly off center so the same firing pin works for both rimfire and centerfire. Rimfire offerings will likely be .22LR, .22WMR and .17HMR but he said most likly not the Mach 2 as it seems demand for that round has not really developed as with the .17 HMR.

For now Bob is asking for comments from potential customers to see what features and chamberings are of interest. Nothing much about the project is locked in stone yet so the more input you give him the more the final product is likely to be what we want.

I asked about the expected strength level as compared to the Contender and Encore as these old stand bys are kinda what single shot handguns have to be compared to. He said that has not yet been worked out but he expects it to be in excess of Encore levels. That does not necessarily mean you'll see belted or short fat unbelted magnums either but then it doesn't rule them out either. He has tested it using ten rounds of .454 Casull proof ammo and found no dimensional changes whatsoever from that stress. That's a good indication most any reasonable round that will fit should work safely.

The new single shot has a bunch of safety features build in. Rather than me try to remember them all we'll wait until Bob has a chance to see and reply to this thread and he can explain them all and answer any questions folks have for him.

As to the .22-327 as I recall I think he said he feels they will be able to get about 2250 fps or so from 40 grain bullets. From his explaination of it the loading process is a bit involved in that to get all the powder needed into the case he had to pour the power into a funnel such that it swirled as it went in and then use vibration to settle it into the case so as to not crush it too much when seating the bullets. The powder he is currently using is AA1680. He cautioned that assuming whatever powder you might have tried that worked in other small cases like the K-Hornet or such are not necessarily going to apply here and when it is in production sticking to the recommended loads and loading techniques are very important if you want proper performance. I suggested he contact Ron Reed a GBO Sponsor as a possible source of supply for the ammo.

That's about all I can think of at the moment I need to pass on. So I'll post the photos and open the thread for discussion and questions for Bob.





















Bill aka the Graybeard
President, Graybeard Outdoor Enterprises
256-435-1125

I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!

Offline doghawg

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Re: New Offerings from Freedom Arms
« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2008, 02:44:22 PM »
 Being an avid prairie dog shooter, the .22/327 in a Mod 97 interests me. I recently bought a .357 Mod 97 (third FA) and really like the gun. So here are a few questions......

Bill........What was your perception of the noise level/muzzle blast of this cartridge?

Bob......Do you think forcing cone wear or erosion will be a factor with the .22/327?
           What barrel lengths will work out the best...7 1/2"...10"...?

Offline BlkHawk73

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Re: New Offerings from Freedom Arms
« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2008, 01:59:23 AM »
 The .22/327 interests me!   8)  Seen reports and pics of the single shot.  Really like the idea andconcept but it's just too darn blocky.  Just cannot ghet past that part. 
  Anyways, I'm gonna be keeping an open mind on this .22/327 though.
"Never Surrender, Just Carry On."  - G.S.

Offline Graybeard

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Re: New Offerings from Freedom Arms
« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2008, 05:25:40 AM »
Understand clearly that I do not shoot without good hearing protection so the sound perception is based on that but to me the report was rather mild. Really the capacity is similar to a .22 Hornet I suspect so noise level is also similar. Any and all revolvers are a bit louder than a fixed barrel gun because of the cylinder gap but on FA guns that gap is minimal and it adds as little to the over all noise as any revolver ever will.

I'd sure not wanna shoot it minus hearing protection as I've lost enough hearing already but as stated it seemed quite mild to me.

It may take Bob a few days to get to this as he is on the road and probably has no internet access. When he gets back to WY he will probably check in.


Bill aka the Graybeard
President, Graybeard Outdoor Enterprises
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I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!

Offline rimfire

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Re: New Offerings from Freedom Arms
« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2008, 04:37:12 AM »
Any guestimation on pricing yet for the single shot?
Be honest with yourself.  Can you guarantee you would hit a paper plate at 250 yards...100 yards...50 yards?  Then you have no business replacing the plate with a live animal.

Offline Graybeard

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Re: New Offerings from Freedom Arms
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2008, 04:50:42 AM »
Any guestimation on pricing yet for the single shot?

No. I asked but Bob said that was not even a consideration at this point. He is trying to get input on what features and chamberings folks want. Once the design is finalized he will make up some and figure out what the cost is and mark them up for a reasonable profit and that will determine the price.


Bill aka the Graybeard
President, Graybeard Outdoor Enterprises
256-435-1125

I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!

Offline Madmark

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Re: New Offerings from Freedom Arms
« Reply #6 on: August 02, 2008, 05:28:02 PM »
A friend and I got to shoot the break action at the IHMSA International Championships. It's like a cross between a FA Revolver and an Improved RPM. My friend shot a 71x80 with it, which compared favorably with the 76x80 he shot with his match ready XP-100 in 7BR.  The trigger was heavy, around 3#, but crisp. With a lighter trigger, my buddy may have tied or beaten his 76x80!  I shot 12 other guns for the Ints, so I shot it at sighters only, leaving the bulk of the ammo for my friend! ;) I was impressed with the beast, and can't wait to see them in competition.
FYI, Freedom Arms absolutely dominated the revolver divisions. One AAA shooter shot a perfect score with his FA in small bore unlimited any sight. That won the AAA class, and put him in the shootoffs for the SB-UAS Championship. That is shooting at the little targets, against the high dollar custom single shots. That really makes me want a FA revolver!!!  Time will tell if the single action can dominate like the revolvers.

Offline xphunter

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Re: New Offerings from Freedom Arms
« Reply #7 on: August 22, 2008, 08:24:34 AM »
I was able to shoot both the single-shot prototype and the 22/327 revolver this past June when Bob was competing @ Sundance
Ernie
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Offline Graybeard

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Re: New Offerings from Freedom Arms
« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2009, 06:55:11 PM »
BTT


Bill aka the Graybeard
President, Graybeard Outdoor Enterprises
256-435-1125

I am not a lawyer and do not give legal advice.

Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life anyone who believes in Him will have everlasting life!