Author Topic: .17 Hornet, the project begins... (Read 3096 times)

geezerbiker · « **on:** June 29, 2012, 11:09:54 PM »

The .17 HMR barrel arrived today and I was pleased to find that it's a heavy barrel. I should have asked but I was pretty tickled just to find one and at a good price no less.

I had a lot going on so I didn't get a chance to see how it fit my action until after 11:00p. It closes but won't lock up. I think I lucked into 2 Handi's with tight actions. These 2 will swap barrels like they were twins but won't close or lock up on any other barrels. I never got around to fitting the 20 gauge barrel so when the local smith gets back from safari, I'll drop it all off to him to fit both barrels and ream the HMR to .17 HH.

I'm going have them fit to the mat finished SB2 frame that started out as a .44 Mag. That way I can go varmint hunting with the .17 HH and bring the .223 along. I wasn't thrilled with scoping the .44 so I'll put the once piece mount on the .17 and go back to iron sites on the .44 Mag.

Anyway there won't be much to post for awhile. The smith (and my hunting buddy) won't be back from Namibia until Monday and I won't be able to get over to his shop for another week.

This would be a lot easier if H&R would take a barrel they already make and ream it to .17 HH for use...

Tony

cwlongshot · « **Reply #1 on:** June 30, 2012, 11:28:19 PM »

Good luck with it, its a fun little screamer!!

CW

dpe.ahoy · « **Reply #2 on:** July 01, 2012, 09:11:56 AM »

Yep, i'm gonna watch this one. Looks like a neat little cartridge that would do some real damage on gophers around here. DP

geezerbiker · « **Reply #3 on:** July 13, 2012, 11:01:32 PM »

I put the .17 HMR on the SB2 frame my .44 mag came on and if I really force it, I can get it to lock up. I swung buy the gun shop and asked about the rechamber. I was told that since he didn't have a license to make guns, he couldn't do the rechamber but he would have the other smith that comes in look at it. I'm not sure I'll leave it there for the work even if he will do it. The other smith is an a$$hole and I'm not sure even if he's good enough that I want to give him my business.

The owner of the shop wasn't acting to positive toward fitting the barrel and I gave explicit instructions that the frame cannot be modified or my .44 barrel won't fit any more. He said he would pass that on to the smith but I want that in writing before the work begins.

I was also told the HMR ejector didn't look like it was up to the job of extracting Hornet cases and might need to be replaced. A question to those that have done this conversion, did you have to replace the ejector? Anybody know if H&R will sell me an Hornet ejector? It's for certain that I cannot send this barrel in for service...

Tony

trotterlg · « **Reply #4 on:** July 14, 2012, 03:03:18 PM »

First I think you need new gunsmiths for sure. A Horent ejector will not fit a HMR ejector cut with out machine work on the barrel. There is no difference in the ability of a 17 HMR ejector over a Hornet ejector, they use the same spring etc. When you chamber the HMR barrel for the Hornet must leave the ejector in the barrel, without the spring etc in, it will work perfect when you are done. Larry

geezerbiker · « **Reply #5 on:** July 14, 2012, 08:29:23 PM »

I'm beginning to think you're right about needing a new gunsmith. Now I need to find someone in NW Oregon that's worth his salt...

Tony

quickdtoo · « **Reply #6 on:** July 15, 2012, 04:02:55 AM »

Check with JES, I don't think he does rechambers if he doesn't do a rebore, but I never asked, and he may know someone that does.

Tim

http://www.35caliber.com/3.html

moorepower · « **Reply #7 on:** July 15, 2012, 08:28:18 AM »

I did my extractor in my mill. Wayne York @ Oregunsmithing will rechamber.

geezerbiker · « **Reply #8 on:** July 15, 2012, 10:48:28 AM »

I'll probably pick my rifle up later this week or early next week and give the guys at Oregunsmithing a call. I seriously doubt I'm going to like the news from Al's Guns in Verboort...

Tony

geezerbiker · « **Reply #9 on:** July 17, 2012, 09:33:06 AM »

I got a call from the gun shop today and it confirms my opinion that the gunsmith is a a$$hole. He claims the rifling is to shallow to use .172" bullets and the rifling twist rate wrong. I'll be picking it up today and calling other gun shops to find someone to chamber the barrel for me...

Tony

cwlongshot · « **Reply #10 on:** July 17, 2012, 09:48:59 AM »

Here is the first five shots outta mine at 100 yards...

The shallow rifling and wrong twist is probably why only three of the bullets went thru one hole...

CW

geezerbiker · « **Reply #11 on:** July 17, 2012, 12:03:11 PM »

The results from you doing your 2 is why I decided to tackle this project in the first place. I'm willing to bet he just doesn't want to work on it but is to much of a pr*ck to say so. Other guys I've talked to that are shooting .17 Ackley hornets are also using 1 in 9 twist barrels without problems.

I'm going to try a little barrel fitting on my own before I send it out elsewhere. I think if I polish a little off the face of the chamber, it would lock up OK. Right now when it does close and lock up, there isn't any gap at all.

Tony

quickdtoo · « **Reply #12 on:** July 17, 2012, 12:13:08 PM »

I've fitted several barrels by doing just that, it can accomplish a couple things, 1) can square up the chamber face if done carefully, and 2) reduces headspace on a chamber that's cut too deep(all too common

) and doesn't matter if the barrel is going to be rechambered anyway as long as the ejector/extractor slot is deep enough to allow the refacing, I did exactly that with the 243 Superlight barrel before it was rebored to 9.3x62, never touched the pivot, just the barrel face and adjusted latch engagement.

Tim

cwlongshot · « **Reply #13 on:** July 18, 2012, 12:24:56 AM »

Quote from: quickdtoo on July 17, 2012, 12:13:08 PM

I've fitted several barrels by doing just that, it can accomplish a couple things, 1) can square up the chamber face if done carefully, and 2) reduces headspace on a chamber that's cut too deep(all too common ) and doesn't matter if the barrel is going to be rechambered anyway as long as the ejector/extractor slot is deep enough to allow the refacing, I did exactly that with the 243 Superlight barrel before it was rebored to 9.3x62, never touched the pivot, just the barrel face and adjusted latch engagement.

Tim

Same here, I agree 100%!

CW

geezerbiker · « **Reply #14 on:** August 03, 2012, 12:02:32 PM »

I picked up the rifle from the gun shop last week but I didn't get to doing anything with it until today. Yesterday I bought a .17 caliber cleaning rod so I could slug the bore. I chose to go with something easy so I pushed a .177 air rifle pellet down the bore. It wasn't easy to get the pellet in the bore and it was a tight fit so I think the results should be pretty good.

I measured the pellet in a digital caliper and I rolled it around the long way in the jaws of the caliper to get measurements between .1695 and .173 so I'm thinking the lands are .1695 and the grooves are .173 deep. I repeated the procedure a couple more times with identical results.

I'm convinced the smith that I left it with was just making up an excuse for not wanting to work on it. With a .173 groove depth and 1 in 9 rifling twist, it should be a good barrel for .17 Hornet.

I'll tinker with fitting it later on but I did try shining a light between the chamber face and receiver again and it looks to be a air tight fit. I'll take my knife sharpening stones to it later on to see if I can make a little clearance. Right now, I wouldn't be surprised if it's an interference fit and I'll stop when I can see light or at about .001" clearance. I don't want to take off any more for now.

Tony

handishooter · « **Reply #15 on:** August 03, 2012, 01:25:23 PM »

I re chambered a friends 17 hmr to .17 ackley hornet for him, it has been at least 3 years and he has put several thousand rounds through it with out any problems. It is a very easy project, you definitely need a new gunsmith, the ones I know around here in Texas would charge you about $30-$50 to do it, if you had the reamer, more if they have to rent it.

Good Luck, I think you will enjoy it once it is finished.

geezerbiker · « **Reply #16 on:** August 03, 2012, 02:02:47 PM »

About 25 years ago I knew about a dozen places within an hour or so drive from home in Oregon that would have done this work for me. These days, I can't think of anyone that will. I've eMailed a couple smiths in the state that are both more than a 4 hour drive if I decided to go there but I haven't heard anything back so far.

Tony

mitchell · « **Reply #17 on:** August 07, 2012, 01:09:47 PM »

an other plug out to Wayne York i had him do the same thing a few years ago only it was a 17 ackley hornet that rifle is a P-dog's worst nightmare BTW

geezerbiker · « **Reply #18 on:** August 07, 2012, 03:53:53 PM »

Quote from: mitchell on August 07, 2012, 01:09:47 PM

an other plug out to Wayne York i had him do the same thing a few years ago only it was a 17 ackley hornet that rifle is a P-dog's worst nightmare BTW

Do you have contact info for him? A .17 Ackley Hornet would be OK by me if it would save the cost of a reamer rental.

Tony

quickdtoo · « **Reply #19 on:** August 08, 2012, 10:00:34 AM »

http://www.oregunsmithingllc.com/

geezerbiker · « **Reply #20 on:** August 08, 2012, 12:15:27 PM »

Quote from: quickdtoo on August 08, 2012, 10:00:34 AM

http://www.oregunsmithingllc.com/

I already sent them an eMail but I haven't received a reply. Is he one of those guys that ignores eMails?

Tony

quickdtoo · « **Reply #21 on:** August 08, 2012, 12:40:55 PM »

Wayne York(Oregunsmithing) doesn't answer emails real promptly sometimes and he may be on vacation. I always called him and left a message more often than not, did ya try calling?

Tim

geezerbiker · « **Reply #22 on:** August 08, 2012, 03:45:29 PM »

Quote from: quickdtoo on August 08, 2012, 12:40:55 PM

Wayne York(Oregunsmithing) doesn't answer emails real promptly sometimes and he may be on vacation. I always called him and left a message more often than not, did ya try calling?

Tim

No, I only eMailed. I'll have to call him later this week.

Tony

briannmilewis · « **Reply #23 on:** August 08, 2012, 06:48:46 PM »

I am sure it is the lawyers fault that H&R does not sell barrel blanks.

A lot of issues would be reduced in complexity or completely resolved if they sold blanks, either factory fitted with your frame, or already factory fitted to a new frame. Did you know the Ackley Hornet is almost a dimensionally proportional BR cartridge...base to start of shoulder length is a little long but it has the BR 30 deg shoulder.

elkslayer4x5 · « **Reply #24 on:** August 09, 2012, 04:06:12 AM »

Quote from: briannmilewis on August 08, 2012, 06:48:46 PM

I am sure it is the lawyers fault that H&R does not sell barrel blanks.

A lot of issues would be reduced in complexity or completely resolved if they sold blanks, either factory fitted with your frame, or already factory fitted to a new frame. Did you know the Ackley Hornet is almost a dimensionally proportional BR cartridge...base to start of shoulder length is a little long but it has the BR 30 deg shoulder.

I thought that the 30 degree shoulder was the earmark of the Ackley Improvement.

briannmilewis · « **Reply #25 on:** August 09, 2012, 06:50:29 PM »

Only in the 17 Hornet, "Ackley" usually = 40 deg. PPCs and BRs are 30 deg...and the 6mm PPC is one of or is THE most accurate cartridge to 200 yards. Beyond that, bigger caliber versions are more accurate as they use the heavier bullets, although PPCs and BRs use much heavier bullets for competion that the regular folks would use hunting.

elkslayer4x5 · « **Reply #26 on:** August 10, 2012, 04:25:23 AM »

Quote from: briannmilewis on August 09, 2012, 06:50:29 PM

Only in the 17 Hornet, "Ackley" usually = 40 deg. PPCs and BRs are 30 deg...and the 6mm PPC is one of or is THE most accurate cartridge to 200 yards. Beyond that, bigger caliber versions are more accurate as they use the heavier bullets, although PPCs and BRs use much heavier bullets for competion that the regular folks would use hunting.

See there, you can learn something new everyday, if you pay attention. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

briannmilewis · « **Reply #27 on:** August 14, 2012, 03:47:01 PM »

Learned over a few years for me. We are working on the 223 Short project and I have decided that the final design will be a proportional BR or PPC - 30 deg shoulder that starts 0.7072 x case length (1.135") from the base = .803". Those proportions we know cannot be improved on when you use a small rifle primer and 22, 6mm and 7mm bullets. I am going to do a 17 Ackley too and also a 22 (35 deg) K Hornet, close enough to a BR design.

Best of luck...of heard folks rebarrel the browning micro-hunters and the CZ 22 Hornets to make 17 Ackley's

geezerbiker · « **Reply #28 on:** August 16, 2012, 01:36:01 PM »

I made one small step today. I called and left a voice mail at Oregunsmithing. I've been looking at the cost of dies and I think it will be cheaper in the long run to chamber it to .17 Hornady Hornet rather than .17 Ackley Hornet. The only Ackley dies available are 125 bucks as opposed to 32 bucks for the Hornady dies. I suppose renting the reamer would make up the difference... Anyway I really want to get this barrel shooting...

Tony

thesandman · « **Reply #29 on:** August 16, 2012, 03:16:20 PM »

I've been wanting to get same setup. and perhaps a 22khornet. Are the rim fire barrels hardened or mild steel? also talked to H&R today again. they dont sell 24inch 204 in the accessory barrel program. only 22inch, guess I will need a ultra varmint 204. My question is are all rimfire barrels shorter at pivot than the ctr fire. my 22mag is loose on ctr fire frame. so if I got a 17 on that frame it too would need shimming. Did yours fit a frame? H&R says they are a different size on purpose. maybe I have a long sb2 and a short ss1. I see yours fit tight.