Author Topic: Leupold PRW FAILURE!! (Read 5596 times)

cwlongshot · « **on:** March 25, 2011, 04:17:50 AM »

Mornin' guys,

I was just pulling the scope from my 500 barrel getting ready to ship to Oldsoldja and found that the Leupold PRW rings recoil sholder did not hold up to the mighty recoil of the 500 S&W!!!

This was with a older PRW with the removeable recoil block/bar/cross piece. It simply bent under recoil.

Also, I was using the H&R base and in hind site is not really the best choice for such a caliber. the grouves that position the scope are small and if larger this may not have happened.

CW

petemi · « **Reply #1 on:** March 25, 2011, 04:40:12 AM »

Well holy smokes.....that is amazing. I've got "junk" Simmons and Tascos that hold up well to the .405 Rem in the .45-70 running at almost 2000 fps. My .500 wears another "junk" NcStar, and it hasn't failed. You could buy 3 or 4 of those scopes for the price of Leupold. The lens quality isn't an issue. I'm blind in one eye and can't see out of the other

Pete

oldsoldja · « **Reply #2 on:** March 25, 2011, 04:44:58 AM »

wow. im glad I put 4 rings on mine.

Dee · « **Reply #3 on:** March 25, 2011, 04:51:53 AM »

WoW! I'm glad I don't own one of those guns. If the scope rings can't take the recoil, I know I can'T.

dave29 · « **Reply #4 on:** March 25, 2011, 04:55:55 AM »

Holy cow, I can't believe those PRW rings failed! Although, like you said, the base wasn't the best option.

I doubt that would have happened in a Steel Warne base, where the grooves run all the way across.

Graybeard · « **Reply #5 on:** March 25, 2011, 06:07:18 AM »

Quote from: Dee on March 25, 2011, 04:51:53 AM

WoW! I'm glad I don't own one of those guns. If the scope rings can't take the recoil, I know I can'T.

Ain't dat the truth. I've gone to shooting only the .410 for skeet cuz the recoil even of my 28 Ga O/U was hurting the shoulder at the end of a shooting session. It's been years since I tried shooting skeet with 20 or 12 ga either.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #6 on:** March 25, 2011, 06:27:17 AM »

Thanks CW, I'll have to check mine and see how they're doing. FWIW, the Leupold base is made just like the H&R base, so it could have happened with it just as easily, sounds like they made the recoil lugs out of inferior material, or they're just defective, I'd send a pic to Leupold and get em replaced.

Tim

cwlongshot · « **Reply #7 on:** March 25, 2011, 06:46:54 AM »

Quote from: quickdtoo on March 25, 2011, 06:27:17 AM

Thanks CW, I'll have to check mine and see how they're doing. FWIW, the Leupold base is made just like the H&R base, so it could have happened with it just as easily, sounds like they made the recoil lugs out of inferior material, or they're just defective, I'd send a pic to Leupold and get em replaced.

Tim

done!! Lol

I agree junk metal one snapped as I tried to straighten it and appears case plated metal.

I doubt it would have happened with more support from the base.
Food for thought
CW

cwlongshot · « **Reply #8 on:** March 25, 2011, 06:48:52 AM »

Quote from: petemi on March 25, 2011, 04:40:12 AM

Well holy smokes.....that is amazing. I've got "junk" Simmons and Tascos that hold up well to the .405 Rem in the .45-70 running at almost 2000 fps. My .500 wears another "junk" NcStar, and it hasn't failed. You could buy 3 or 4 of those scopes for the price of Leupold. The lens quality isn't an issue. I'm blind in one eye and can't see out of the other

Pete

The scope is fine Pete, just the hi dollar rings failed!!

CW

catamount · « **Reply #9 on:** March 25, 2011, 07:56:53 AM »

I've been very impressed with those rings in the past. I put a Warne steel base and steel Burris Zee rings on my 500 and have had no problems so far. It is one hard kicking gun and anyone that sais it isn't hasn't fired off a few factory 375 grn Hornady XTP's. They are a very hot round. They have substantially more recoil than Ranger Ricks 700 grn thumpers in my gun.

quickdtoo · « **Reply #10 on:** March 25, 2011, 08:12:47 AM »

I have them mounted on three rifles, the 45-70 Ultra Hunter, 444 Marlin as well as the 500S&W, the 500 are bent, but not as bad as CWs, but mine only has ~200 rounds thru it! $:-\$ The other two are fine tho. I also have several sets of QRWs that I bought used from Mac which use the same recoil lug, three sets are slightly bent, one set is bent just like CW's with one of the lugs completely broken off where you see the crack starting in one of CW's pics.

All of mine are on H&R bases.

Tim

cwlongshot · « **Reply #11 on:** March 25, 2011, 08:49:41 AM »

Huston, it looks like we have a problem!!

It's kinda troublesome as generally they have a well made product. I mean these rings are not cheap!

I guess I'll relegate them to lower recoil calibers.

CW

bikerbeans · « **Reply #12 on:** March 25, 2011, 09:51:28 AM »

CW,

is this the Handi you said would have a "flyer" from time to time?

BB

gcrank1 · « **Reply #13 on:** March 25, 2011, 11:08:17 AM »

FWIW, from past experience, some 'parts' are made of inferior materials to be sacrificial.
Replace them with higher grade material and the load then goes 'up the chain'.
Im not saying that a bit higher grade stock wouldnt be the thing to use, but lets say you used water or oil hardening steel (unhardened it is plenty strong for a lot of applications), the next failure might be in the base groove and/or the scope walks in the rings.
I have to wonder how the base screws are doing. Those little 6x48's arent all created equal either and this caliber looks to be a parts eater!

quickdtoo · « **Reply #14 on:** March 25, 2011, 12:11:00 PM »

There have been some base screw shears reported on shotgun and the 500S&W, FWIW, using a heavy scope on a heavy kicker may have been a factor that didn't help tho too. I've been using Brownells' T-10 torx screws in all my bases, and I also bed the base in Loctite which adds another layer of strength to the mount, it takes a good whack to remove the base after the screws are removed.

Tim

cwlongshot · « **Reply #15 on:** March 25, 2011, 05:32:06 PM »

Quote from: bikerbeans on March 25, 2011, 09:51:28 AM

CW,

is this the Handi you said would have a "flyer" from time to time?

BB

YES. I'm thinking thisxwas at the very least part of that problem. If not all of it!!
CW

Spanky · « **Reply #16 on:** March 25, 2011, 06:51:44 PM »

Maybe I'll put peep sights on my 500 barrel instead of scoping it. $:-\$

Spanky

Dinny · « **Reply #17 on:** March 25, 2011, 07:10:19 PM »

Quote from: gcrank1 on March 25, 2011, 11:08:17 AM

FWIW, from past experience, some 'parts' are made of inferior materials to be sacrificial.
Replace them with higher grade material and the load then goes 'up the chain'.
Im not saying that a bit higher grade stock wouldnt be the thing to use, but lets say you used water or oil hardening steel (unhardened it is plenty strong for a lot of applications), the next failure might be in the base groove and/or the scope walks in the rings.
I have to wonder how the base screws are doing. Those little 6x48's arent all created equal either and this caliber looks to be a parts eater!

+1 for that statement! If not the cross locks, what would have failed if they were stronger? FWIW, my 45LC scope base and barrel have been modified to 8-40 screws and they haven't budged a bit under my strong Colt loads. For the benefit of strength, I find that work well worth the extra cost and time away. In the future, if my barrels go to the gunsmith for any reason, that service will always be added.

Thanks, Dinny

jjas · « **Reply #18 on:** March 25, 2011, 08:48:44 PM »

You might try and contact Leupold and see if they will send you replacement parts. I needed some new screws, called customer service and they sent them to me no charge. They stand behind their products.

Darreld Walton · « **Reply #19 on:** March 26, 2011, 04:37:49 PM »

I just had to check my old K2.5 Weaver in Weaver rings. No problem, but then, I'm only shooting 500 grainers in it.

Troyboy · « **Reply #20 on:** March 27, 2011, 03:29:07 PM »

I had t/c qd rings break the crossbolts as well. Not in my 500 though it was on my .308

gcrank1 · « **Reply #21 on:** March 27, 2011, 03:34:10 PM »

Ive never had a problem with the old Weaver rings or bases, and most of my scopes are El Paso Weavers, from the B series on up. Nice glass, and used to be cheap, but the past couple of years they have spiked in price at the gun shows.

cwlongshot · « **Reply #22 on:** March 27, 2011, 03:49:56 PM »

Quote from: gcrank1 on March 27, 2011, 03:34:10 PM

Ive never had a problem with the old Weaver rings or bases, and most of my scopes are El Paso Weavers, from the B series on up. Nice glass, and used to be cheap, but the past couple of years they have spiked in price at the gun shows.

I have personally had two Weaver ring failures. Both where late 70's to early 80's era rings. Both broke thru the cross bolt. Neither would have broken if steel. This is what moved me to Burris ZEE rings. Leupold's where bought when I found them and I liked what I saw. Wide and beefy. I noticed the cross bolt, but didn't really think it would fail this way. BUT the 500 with heavy bullets does thump more than the average of other calibers.

But again, altho the ring failed, I look more to the design of the base as the bigger contributing factor in that failure. The entire center of the base offers nothing to support the recoil stop/cross pin.

CW

gcrank1 · « **Reply #23 on:** March 27, 2011, 04:13:50 PM »

Im thinkin' that if a 500 ever comes home that it will get the peep rear too. I wouldnt be needing it as a long range rifle anyway (but, hey, Ive got that .727 Overkill (12ga. slug-gun) with open sights, so why would I need a little 500?

v8r · « **Reply #24 on:** March 28, 2011, 03:55:06 PM »

just because it says Leupold doesn't mean it's the best thing since sliced bread.

I typically use Burris products myself. Every product I have purchased from Burris has been a high quality product at a reasonable price. Believe me I am not hating on Leupold, and I have used some of their products, but in my opinion Burris makes the best scope rings for a Weaver base (Zee rings), and the best scopes for the money out there.

Couger · « **Reply #25 on:** March 29, 2011, 06:33:56 AM »

Quote from: jjas on March 25, 2011, 08:48:44 PM

You might try and contact Leupold and see if they will send you replacement parts. I needed some new screws, called customer service and they sent them to me no charge. They stand behind their products.

My gosh! Incredible about that piece failing. But give Leupold a chance to fix it!

Thanks for sharing and the pics CWL.

6x6 elk · « **Reply #26 on:** March 30, 2011, 05:30:33 AM »

Leupold has great customer service, I would not be surprised to see them replace the entire ring set. I had my previous 500 S&W handirifle bend the bases due to the recoil.

gcrank1 · « **Reply #27 on:** March 30, 2011, 06:32:36 AM »

Short of buying a new rail with complete support for the ring recoil lug I think I would whittle a nice block of mild steel to fit in the rail saddle and D/T down into the rail.

cwlongshot · « **Reply #28 on:** March 30, 2011, 07:24:45 AM »

Quote from: gcrank1 on March 30, 2011, 06:32:36 AM

Short of buying a new rail with complete support for the ring recoil lug I think I would whittle a nice block of mild steel to fit in the rail saddle and D/T down into the rail.

That would work!!!

6x6 elk · « **Reply #29 on:** March 31, 2011, 07:33:49 AM »

You may need to go with a 1 piece base/rings like the Tally or Dead-Nutz?